WRTT642

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Your point ? I said in the past I was a ham, and for many years. Just because I'm a ham doesn't mean anything. Its a service I use for a specific purpose. GMRS was never the place to be a "ham" until as of late. That's what this thread was started about. But some folks as your self can't understand the difference between the services. 
And as reference the ham came to me because I maintain many public safety and business license and am in the FCC system daily doing updates. You do realize some folks actually have paying careers in RF right ? 
 

I'm game. It will have to be in a couple weeks though. I have a A LOT of stuff going on right now, but maybe sometime mid February? That should be enough time for everybody to think about it and get it planned. What do you think?

Early January 2022 here in Alaska we had a horrible winter storm that knocked out power to thousands as well as cell service to some, I lost heat, power, and cell service in my area for 3 days and I was completely unprepared. I have four children my youngest was 10 months old at the time. After that happened I promised myself I will never let that happen again. I then stared going down the "prepper" road and doing research on the subject. This is when I first learned about GMRS. 
When I Youtubed GMRS the first video to pop up was NOTARUBICON and his videos on GMRS. I took it all in and began taking the steps to get my license. I then watched a video with him and Josh at HAM RADIO CRASH COURSE talking about GMRS and Amateur radio. Then I found Jason at HAMRADIO 2.0 along with this website and ARRL and Radio Reference etc. 
The biggest thing that drew me into Randy, Josh, and Jason was that I could identify with all three in them as far as age, family/young children, similar interest, and their ability to explain everything rather simply and with some comedic relief. I have now since received my tech license (KL5LD) and I give full credit to Josh and Jason because their YouTube channels and the information they provided helped me tremendously in passing my test as well as taking a class with Bob Phinney over at New England Sci-Tech, Thanks again Bob (K5TEC)!
I now have both GMRS and amateur radios that I use everyday, and I enjoy using both. With family it is mostly GMRS, while my kids are studying for their tech license and I for my general and with ham it is mostly for the entertainment of listening to all the old timers gripe at each other over ALLSTAR LINK on the the east coast repeater, it is quite hilarious to me personally (I'm just kidding guys), but there are also some really solid guys out here in Alaska that I have met over ham and they have been extremely kind and helpful in so many ways I couldn't even begin to list them. Heck, just a couple weeks ago my family and I got invited to a local clubs pot luck and gift exchange for Christmas when I was trying to find info during another horrible winter storm we just had before Christmas(It was pretty bad)! Yet, when I have talked to people over GMRS it is pretty straight forward, kinda like having a conversation with somebody in person. I'm going to be honest and say that I have been meeting more and more people in my area that have GMRS radios and they just use them. No license, no call signs, no codes or other things of that sort. It is just people out and about enjoying the great outdoors and using their radios as a means to communicate because there are many areas within our state where there is very shotty cell reception if at all and using these radios are literally life savers for people. 
This past September I went Moose hunting with my son and we ran across a bunch of guys using GMRS radios and when talking with them I would bring up the whole license issue and they all just laughed at me as if that was actually a thing. I guess up here in Alaska a lot of people just have a different mentality about how they utilize this tool. Everybody gets along great with no issues that I have ever heard of and it seems to be a growing "hobby" for us up here with new repeaters popping up, which is great!
Sorry for the long winded comment, but with all that being said I guess it is different in each region and how people are using GMRS and ham. Down in the states you guys seem to be using it for, well, the reasons you have stated, but up here in Alaska, in what I have seen and experienced, we are not using it as simply a "hobby" (this is not to say you guys are "just" using it for the same reason) to meet new friends, I feel it is much more than that, it is literally a life line. It is a way for us to stay connected to each other during our rough winters when the power goes out and its -20 outside, it is a way to communicate while out in the bush chasing down a 1,200 lbs moose to fill our freezers for the year, it is a way to tell the guy further down the river to get ready, the salmon are coming, it is a way to tell our family and friends to watch for that bear out in the tree line with her cubs while out picking blueberries, from what I have seen up here in the Great North it is much much more. And who am I to tell anybody how to use their radios? I'm just another voice over the waves. To each their own. Be safe and respectful, have fun, and watch your six.     

We have 2 repeaters for our SAR group based on portables. Both use modified ICOM handhelds (Swapped MX antenna jack for BNC Jack from ham radio. I used a very small duplexer made for 15 watts or less. They are controlled with a vox style controller that plug into the mic jacks. Battery eliminators on all radios with a 3AH Gel Cell mounted in the pelican case. VHF is 2.3 watts out to the antenna on high power. UHF is 3 watts out to the antenna. They work as intended but if they sold the RT97 at the time I would have ordered it. 
Both are in a small pelican case. That was part of our use case. We have a portable mast with 25' of LMR400 and Unity Gain antenna for each. 2 guys can walk up a trail with the case, antenna and cable and set it up on a hill to give us that extra range. It doesn't get used all the time, but the location it was built for works well. We are primarily VHF so the power is not perfect but is better than hauling our big repeater up to a site with a 6 wheeler. The UHF has only been used for training. Works good, but as said if I had the RT or Midland option at that point I would have gotten those. 
In the end we have about $1000 per Pelican Case. The radios were purchased on state contract for $299 each, Duplexer was $100, repeater controller was 100 and another $200 in battery, RF jumpers, bulkhead mount and charger for battery. We went with the ICOM LMR radio because we use public safety band, and to be honest they are way better than any CCR you will try. The receiver on the ICOM is very hot and is very narrow to the band in use.

I'll have to dig for final pictures but here was the pictures from our "trial" unit. Pretty much all is the same other than we replaced the connectors on the ICOM with BNC (it was an orderable part from them) vs the adapter we used on this unit. For this one that was VHF that basically the only change we made. The UHF has a similar duplexer but in silver. That really the only way to know them apart without turning on the radios. I'd have to dig for the parts list as this was done back in 2013. 

 

Cool, thanks!  That's good enough; you don't need to dig for a BOM.
 

I would be right in the intersection of all of the circles. I haven't used CB in years. The last time was when I had to do a lot of business travel for the company and drove to customer sites. The van, I had at the time, looked like something out of the X-Files with the antennas on it. It was fun hearing the truckers on 19 make comments about it as I drove by.
I even had a guy driving in circles around it in a parking lot as I came out of a carry out pizza joint one day. Turned out it was a fellow Ham. He couldn't figure out what the small square horizontal loop was for. I explained it was for 2 meter sideband. At the time I had a Icom IC-706MKIIG rig in the van which did FM,AM and sideband on 6M, 2M and 70cm.
https://www.icomamerica.com/en/products/amateur/hf/706/specifications.aspx
https://www.m2inc.com/FG2MHOLOOP

Roadrunner Beep. Beep Beep!

Thank you for all of the input.
The main reason for my original question was to verify that Roger Beeps are not the new EMP in the radio world. I understand and respect that some like it and others hate it, but thankfully it’s still a free Country that we can still make our own choices.
I personally don’t care if I use the Roger Beep or not on this persons repeater. It just so happened that the particular radio that I was using for my very first interaction on GMRS had the Roger Beep enabled. I don’t mind turning it off. I just don’t like someone, who by the way is just another user not the owner of the repeater, feeding me a line of B.S. for the sake of getting me to disable it.  If I wanted to be manipulated by people spoon feeding me crap I’d get into politics.
I will say that after listening to repeater traffic for the past few weeks that I somewhat like the Roger Beep for the sake of knowing when the transmission is complete. There are a few people that keep their radio keyed while they’re thinking and many times when that happens several other people try to key up.
I am in the process of getting my own repeater up and running due to the fact that there are none in my immediate area. (The repeater that I currently access is just barely in range.) And when I do set it up I’m going to use my Roger Beep. I’m looking forward to the first person telling me that I need to shut it off so as not to ruin the repeater. And as far as gay truck drivers looking to meet up because of my Roger Beep……. Well, thats why we have German Shepherds. 
I will provide public access to my repeater because I’m generally a nice guy.  If people boycott my repeater because I use a Roger Beep; I really don’t care. The main reason for my repeater is for family communication.

?
Not sure if anyone will buy that.

Sounds like an urban legend intended to frighten people away from using roger beeps.  
How about this? If you use a roger beep, just tell people it’s a Quindar tone used to turning on your remote relay stations. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quindar_tones ?
 

LOL. Cant wait to see the responses to this one. This is gonna be fun.
I agree with you to a point. I am licensed for both amateur and GMRS and I use both quite a bit, some days one more than the other, and I can see what you are saying to an extent. I have made some great relationships with some really solid guys on ham and there are some really great people that are doing some really good work on expanding the capabilities of amateur radio, BUT with that being said I have been doing a lot of digital work lately and I can say that I have also came across some really, umm, how do I say this nicely, "sad hams" as they are so called. People who are angry for unknown reasons and are quick to "correct" you and have really bad attitudes for no apparent reason. I have also come across some guys that were clearly intoxicated and were a bit of a nuisance, but they usually get called out really quick by other more experienced guys.
GMRS is great are there are some really cool people on their as well, but I don't see the two being equivalent, they both are tools to use for the job that needs to be done. So far my experience with GMRS over the air has been fine and haven't had any issues with the few people I have come across on it, they have all been respectful and nice. So I think it is just a numbers game. You meet way more people over a greater distance on amateur than you do on GMRS. I can not speak on CB as I have never personally used it, but I have heard stories. 
Both are great, I have had more issues with people being "sad hams" on amateur than I have had issues over GMRS, but that simply is because I have talked to a lot more random people over ham than GMRS. I am sure there are jerks in GMRS too, I just haven't met them. Yet, lol. Thanks for the post.

I call BULLSHIT - just another Sad-HAM disguised as a GMRS user.  YOUR radio YOUR choice - if the sad-HAM control freaks dont like it, they can change the channel..  
HOWEVER - as you mentioned, if the repeater owner requests that you not use a roger-beep on his repeater, then following the wishes of the equipment owner who's equipment you are using would be the polite thing to do, IMO..

I find they are irritating but they do serve a purpose. Using a repeater with a long hang time and several participating in a round table discussion the Roger Beep lets everyone know the repeater is available for the next guy to key up to use. Some repeaters use a "courtesy tone" for this but many don't. I've stepped on others and had the same happen to me, you're not sure the other guy is finished talking or just pausing for a few seconds before continuing. 

I have no idea how it could be destructive.  I understand that “some people” find them annoying — that’s obvious from @gortex2‘s reply — but destructive?  I don’t see how.  I agree with you that the repeater owner definitely has the last say, but I also think there’s little to gain by joining a repeater and right away doing something that irritates many or most of the other users. I would listen to hear if others use roger beeps and then follow the community norm, just to keep the peace, especially if you hope to talk with any of them on the air.

I can understand why some people seem to be put off by Ham radio. It's more of a technical hobby and attracts these type of people. When you have a group like that it's inevitable there will be egos and attitudes on display. It seems to be associated often with people in technical areas. You should sit in some engineering design review meetings if you think the on air stuff is brutal! 
Hams are also very protective of their "turf". When you consider how much spectrum they have free access to and allowed power they have a lot to loose if the FCC gets a bug up their back side. That's not counting the commercial interests that look at Ham radio spectrum as "easy picking" when they petition the FCC for spectrum for their new service they want to roll out. It's basically a non stop assault. The ARRL even has a special spectrum defense fund, and people, dedicated to just this issue.
I agree with your point about GMRS being a middle ground.  It's low pressure and the only cost of entry is a cheap radio and $35 for the license. No tests, CW etc. thus nothing to brag about or try to use as a right of passage. Other than the frequent questions about antennas, coax and installation/programming issues one can "buy a box" and setup a functioning system fairly quickly. GMRS is far friendlier for non technical people to use. 
MURS isn't that popular since not many are aware of it and the lack of extensive equipment to use. Not having access to repeaters doesn't help either. I'm going to guess many people who do use it are employing old Part 90 VHF radios reprogrammed to meet the frequency and bandwidth requirements. I'll also wager those radios are running more than the allowed 2 watts, likely in the 5 watt range since that's typical for Part 90 VHF HT's.
CB radio seems to have gotten a bit better since the 70's and early 80's. Even so some people won't turn on the CB if they have their little kids in the car.  No licenses, no accountability and mostly no FCC enforcement are mainly responsible for the present state of CB radio. If people aren't careful GMRS could end up the same way.     

In the Pacific Northwest, pretty much every major city has GMRS repeaters, often linked via Internet, or some amateur group with a UHF repeater in use. UHF is virtually saturated, and 900 MHz ISM band radios even proliferated for a while to get away from the FRS/GMRS and commercial UHF crowd. It often hampers or assists in my testing of Radio over Internet Protocol kits I build for my employer, to be sent around the country to link sites to a "Global Security Operations Center" in a central location. 
Having amateur, GMRS and commercial licenses means that I am on several forums, to include this one. This forum has a nice welcome feel to it, but also some of the same issues other sites have.....one upmanship, and sometimes outright arguments, but also a great deal of information from people that actually use their equipment. In my own experience, I would rather see pictures posted o people using their gear, posting to forums, making contact with other users. On that note, local GMRS community and forums like this help a lot. Especially after the FCC changes to GMRS in 2017, more people have become licensed (and not having to take a test probably helps with this). The fact that an entire family can use the same call sign, cost of license (now anyway, I paid $70), and being valid for ten years, means GMRS and my local community has grown its footprint a bit. 
I agree that GMRS appears to be a middle ground between the chaos with AM CB and amateur radio, with a bit more inclusivity in forums and users within the community. A much larger radio related site I frequent often results in arguments about how some commercial gear should be set up, HAM radio "police" dictating the legality of everything, and an attitude that if you do not know as much as someone else, you should stay away. It should also be noted that many communities that have Community Emergency Response Teams (CERT), often begin their training with blister pack FRS/GMRS radios (pre-2017 style radios), which was a great introduction to radio use in emergencies and within their respective communities. 

In my area, there is no GMRS community; my time on this forum is my closest thing to a GMRS community.  There is a small community of hams and they’re completely different than the “clipboard and khakis“ crowd. I’ve found them to be very welcoming and easy going, but I also understand that may be different elsewhere.  I’ve never been a CB user, other than non-licensed walkie-talkies fifty years ago.
Find the group that you fit and enjoy.

The FCC keeps rejecting my application for a MURS license!  

GMRS on linked repeaters sometimes starts to sound like ham.
GMRS does have the offroad crowd adding to its overall popularity and the corresponding equipment demand, which is probably a good thing.  And Midland may not be everyone's favorite but at least they're bringing people in, and their everything-in-the-mike units sure are nice for many vehicles, although I wish they also had named channels and such.
 

Someone sent me a message today that when they called the FCC to see why it wasnt working, the FCC lady said they were having "system problems" and do not know when it will be fixed - but she was able to email invoice to him so he was able to pay for his license.

Let me say thank you for all you do. I became a premium member shortly after joining because personally I felt like I was stealing from you guys with as much resources you have on here. All the help and info I have received on this site and then even being able to start a page for my state has been great. We have some really good guys up here in Alaska and they are really getting us caught up with the rest of the states which I am so grateful for. I don't mind volunteering and helping you with whatever you need, but I don't know how much help I can be still being so new to radios, but I'm always willing to help others if I can. Thank you again sir!

Yes, range will definitely help. In a previous life, I used VHF comms for oil spill cleanup operations, then UHF was for a "command net" which was slightly shorter range, not FRS/GMRS but there were many that brought their own radios that were FRS/GMRS (pre-2017 changes). 
I would only like to see FRS/GMRS compatible unit as it would augment what I already have, lots of Garmin Rino's. Thank you for sharing the links, I may have to save my pennies for more toys to use with my other toys.

I've alwasy been a garmin fan. Have a ton of their stuff also. I think the MURS is actually good for riders. Your going to get further than FRS and its used less than FRS right now. I added one to my wish list for the Jeeps.