ASRM
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Posts posted by ASRM
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I see one of our members commented as did I. It amazes me at the amount of bad information people seem to put on the web, and thus continuing the problem. Too bad you can't flag crap like her's for illegal advise.
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GMRS is only licensable by individuals, period. An individual's "family" does not extend to anyone outside even that generously defined extended family.
Just to add substance (if needed) to what N4GIX just mentioned, here is that FCC reg that clarifies or states such.
47 CFR
§ 95.5 Licensee eligibility.
(a) An individual (one man or one woman) is eligible to obtain, renew, and have modified a GMRS system license if that individual is 18 years of age or older and is not a representative of a foreign government.(
A non-individual (an entity other than an individual) is ineligible to obtain a new GMRS system license or make a major modification to an existing GMRS system license (see§ 1.929 of this chapter).however, companies in the PAST used to be able to be licensed under GMRS. you can do a search on the FCC database and see this be the case where a company name will show up, however, all that i have seen are long long since expired.I pretty much figured that, I think whomever had posted that (I want to say at RR) must have been quoting older rules.
Thanks for the clarification. I run a non-profit (Australian Shepherd dog rescue) in about 3 states and currently run them on Itinerant for events (all portable). I was like wow, would that save some $$$'s.
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Most commercial radio manufacturers recommend grounding to the frame near the battery. Now, with the advent of the super high tech computer systems running everything in our cars and trucks, installers are finding that grounding the radio to the battery negative terminal is causing all kinds of havoc with the vehicle power control systems. Latest and best recommendation now is to ground at the point on the frame where the battery's grounding strap connects. It eliminates potential ground loops and yet satisfies the most finicky computer system.
Any recommendations on this subject that are more than a couple of years old are pretty much based on non-computer controlled automotive systems. If doing an install on a new or very recent model year vehicle, the old thinking has to be set aside. I know hams have pushed grounding to the battery negative terminal for many, many years, but it's going to have to change or we'll all be dealing with a new set of problems.
We run PM400's in the vehicles, I ran positive to the battery and ran my ground to the frame near the battery. No engine noise at all. I do on occasion get some noise near an older car at a stoplight, but that is on a signal at S1 or so.
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Thanks, Jerry - Sounds as if that system might have more usable range than the local Sheriff's system... but, that is common with many GMRS systems.
Isn't that amazing? I know ours out does most of the Public Safety systems around us (we even cover better at 10 miles from the site than theirs do with the repeater in the town or county), I am shocked at times that some shops don't feel this is an officer safety issue. Makes you wonder if there is something more to it, though I can understand ERP and restrictions placed that Part 90 and PS deal with that we GMRS folks are not restricted with.
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BROWNK89
I almost bought those little 350's but honestly for the price if you can find a repeater in your area, and it works well with portables I would instead go to eBay or do a search online for used commercial gear. You can find excellent deals on used Moto commercial portables for $40 each and on up, some will have a charger, maybe even a decent battery. Most of the eBay sellers will program them before shipping them out. Also the Maxon 4450SC's are some of the best deals on GMRS, they should be had for $40+ programmed and then just get a decent antenna. They are 16 channels at 40 watts. Again you can grab Moto mobiles for less than $100 ea or even less (MaxTrac's are a dime a dozen).
I started out buying on eBay and am not sorry one bit, from there I met folks, some here and on another message board that have sold me gear at great prices and helped me a lot. I eventually got in good with a 2way shop in my area and bought new gear at almost used prices as well as now work there, you would be amazed at what some shops have sitting collecting dust and they would probably sell for a few $10 bills
I know our shop has hundreds of wideband gear equipment that will work fine on GMRS.
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Also, many GMRS repeaters require permission from the owners and/or paid membership.
Sent from my LG-D631 using Tapatalk
Can't be stressed enough, I know some feel a repeater is there for the using, myself and our shop feel differently. Ask, I may or may not give permission, we tend to allow other repeater operators as a sharing basis, we all have some skin in the game. I have heard some simplex users for the most part CB'ing it, cussing, talking things I would not want rebroadcast and have a hard time allowing them on.
JWILKERS is right, get permission, if they don't answer then that is the answer you seek. In our area there are repeaters on almost all the GMRS channels, some are open with travel tone, some are closed. I have always asked, those that don't allow I completely respect.
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We had some ducting on our repeater were about 100 miles away a user was hitting our repeater at full quieting with a 10 watt mobile on a mag mount 1/4 wave on top a fridge. It was super clear for about half an hour, so in a way you are seeing skip, but not like you would on 10-11 or the other HF frequencies.
Something to keep in mind is just cause you hear a repeater on GMRS doesn't mean you have access. You should acquire permission, lately on ours, since it reaches 30-40 miles on mobile in every direction we have had some people coming on and wanting to talk. We use digital tone squelch and you would have to be trying the various tones to gain access. To me that is pirating and not using a travel tone (which we don't do).
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Someone posted on a Yahoo GMRS list that Non-Profits could also operate, I am pretty sure that is not the case. I wish I could find that post.
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Installed if you did not see it in my other post.
NICE!
I was able to score a used 408 the other day, not sure what to do with it besides hang on to.
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I am late to the party, but I had a similar setup as you N4GIX
About 40 foot to the base of the mast, tip of antenna was around 52 feet. Portables were full quiet at 1-2 miles, usable at 3-4 depending.
Mobile was about double that to 20 miles in places. Used a Comet 172 and 1/2 hardline on a Vertex VXR7000 pumping 38 watts (we turned it down since I run a 6 second hangtime) and saw 32+ watts out the duplexer (celwave like yours it sounds, we bench tested and desense was fine).
We are on top of a pretty high ridge over looking a river valley. It was sporadic on decent coverage.
We ended up going on a commercial tower at 220 feet, day and multiple nights difference. In speaking to a local ham over the weekend, even if I returned to my original site and went 80 to 100 feet I don't feel my issues with holes will go away.
I did find a tool online, don't recall where that let me plot elevation obstacles between my site and various locations. What I thought was a line of sight to different areas revealed a lot of high spots and dips that effectively created fresnels on my coverage which revealed to me that no matter what I did, I had to get height to get reliable coverage. My next debate is adding a few voting receivers to listen in the valleys were the 220 hits TX but has poor RX on portable (really just for fun)
Good luck, I find these new setups and improvements to be very informative.
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N4gix
I read the filings, it was a real eye opener on just how much of a struggle it seems we have to get the ear of the FCC. Mr. Knowles is spot on with his filings. I encourage everyone to read those documents.
Again thanks for the link.
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It all depends on site management and the territory it serves. Here in New York City the install costs at some locations could run you $5000 plus the monthly because you have to factor in the cost of liability insurance as well as the fee for the climbers to mount your antenna and route your feedline. Also, most well organized sites have minimum equipment requirements I.E. You're not going to get away with 2 mobile radios and a cheap duplexer/antenna. You've got to coexist with the other customers at the site so quality equipment is a must. Again it is all location specific...
RFMedic is right, not just the sites needs, but in a heavy RF environment you might see a lot of desense happening, effectively making your repeater deaf.
I would if looking also consider the other services on the site and the amount of activity it has.
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I sure wouldn't want mine living under my roof.
- mainehazmt, dvespucci, Durake and 2 others
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5
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Line of sight. UHF in the 460 range is roughly LOS range plus 5-10%.
Money is better spent on receivers, antennas and location versus power amplifiers.
Coming from a guy who's shooting 500 mW 19 miles at 5.5 GHz and still delivering 60 Mbps over it…
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Thanks for that. Very interesting.
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We just relocated from our little 30 foot mast with an effective 40 foot height to a commercial tower site at 220 feet. Yearly costs for mine are $1200 a year (which is probably cheap) with the site at one of 3 of the highest spots in the 4 county area. I was lucky that there was an open slot with an antenna already in place. It's on the east side of the tower which is not optimal for me, but oddly covers like a glove for my area of operation. Portables that are 10-15+ miles from the repeater are quieted outside and probably an S2-3 in a basement of aluminum sided house at same distance. Mobiles are like S5.
Moving our site to the new location was day and night for coverage. I would say you would want to evaluate what your true coverage needs are, our original system was covering 90% of my AO mobile and 50% portable, something I could live with, my choice was place a 70 foot tower and probably get 100% coverage mobile and 70% portable, again something that I could live with. I was fortunate that I work at the shop were the 220 slot is at.
In our area we have repeaters placed throughout the area and were technically afforded 100% coverage even on handhelds as long at the control radio could hit them all. So investing in your system I would see what your options are and if alternate sites will meet your needs before investing a lot of money into tower space, unless you are Corey and should be playing the lottery with his luck
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I blame the bubblepack manufactures for the misleading use of PL/DPL on FRS.
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Search eBay for Vertex VXR-7000's or the Kenwoods, both are decent repeaters. I was on the more watts, better range but honestly you will realize little difference between 20 and 40 watts. I was able to snag a 7000 with duplexer for $700. It looks new and no scratches or anything.
I was using the same antenna as you on the comet (if I had to do it again I would go Laird 6DBD instead as it's better built. I have heard bad reviews though?)
We went with 60 feet of 1/2 heliax and mounted on a 30 foot telescopic pole and 10 foot above the porch for a 40 foot height. Our range was okay but knew I needed to get 60-80 feet up to get over the pines and trees once they leaf out. I expected my coverage would suffer come this summer.
But to be honest it gave us about 90% coverage with mobile for our AO and receive on portables to know we were calling each other.
Height is going to be the best thing you can do (Zap and others have drilled that into me) and they are right. Look into the highest point in your area and then see if you can get 60-80 feet up from there. You won't be sorry. If you know of any HAM's with a tall tower you might try to get space on their tower, but use a more commercial grade antenna (the Comet is not a long term solution IMO).
Enjoy though, GMRS as a communications tool is great, I am slowly getting my daughter and family as well as brother on my repeater and looking to get some good friends as well (with a license of course) to also get on the system. Our system is for SHTF and backup/cost savings on cell phones. AND for FUN!
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I have been a ham for a 1/4 century, trying to get the wife licenses, she isnt having any part of it. So I picked up a GMRS license, but pricing FCC accepted GMRS radios and gets spendy, its frustrating when I have loads of ham radio gear on hand. Oh well, lead a horse to water, but cant make her drink. ;D
Happy Wife / Happy Life (Rules to live by)
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Andy
I have bought gear, repeater w/duplexer, mobiles and old Astro Saber portables all from eBay, excellent experience (Used Radios.Com) and was not sorry.
We sell used and new radio gear on eBay and pride ourselves in doing right by the buyer. That doesn't mean there are people out to take advantage. What I see more of is people selling gear with no idea what they have or are selling, VHF radios that are really 800 mhz radios and visa versa. Look at the model ID's and research the actual ID to what the radio is, BatLabs if getting a Motorola, Google other models. A seller should be showing the model ID so you know what you are getting or at the least list the model.
If you are ripped off eBay is always in favor as is PayPal of the buyer and not the seller.
You could check with radio shops in your area and see what they have, but many will just toss them or move them to a liquidator and avoid the hassle of selling used gear and deal with the buyers sometimes over-inflated expectations (I know the Motorola shop in our area stated as much).
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N4gix
It's early so forgive me. Are you saying that a Part 90 cert is automatically carried to 95? Or is that visa versa?
If it's 90 is good for 95 then maybe all the commotion on 95 only radios can finally be put to rest. That old Mac vs PC thing
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Antenna Porn
Andrew DB408-B
180' of 7/8 Hard line
4' Side arm
Now all I need is some good weather, my climber and a few friends!
Kudo's!
We moved to a commercial site (I work there and he has an open spot) at 220 feet. I was originally 40 feet and sketchy, now I can hit portable at S3 when mobile was in the noise floor. Even in basements and inside a home with aluminum siding. Coverage is actually better then 2 county PD's have coverage.
Love that 408!
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I can personally echo what everyone else has suggested. We are using a Vertex VXR-7000 (they can be had for around $700 on ebay with a duplexer) running 30 watts out the duplexer.
Original location was our home at 40 Feet above the ground, range was okay, it covered 90% of what we wanted (about 15 miles on mobile and 5 miles depending on portable).
We relocated to a commercial site at 220 feet. Now I find were mobile was sketchy at best, portable is like an S3 (some hiss in the background) and this is in basements or 12 miles from the repeater in an aluminum sided house.
We are running 7/8 hardline, 10dbd collinear omni but mount on the east side of a tower (which is not towards my optimum coverage want (I would probably be shocked at a pattern that covered what I wanted)
Long story short, height, height and more height. Little 20 watt repeaters at his location on the tower scream!
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Our shop has a slew of the Laird's (10+ in stock), I am thinking about using one for our new 675 repeater that we hope will go up in a month or 2, after the new tower and my experimental build of a Johnson PPL6000. I have been hearing really good things on the Laird's.
GMRS interaction with Law Enforcement
in General Discussion
Posted
I like the idea, but the problem is with the bootleggers that snag onto a repeater, the unlicensed users that don't know radio protocol or a host of other reasons.
Do we want a 911 dispatcher monitoring the rag chewer?
Having a mutual aid type channel would be a great idea. I know from experience though it's a pretty tough sell.
We have a UHF repeater that 30-40 miles at almost full quiet for the sheriff department, I personally have tested it in our county for a couple months, along with the deputies for coverage. It is a near "perfect" system (I am placing my Part 90 Repeater at the same height and power) and yet we can't get the county to sign off on it and make it official for a mutual aid system. All the departments in the county are on UHF, all have discussed a need to reachout to county and other agencies, ISPERN doesn't allow certain comms that the MA channel would provide.
If someone does initiate such a program, I would be VERY interested in how they got it approved.