RoadApple

Yeah, you are exactly right! I heard that proclamation/warning and chose to ignore it. I'm not a radio purist so as long as it works reasonably well, I don't really concern myself with all the technical perfection (usually only detectable with test equipment). The photo I posted above shows the 3rd brake light mount with a dual band 2m/70cm antenna, but most of the time I use a little 6" Tram 1126-B 1/4wave antenna. I like that little Tram because it is very low profile, and most folks do not even notice that I have an antenna up there. My SWR is 1.2:1 on my Btech 20W mobile and it works great for my real-world purposes on both GMRS and 70cm. In fact, based on my experience, I might argue that for UHF, ground plane is often over-rated. I can drive in circles, presumably transitioning between lots of ground plane (to the front) and arguably zero ground plane (to the rear) and the folks I'm talking to usually can't tell the difference. That's good enough for me!

My truck is not aluminum, so I did not have the mag-mount issue, but I wanted something more permanent. I had the same hesitation about putting a hole in the roof of my cab. I also have a retractable sunroof that limits the placement of an NMO mount and coax cabling in that narrow space between the roof and the headliner. I ended up using a 3rd brake light mounting solution. NO REGRETS. It is not cheap, but it is a very clean install that works great with no holes in your vehicle.

I agree. It likely isn't worth the extra cost. If you can still get decent range and talk to those people or repeaters that you are wanting your signal to get to, then it doesn't really matter.

Welcome, and safe travels to you!

Me Too!

Congratulations!

@jfelter Welcome to the forum

Who are we kidding here - IMHO, the whole darn GMRS thing is on the honor system. Unlicensed FRS shares channels with GMRS and just by listening nobody knows what type of radio you are using, if it is FCC type certified, or if you should be ID'ing with a GMRS license call sign, how high your antenna is, etc. etc. The lack of FCC rule enforcement sort of suggests that they think it's the honor system too! As for the OP question - It would be ethically courteous and respectful if you asked for permission, but permission being needed or required seems legally ambiguous on public airwaves, owned by none, available to all licensed GMRS users, and only regulated by FCC rules which (unlike Amateur Radio) fail to expressly address this issue. As for the comparison to trespass on real property, use of a radio repeater without permission could be categorized as Constructive Tresspass at best, and articulating harm is tricky unless the trespasser were monopolizing the repeater use or engaged in some other flagrant FCC rule violation. For all practical purposes, like it or not, if you put your repeater on a public GMRS channel/frequency, you should probably expect that the public is going to use it. You can make it inconvenient by not publishing the input tones or that the repeater even exists at all, but that is about as good as it will get. * It is like putting up your own private volleyball net on a public beach and expecting that when you are not using it, the public won't use it or that someone else's ball won't intentionally or unintentionally go over your net. Don't like it - take your net down! The FCC says that the repeater owner “may disallow the use of its GMRS repeater by specific persons as may be necessary” but the only remedy that the owner really has is to turn the repeater off as needed to restrict its use. Constantly changing tones and codes is a PITA and may be a futile game of cat and mouse. Another way to look at that specific FCC language might be for the purpose of clarifying that the repeater owner has no duty to provide that repeater to the public and that if/when the repeater owner changes the tones or turns the repeater off, for any reason, the owner is not violating anyone else's right of public use. IOW, don't file a complaint with the FCC because someone else turned their repeater off, because we don't care! I think it is to a large extent a delusional exercise in mental masturbation for a repeater owner to assert private use of their equipment when they have configured that equipment to operate on frequencies licensed for public GMRS use. CTCSS and DCS tones and codes create operational isolation between radios in close proximity, but the use of such tones or codes does not constitute any form of exclusivity. If you really need or want some form of radio privacy, get a Business or LMR license and put your repeater on those restricted license frequencies where you have a reasonable expectation of the private use of your equipment... I offer my opinion free of charge, and it is worth every penny!

So, let me see if I have this right. The "legal use" of 467Mhz simplex is all about the devices on each end of the communication as that determines if you are classified as a "Fixed Station". Seems to be a fluid definition.... When the radio in my house is being used to communicate with the radio in your house, we can call ourselves "Fixed Stations" and transmit simplex on 467Mhz. But if a mobile or handheld popped up (simplex) on the same 467Mhz frequency and tried to contact us they would be in violation. Likewise, if either one of us "Fixed Stations" failed to ignore that person's transmissions and communicated with that mobile or handheld (intentional or not), we would by virtue of that action, change our classification from a "Fixed Station" to a "Base Station" and would thus also be in violation for using 467Mhz simplex.

Oh, I see it now. Thanks! Interesting carve out for "Fixed Stations". Was there a specific reason for this exception to the repeater input clause or was it simply an omission in the text?

I'm not sure about that. I believe I recall reading that the 467Mhz frequencies are for repeater input only and simplex use is not allowed.

I watched the YT video on the Retevis RT97L 25W repeater ( Thank you @OffRoaderX ! ). Unless I'm misunderstanding things, the video indicated that this repeater is intended for "lite use" and suggest that it may not have the duty cycle or capacity to serve as an open use general repeater. The spec sheet says it has a "Transmitter Duty Cycle of 100%". What does that really mean, and has anyone out there done any serious real-world general use testing with this specific repeater?

I can't add much that hasn't already been stated except, welcome to the Forum!!!!

You are no doubt correct. The ham tests can be intimidating to some people. There really is a very, very, low barrier to entry in GMRS and no barrier at all for FRS. Honestly, the folks in the local amateur radio club near me have thus far been very friendly and welcoming. I've not met him yet, but I understand that there is a high school student in the club, so that is a positive sign... Still the majority of the membership seems overwhelmingly north of 60.

I'm on the South Coast between Gaviota and Santa Barbara, south of the Santa Ynez mountain range. If I drive out of the canyon and get out by Hwy 101, I can sometimes hear repeater traffic from way over in Ventura and even LA across the water. Nothing to my north. I've checked the maps, and I've monitored all GMRS channels for hours with only a little occasional simplex traffic here and there getting into the canyon where I live. If you are aware of some dormant repeater with high enough elevation on the south coast, to get a signal into these canyons, I'd love to know about it!