mrgmrs

I have also added (by editing) the following new item to the running list of my Sept. 2 entry, located earlier above. HTs should be designed so they can sit vertically on end without tipping over. Without mentioning names, I'm aware of at least two HTs made by two manufacturers which are tippy when set on a table. Slightly brushing them makes them fall down, which can illicit some of the seven words that George Carlin stated cannot be said over the air. Note that the aforementioned radios are prone to tipping due to their ends having a rounded style with nubs added in an insufficient attempt to provide standing stability. BTW, the two manufacturers involved are in the top-tier of 2-way radio manufacturers. As Randy from NotaRubicon might say, "For the love of Xenu, don't make tippy radios."

Note: This post was not meant to be a question. Rather, its intent was to provide information especially for folks new to 2-way radio. There is no question to answer.

This may be of help to folks new to 2-way radios... Randy from youtube channel NotaRubicon created a video which explains all of the menu options for a Baofeng UV-5R radio. Most likely other Baofeng radios share most/all of these settings. Other, including non-Baofeng, radios utilize similar menu options, though their names may be different. The link to the video is further below. If nothing else, newbies may appreciate a video in which the options are stepped through visually/verbally rather than reading about them. Not to mention that Chinese radio manuals don't necessarily do a good job of explaining things. Note: In the video, Randy made a mistake. He said he personally likes to set option #23 BCL to on. He meant to say off. He explained this in the text when you expand the video's title. Note that Randy likes to needle "sad hams" (e.g., contentious hams who leave snarky comments). As such, his mention of turning the roger beep option to on was said tongue in cheek.

MichaelLAX, thanks for your detailed comments. Somewhere (review on Amazon? comments on NotaRubicon's video?), somebody also mentioned a question about where the save feature stores files. I wonder if the files are saved in a default app/folder on the phone. For example, iPhone has a "Files" app/folder. I assume there is an equivalent on other phones.

Randy of YouTube channel NotaRubicon released the following video (link below) recently. It discusses a new product: the TIDRadio BL-1 Bluetooth Wireless CPS Programmer. It's a dongle which supports programming certain radios without the need for a PC or programming cable. For the small list of radios it supports currently, you plug the dongle in the radio and using an app on your smartphone you program the radio. I assume the list of supported radios might grow over time. Also, though it appears to support the Baofeng UV-5R, that might be for the base model and not all variants currently. Also, I have no idea how good this device is at this point (e.g., are there significant bugs?). If interested, do your own homework. If anyone has obtained this device and used it, please give us your feedback.

MichaelLAX, you're explanation of desense, and especially the difference between simplex and repeater behavior in that context, is very well written.

As you can see by the replies, interpretations/opinions are divided. As a reminder, my question was specifically regarding GMRS from a legal perspective. Before starting this post, searching the web for an answer to the question yielded no answers. Also, I had looked at the GMRS portion of the Part 95 rules, and it didn't seem to support use of one's license by a friend under normal circumstances. There was a provision for emergency use. According to Part 95.1705 subpart (c), the following people can operate a GMRS station under the authority of an individual license: + the GMRS licensee + a list of the license holder's immediate family members, defined as spouse, children, grandchildren, stepchildren, parents, grandparents, stepparents, brothers, sisters, aunts, uncles, nieces, nephews, and in-laws + anyone if necessary to communicate an emergency message + a partnership + a corporation + an association + a governmental unit Since it appears that the Part 95 rules don't support GMRS use by a friend (except for an emergency), I figured I'd create this post anyway in case anyone was aware of a rule to the contrary and could cite the rule. I also figured that other folks might search this forum for an answer to this question, so it was worth posting. Therefore, since nobody was able to cite a specific GMRS Part 95 rule which supports use by a friend, I'm going with the approach that it is not legal. Even though amateur radio makes a provision for use by a friend if the licensee acts as a control operator, this does not appear to apply to GMRS by extension. Since my question was from a strictly speaking legal perspective, that is what I wanted an answer to. If a GMRS licensee chooses to let a non-licensed friend transmit on the holder's license, this appears to be illegal based on everything I've seen in the GMRS portion of Rule 95. Bottom line: It appears that it is illegal to let a non-licensed friend transmit under the authority of your GMRS license, except for an emergency.

I respectfully beg to differ, but it doesn't take a $500 radio to incorporate the points I've presented. Good documentation...$20 radio should have it, $500 radio should have it. And most of the other points do not involve expensive changes nor hardware changes. Most of these are cases of making simple, good decisions when programming the radio anyway. So why not do things such as not imposing an arbitrary limit regarding how many of the abundantly provided memories one can program with multiple occurrences of repeater freqs/tones? The manufacturers of the cheap line of GMRS radios have already demonstrated a willingness to adopt such changes. -- mrgmrs

I'm sure many agree... Thanks to the folks who make myGMRS.com tick. This include creators, admins, and forum repliers/readers. myGMRS.com is an enjoyable, good GMRS resource.

It is nice that a GMRS license permits its licensee to allow their immediate family members, in-laws, and some other cases to operate a GMRS radio using the license holder's call sign. But what about friends? If I'm visiting non-GMRS-licensed friends and one or more of them would like to transmit using my radio and call sign, would this be legal if done while they are in my presence? Amateur radio allows for this provision if this is done with the ham acting as a real-time control operator. But what about GMRS? If this is not legal, a handy avenue for getting potential new GMRS users interested is not open.

As I mentioned in the paragraph I inserted at the top of my original post, I created this current reply you're reading as a summary section. If/as additional points are made which could aid manufacturers and buyers, I will edit and update this same section. Here is the running list, in no particular order: • Ability to store multiple versions of a GMRS repeater frequency with different tones is good • No arbitrary limit of how many of the above can be stored • To expand on the second point immediately above, careful about designing arbitrary limits in general • Tones should be specific for each memory and not across-the-board • When designing more capable "non-bubble-pack" radios, provide wide band and narrow band capability, not narrow band only • Double check firmware before new radios are released or when updating firmware. (E.g., don't release radios with access tones or narrow band set in memories.) • Careful about proprietary designs. (E.g., naming tones with proprietary names may be ok for bubble pack radios, but for more capable radios I'd stick with naming conventions such as 107.2, D025N, etc.) • Memory banks/groups are nice • Test OEM radio programming software adequately before releasing it. These are often released with obvious, main-function bugs. It's one thing to not catch more obscure error legs, but main-function bugs should be detected and fixed during testing. • OEM programming software should support a good, 21st century UI experience, such as copy/pasting • Good documentation please. Missing, pertinent information is frustrating. So is poor English. • The ability to field program a radio (including frequencies) using its keypad and/or knobs is desirable • For mobile radios, please use a DIN style mic connector. This is the type which has a strain-relieved cable and a rotating, threaded, locking collar. This is more robust than the RJ-45 style of connector. • Attention-to-detail niceties enhance a user's experience. Examples can be found in the "Examples of Good Execution" portion of the original post. • Admittedly my personal opinion: non-bubble-pack radios should look professional/commercial rather than gimmicky • HTs should be stable (i.e., not prone to tipping over) when placed vertically on a flat surface. E.g., the end should be squared off, not rounded.

WyoJoe, thanks for the reply and providing additional insights [which echo mine] regarding the NotaRubicon channel.

Though I've mentioned this as a side item in various posts, I wanted to take the time to create a specific post to spotlight my favorite youtube channel for GMRS info, including equipment. I'm speaking of NotaRubicon Productions. The owner of that channel is a down to earth guy by the name of Randy. His channel has good things going for it: + Good Production. Good lighting. Good mics. A sense of humor. A born-to-do-this delivery ability. Aspiring YT channel stars, take note. + Good Information. The good production attributes mentioned above can help bring people into a channel and make them want to return. But that is not enough. There has to be relevant information delivered to the point. Randy does this. It's obvious that manufacturers are aware of him and the fact that he is an influencer. When Randy gives a thumbs up for a radio model, buyers snap them up. When he mentions problems with newly introduced radios, manufacturer's fix them fast. I have no connection with Randy or his YT channel. Just wanted to share a good GMRS youtube channel for those interested.

Unnecessary Limitations One head-scratcher for me is when manufacturers put unnecessary limitations in place. From the perspective of repeater users, the various manufacturers have been improving things, especially lately. For example, split tone capability appears to be the norm with the newer radios. Now let's look at the ability to store the same repeater frequencies with different tones in different memories. Not long ago, some radios didn't support this. Good news: lately this capability is becoming the norm. Kind of sort of in some cases. Though it has a large number of memories, one radio allows for only nine such extra repeater-focused memories. Why was the decision made to allow only nine? The large number of memories exist already. Why not let the radio operator use the existing memories to store as many different repeater frequency / tone combinations as needed? Correcting this does not involve anything such as a hardware change. All that is needed is to not put unnecessary limitations-by-software in place to begin with. For radios already released with such a limitation, a firmware change could remove it.

mbrun, I agree with you regarding BuyTwoWayRadio's positive role in advancing and improving GMRS. Another person who has done so is Randy from youtube channel NotaRubicon. It's obvious that GMRS manufacturers are aware of him and that he is an influencer. For example, when he mentioned nine or so issues with a recently introduced GMRS radio, the manufacturer responded and fixed the bulk of the issues with a firmware update immediately. Another good contribution is mygmrs.com. Its forum appears to be the main GMRS watering hole. The repeater database is also appreciated. Thanks for mentioning you were glad to see this thread started. I appreciate your and everyone's comments.

Memory Banks/Groups Another feature I like and use is memory banks/groups. It is nice to be able to associate certain memories in one group (e.g., home channels), another set of memories in another group (e.g., brother's home channels), etc. That way, while visiting various locations, one can switch to the group which contains the desired channels only. Among other benefits, this speeds up scanning.

BoxCar, you brought up a good point regarding the challenge of support costs for inexpensive radios. However, sometimes good design decisions upfront and quality control might prevent the need for a large return load. It also doesn't help in such return cases when manufacturers are resistant to good, inexpensive improvement suggestions. For example, years ago a CCR manufacturer released a radio with an inexpensive eprom (or some such device) with a very limited number of write cycles. If I recall, every time the radio was turned on, a write cycle occurred. A significant number of radios failed within the warranty period. Unfortunately for the American with the sole or main distributorship of that radio in the US, the manufacturer did not provide the expected warranty support. They cited custom fees to receive the returned radios as being cost prohibitive. (Somehow that translated to this being his problem.) They suggested that he hand deliver the bad radios to them in China. This is bad even if he was going to happen to visit China anyway. But what about the next batch of bad radios? According to the man's account on his web site, when he suggested an inexpensive design change, he was ignored. Due to the effort needed to replace the failing device in a surface mount board, and the fact that the device failed regularly enough, he suggested an inexpensive design change. He suggested that the manufacturer install an IC socket under the device so a replacement could be swapped out easily. As such, the warranty or even post-warranty repairs needed in the US could be done in the US. The proposed, good, inexpensive solution fell on deaf ears. Now while I'm sympathetic to the idea of not expecting premium support for an inexpensive radio, I don't believe a CCR manufacturer should be allowed to play that trump card to the nth degree. And in today's equivalent dollars, that radio was not as inexpensive as today's most inexpensive CCR radios. In my opinion, rightfully so the American decided to no longer sell that manufacturer's radio nor to continue spending his money to cover the manufacturer's warranty. Now fast forward years later. I might give that manufacturer a chance. Hopefully they learned from that experience. However, if I were to hear that this manufacturer ever did something like this again today, then in the words of a particular, outspoken Shark Tank celebrity, that manufacturer would be dead to me. My $0.02.

kb2ztx, thanks for your reply. I was not aware of the past history of GMRS radios from years ago, but it parallels that of the old ham radios of yore (e.g., dip switches to select CTCSS tones). Even so, time has marched on, and certain programming decisions and quality expectations should be the norm now. You bring up good points. Even so, my comments are applicable to even the most recent GMRS radios which were introduced say within the last month or so. For example, there is no good excuse for poor documentation of a current radio. Also, once a decision has been made to create a new radio currently, there is no good excuse regarding why manufacturers release such radios with access tones inadvertently pre-programmed into memories. The only logical conclusion is that such manufacturers do not fully understand good quality control or don't pay enough attention to it. I agree that the CCR inexpensive mentality may be contributing to this. To use the CCR radio manufacturers as an example, I have to believe that their coffers are flush due to volume of sales. If they used a small fraction of that money to hire one to three capable people to drive radio feature decisions, quality control, and good documentation, they would step up their game.

pcradio, thanks for your reply. I see you share my observations. MozartMan, even though I came up with a slightly different fix that utilized Word, I appreciate your taking the time to suggest the Notepad approach. That would have come in handy if the Word approach did not work. (It's nice to see people providing solutions rather than snarky comments.)

It was not my intention to create my original post with large font. This is my first original post rather than one I merely replied to. Due to the amount of information I wanted to convey to manufacturers which might read it, and wanting to get it right, I composed the text initially in my phone's Notes app. Then I copy/pasted it. Apparently this resulted in the original posting's large font. If necessary, I was going to rescale the font smaller using a trick and painstakingly retyping the text. However, I figured out a simpler technique which bypassed the need for the re-typing. First, I copy/pasted the text from my phone's Notes app into the Microsoft Word app I also have on the phone. Then, after logging in to the mygmrs.com forum and selecting edit, I deleted the large font text and replaced it by copy/pasting the text from Word. This resulted in the more normal sized text. Sure beat having to re-type everything. My apologies to everyone who viewed the initial Mr. Magoo sized font. (If you're not sure what that refers to, do a web search.)

(FYI: I am adding this prefacing text to my original post to tip manufacturers and readers off that I am creating a new reply today, 9/2, which will serve as a running, bullet list summary of the various points. You can go there for a quicker summary and look throughout this entire post for more specifics. Back to the original post...) A post to GMRS radio manufacturers... (For other folks, admittedly this post is a bit lengthy. This is because my main target audience are radio manufacturers who might read this forum, so I wanted to include details for their benefit. Of course, if not a manufacturer, feel free to continue reading if you'd like.) I'm fairly recent to GMRS. Even so, in that short time I've found myself in astonished [not in a good way] amazement regarding radio design decisions, quality control issues, and documentation issues. Taking these one at a time (and throwing in the bonus topic of price creep) ... Radio Design Decisions Hopefully manufacturers realize that many people buying what-should-be-more-capable GMRS radios want to use them with GMRS repeaters and not just to talk with their children on simplex. However, the design decisions I've witnessed leave me in stunned it-can't-be disbelief: + Some radios allow for the storage of the eight GMRS repeater pair channels in only eight memories. This entirely misses the mark that repeater users may need to access repeaters which use the same freq pair but with different access tones. What are GMRS repeater users expected to do in this case? Keep programming / reprogramming the tones as the users switch between those repeaters? This is inconvenient and annoying. It is even more inconvenient if the radio has to be programmed with a PC and programming cable instead of being programmable in the field using a radio's keypad. + Though I'm not sure, I seem to recall reading that at least one radio was designed with access tones in an all or nothing mode. That is, specifying an access tone applied it to all of the stored frequencies. Not good. And even if this was not the case, some radios do not (or did not) support split tones. Split tones are important for GMRS repeater use. These days some repeaters utilize a DCS transmit tone and a CTCSS receive tone, or vice versa, or two different CTCSS tones, or two different DCS tones. Split tone capability please. + Some radios were released with narrow band only. For people with wide band radios, the apparent volume of a narrow band transmission is lower, which can be annoying to listen to. Capable GMRS radios (i.e., "non-bubble-pack" variety) especially should be designed with selectable wide band and narrow band capability. Quality Control Issues It's amazing what quality control issues were released to consumers: + Without specifying which manufacturers, even recently released radios capable of both wide and narrow band were factory pre-programmed with memories set to narrow band. So right away, especially non-bubble-pack radio users will likely want to change those to wide band. This is not convenient if such radios must be programmed via a PC and programming cable, and even worse if the cable is not provided with the radio. A before-it's-released-to-the-consumer quality check should have detected and prevented this. + Similar to the above, without specifying which manufacturers, some recently released radios were factory pre-programmed with access tones stored in the memories. Not good. For example, if a particular memory had CTCSS receive tone 156.7 stored and the radio is set to use that memory, that means a transmission would be heard only if the corresponding 156.7 transmit tone is transmitted by a sender. This would be bad especially for new users - they might not even realize that they are not receiving transmissions which don't send the appropriate tone. And as above, this is a irritant if such radios require a PC and programming cable to correct this, and even worse if the cable is not included with the radio. A before-it's-released-to-the-consumer quality check should have detected and prevented this. + OEM programming software is often buggy. Or the ability to copy/paste whole row(s) or selected cells of programming data is not supported. This makes programming painful. Documentation Issues To put it kindly, often the documentation, especially for Chinese radios, is lacking. Important details are omitted. The English is poor. Please hire people with a better command of English. But that is not enough. Also make sure that the document writers understand radios well enough to know what to write. Both of these skills are needed to create worthwhile documentation. Price Creep I've been noticing price creep recently. For example, one manufacturer released a radio not long ago, then fairly recently released an updated model for $20 more, and then released an even more recent model shortly later for $50 more than the first model. I'm not saying necessarily that the two latter radios do not warrant their increased prices, but the higher prices in rapid succession have been noticed by others as well. This manufacturer also sells a mobile GMRS radio that is a bit shy of $400, which is in the mucho dinero level of the established, big name manufacturers. Again, I'm not saying necessarily that this manufacturer doesn't deserve such prices, but as the saying goes, "people are beginning to talk." This manufacturer can afford to charge these prices at least currently due to the design features incorporated in their radios versus the past, lacking offerings from their competitors. But if their competitors incorporate such features at more modest prices, they might woo customers away. Such is the waltz that is capitalism. Consumers are noticing the rapidity with which the increasingly priced radios with incremental improvements (perhaps an intentional business model) are released. As such, the consumers and their wallets might hold off on future purchases for a few beats to see what's coming 'round the bend. Examples of Good Execution I didn't want to provide only examples of bad execution. Here are some examples of good execution: + I don't know what Wouxun did or didn't do in say the last five years, but they seem to have their act together in the more recent past I'm aware of. For example, I purchased a KG-905G radio recently. Rightfully so, it did not arrive from the factory programmed in narrow band for channels in which wide band is permissible. Rightfully so, it did not arrive with access tones factory pre-programmed in memories instead of the more desirable case of no factory pre-programmed tones. Also, this radio allows a user to store multiple versions of the same repeater freqs with different tones. + Randy, from youtube channel "NotaRubicon Productions," reviewed the newly released Wouxun KG-935G handheld GMRS radio recently. It is apparent that the designers understand features to include which facilitate the use of this radio. Or possibly they included such features due to listening to influencers such as Randy and/or buytwowayradios.com. For example, the radio can be operated in a dual receive mode. To make it readily apparent which of the two selectable channels is the one that will be transmitted on when pressing the PTT button, an attention-getting red bar is present in the portion of the display corresponding to that frequency. Nice. Now let's take the case in which dual receive is active and one steps away from the radio but can hear that a transmission was received. Was it frequency A or B? There is an indicator which shows which frequency last received a transmission. Nice. But let's say you're a person who likes to keep things simple. You might find dual receive confusing or annoying. Dual receive is selectable; one is not forced to use it. Nice. * Recently, buytwowayradios.com has made the Wouxun KG-XS20G mobile radio available for purchase. While I'm waiting for reviews of this radio (believe one will be coming soon from Randy), a feature I like is one that was abandoned by many manufacturers, including the big name $$$ ones. I'm referring to the use of the sturdy, old-style mic connector. This is the connector which utilizes the strain-relieved mic cord secured by a rotating, threaded locking collar instead of the RJ-45 type of connector. I, and plenty of others, dislike the RJ-45 type of connector, especially for mobile radios. Disclosures + I have no connection with Wouxun, other than I purchased their KG-905G radio. I mention them simply because I like many of their design decisions. In case anyone thinks that I'm an automatic Wouxun fan-boy, that is not the case. For example, I wish the KG-905G radio was fully field programmable via it's key pad and knobs. As far as I know, to add or change frequencies in its memories, a PC and programming cable is required. Once that's been done, one can use the radio's limited keypad and knobs to specify or change things such as access tones, power level, and wide or narrow band. While this is better than radios that don't allow for any or next-to-nothing programmability from their keypad/knobs, I wish that the KG-905G was more field programmable in addition to the PC and programming cable method. Since the keypad of this radio is basic (i.e., numeric keys are not included), even if a convoluted way of inputting or updating frequencies could be done via the radio's keypad and knobs, I would like that. This would make the radio more flexible when traveling or otherwise away from home. + I have no connection with Randy nor his NotaRubicon youtube channel. I mention them only because he and his channel provide spot-on information about GMRS and GMRS radios. + I have no connection with buytwowayradios.com other than that's the web site from which I bought the KG-905G radio and some accessories. It is my understanding that BTWR may have interfaced with manufacturers such as Wouxun to drive design decisions for certain, uniquely-offered radios. If so, BTWR is a good asset for the GMRS world. And if that helps the manufacturer create desirable products which differentiate them from competitors and therefore drives sales, it's a win-win. Summary For the radio manufacturer's, I've provided examples of problematic radio designs, quality control issues, documentation issues, and a potential warning about increasing price creep. I've also provided examples of good execution. Finally, while providing radios with good features is nice, it is important that manufacturers also ensure reliability. The allure of whiz-bang features is long forgotten if a radio/its battery/etc fail a short time after the warranty period ends. But the bad reputation for such a manufacturer will exist long after in this case. Bad or non-existent after-purchase support also falls in this category. Note: The opinions expressed are my own. The opinions of others may vary.

Kudos to Wouxun. From a features and knowing what customers want perspective, Wouxun is doing well these days. For example, their GMRS mobile and handheld radios provide the capabilities that are conducive to GMRS *repeater* use (e.g., split tones, the ability to store multiple versions of the same frequencies with different tones in memory slots, wide band as well as narrow band, etc.). With their new KG-XS20G radio, I see it includes a feature abandoned by many radio manufacturers, including the big names. I am referring to Wouxun's use of the robust, old style mic connector, the one with the circular retention collar. That collar plus the strain relief cover over the mic cord makes for a sturdy mic system. I prefer this hands down over the modern trend of the RJ-45 style of mic connector. My $0.02 anyway. Hopefully Wouxun will read this and it will encourage them to continue making good design choices. And if their competitors read this, maybe it will give them something to think about going forward. I have no connection with Wouxun or companies such as buytwowayradios.com which sell this product. Just had to give props to Wouxun for their choice of a mic connector in this case.

As far as: 'Thank you for not ignoring the questions of a newbie. I'm grateful.' Glad to provide some ideas. Thanks for letting us know you appreciate the replies. If you don't mind, please let us know what you determine ultimately.

I have run across several articles that support the idea that alternative, non-OEM HT antennas do not necessarily perform better than a radio's stock OEM one. Here is one such article... https://www.hamradio.me/antennas/ht-antenna-comparisons.html The author also showed that the use of a tiger tail aka counterpoise does not provide a universal benefit - it does in some cases but not others. The author's takeaways: 1) For his Yaesu FT1D, the stock antenna performed well. (Perhaps the Yaesu/ICOM/Kenwood) engineers design an antenna tuned well for each particular model.) 2) If he needs a more capable antenna for demanding situations, he recommends a roll up antenna (e.g., Ed Fong DBJ-2). Note that there are amateur radio and commercial versions of that antenna. The commercial one is suitable for GMRS and MURS. The rollup antenna would be good for home use or for stationary work camping or hiking. Finally, and this is a personal decision for each of us - how many non-conspicuous extras do we want to add to our "portable" HTs? A giant whippy antenna? A counterpoise hanging off the radio? Maybe a suit of armor with an NMO mount at the top of the helmet? What a ground plane that would make. ? 4 out of 5 dentists say that walking around with an HT automatically disqualifies one from getting an invite to a Victoria's Secret show. Walking around with an HT loaded with octopus-like accessories may go a step further - it might result in a regular block party invite getting "lost in the mail." ??

Hi Marcus, I agree with the followup posts I've read. A list of possibilities... * Though a repeater is listed in the mygmrs database, there is the chance that the repeater has been removed from service permanently. Or it might be down temporarily due to upgrades or repairs. * Another possibility is that the access tones have changed but the repeater owner/admin did not update the mygmrs database. * To potentially get an answer to the above two possibilities, when you click the "Mansfield 650" link in the mygmrs Repeaters section, click the "Request Access" link. See if you get a reply, which might include updated access tone info. Also, the replier might provide info regarding the repeater's status. If you don't get a reply, especially after waiting a couple of weeks, this might [but not necessarily] indicate that the repeater no longer exists. * As I mentioned in my original reply, using an incorrect or outdated receive tone will prevent hearing transmissions from a repeater. Hypothetically, let's say the transmit tone you programmed is correct but the receive tone is incorrect (e.g., it was changed versus what is listed in mygmrs). For radios which have a display, it might provide you an S-meter indication that a signal is being received though the incorrect receive tone prevents you from hearing the transmission. So when you try to hit the repeater, watch the display as you unkey. * Next, you can try turning off the receive tone temporarily. In this case, note that a response from someone might not involve using the repeater. If they are close enough to you, they might communicate to you simplex using the same freq as the repeater's output freq. If you get a reply from someone, ask them if they are using a repeater to do so. If they say yes, ask them what repeater they are using. If they don't know the answer to that question, they might be kidding / messing with you. * Next, because "height is might" when it comes to line of sight radio communication, if you live in a multi-story residence, try accessing the repeater from say an upper story balcony. Some more tips regarding this. When I tried accessing a repeater 7 miles away from my upper floor balcony, I had no luck initially. But when I moved several inches from my original position, I was able to make contact. I have a large tree with plenty of leaves and an office building facing my balcony. Since these represent a challenge to a good signal path, trying different transmit positions at height might reveal a more capable communication path. * Next, as one commenter mentioned, a better antenna might help. For example, when I used a dual-commercial-band rollup antenna in place of the HT's OEM antenna, the signal reports I received indicated better performance. * Finally, as one commenter suggested, consider driving closer to the repeater. Looking at the coverage info for the Mansfield 650 repeater on mygmrs, it states a range of 10 miles. This suggests a modest repeater system rather than a wide-area repeater whose antenna might be 100 or 100s of feet high. As such, a drive closer to the repeater could shed light on what is going on. * As far as your programming, I agree with the others that it sounds like you did that correctly. Of course, this doesn't matter if the repeater is no longer in service, or its access tones have changed, etc. Good luck.