Toy to play with Harris XG-100P

[kidphc]

On 4/13/2023 at 10:10 AM, PACNWComms said:

Great thread. I have dealt with Motorola, Thales, and Harris for a long while, and ended up working with Harris for field testing both the military AN/PRC-152 series and the XG-100P Unity radio for various agencies (my personal collection shown in the attached picture). Harris brought a multi-band radio with GPS to the table first, but then did not support it well when the sales did not take off (who could afford the XG-100P). 

In preparation for the 2009 Police and Fire Games, and Later the 2010 Olympic Games in Canada, many fire and police elements in northern Washington State were provided grant money for XG-100P/M radios. 

I bought a demo unit while working for the oil industry, being an intrinsically safe radio that allowed me to carry one radio instead of three (VHF,UHF and 7/800 MHz). However, I only have RPM12, so know I am missing out on some newer features. Compared to the military Motorola APX7000 (dual band I was issued), the Unity was a great radio. It still is for me now, but is heavy and lacks some refinement of newer Harris radio. They still come up on auction sites and used radio vendor sites for $800-1200 often though. There are people I know that use them for bragging rights as well, for those that want to flex on their radio geek friends. 

As mentioned by others the "mission plans" on the XG-100P are much like those on the true military AN/PRC-152 as well. Harris makes a great radio, but the price also reflects that. Now, if I could only buy AN/PRC-152's without dealing with export models (type of encryption or lack thereof) as having AM and FM (satcom, HPW and other military specific waveforms) in the same radio in very convenient, but comes at a huge cost many hobbyist can't afford. But, I see that like Motorola making Trbo DMR and P25 TDMA in the same radio, only a wish that may never happen, or will only happen a huge cost. 

Nice collection. So  many dollars those Harris Prcs.. good god the prices that old Falcons still go for.

Bragging rights,unfortunately in the group I spend time with goes to the APX 8.5k xe boys. Yes they own them as well as have ones that are issued.. But they are mostly FEMA or local FD.  Wish I could justify nearly 5-6k for an APX, entitlements plus software and accessories. 

The XG100P is a nice radio, Fighting random reboots, but I think the battery might be done or has an internal short. I am going to be loaned another Harris Lithium battery and we shall see.

The receive on the XG100P is actually pretty awesome, its better then the XTS500 I have. Even though the filters are pretty tight and the front end is no slouch on the XTS.

I really like the radio and might actually end up replacing a bunch of hand helds. So much so I almost bit the bullet on an auction for one. But a buddy part of above said group. Coughed and said buy the XG100M(F) first while they are cheap. Welp... $440 dollars later and the XG100M is on its way with a CH721 head. Which means I will be ripping out my hacked XTL5000/05 that has been in the truck for less than a month. Would cost more to get the brick for the XTL5000 VHF hi-power. Really wish I could afford the CH100 head ($1900 still available new) touch screen and bluetooth would be awesome as well as a couple of the FPP features available.

For those unfamiliar with the XG100M (F). It is a full spectrum mobile from Harris. It was designed for interoperability between agencies. So it has low band VHF which I don't think the  APX mobile has, sure it is older then the APX mobile, but a lot cheaper then the APX

XG100M

• VHF low band 30-50 MHz
  • 9 miliwatts
    • Some agencies around DC suburbs still use VHF low
      • Shenandoah PD
      • Maryland state on the western handle of MD
      • couple of others
    • It CAN NOT transmit on the ham bands
      • Filters are to tight
• VHF High 136-174 Wide/narrow
  • 5-50w
• UHF  380-520 MHz Wide/narrow
  • 5-50w
• UHF 700-800 MHz 
  • 2-30 w 700 MHz
  • 2-35 w 800 Mhz
• P25 Conv., Trunked, 
• 12.5/20/25  kHz spacing
• Modulation
  • Phase 1 TX: C4FM, RX: C4FM & WCQPSK
  • Phase 2 TX: HCPM, RX: WCQPSK
• DVRS (digital vehicle repeater) available for 700/800 Mhz only

[Lscott]

48 minutes ago, kidphc said:

Nice collection. So  many dollars those Harris Prcs.. good god the prices that old Falcons still go for.

Bragging rights,unfortunately in the group I spend time with goes to the APX 8.5k xe boys. Yes they own them as well as have ones that are issued.. But they are mostly FEMA or local FD.  Wish I could justify nearly 5-6k for an APX, entitlements plus software and accessories. 

The XG100P is a nice radio, Fighting random reboots, but I think the battery might be done or has an internal short. I am going to be loaned another Harris Lithium battery and we shall see.

The receive on the XG100P is actually pretty awesome, its better then the XTS500 I have. Even though the filters are pretty tight and the front end is no slouch on the XTS.

I really like the radio and might actually end up replacing a bunch of hand helds. So much so I almost bit the bullet on an auction for one. But a buddy part of above said group. Coughed and said buy the XG100M(F) first while they are cheap. Welp... $440 dollars later and the XG100M is on its way with a CH721 head. Which means I will be ripping out my hacked XTL5000/05 that has been in the truck for less than a month. Would cost more to get the brick for the XTL5000 VHF hi-power. Really wish I could afford the CH100 head ($1900 still available new) touch screen and bluetooth would be awesome as well as a couple of the FPP features available.

For those unfamiliar with the XG100M (F). It is a full spectrum mobile from Harris. It was designed for interoperability between agencies. So it has low band VHF which I don't think the  APX mobile has, sure it is older then the APX mobile, but a lot cheaper then the APX

XG100M

• VHF low band 30-50 MHz
  • 9 miliwatts
    • Some agencies around DC suburbs still use VHF low
      • Shenandoah PD
      • Maryland state on the western handle of MD
      • couple of others
    • It CAN NOT transmit on the ham bands
      • Filters are to tight
• VHF High 136-174 Wide/narrow
  • 5-50w
• UHF  380-520 MHz Wide/narrow
  • 5-50w
• UHF 700-800 MHz 
  • 2-30 w 700 MHz
  • 2-35 w 800 Mhz
• P25 Conv., Trunked, 
• 12.5/20/25  kHz spacing
• Modulation
  • Phase 1 TX: C4FM, RX: C4FM & WCQPSK
  • Phase 2 TX: HCPM, RX: WCQPSK
• DVRS (digital vehicle repeater) available for 700/800 Mhz only

Are the filters too tight to try and get it on the Ham 33cm band?

At least the XPR6580's with a CPS in memory hack you can do it with no mod's to the radio.

[kidphc]

I ask the boys when I have dinner with them next. 3/4 of them work with or are in the radio depots.

But I know of no hacks for the mobile to open up the bands any more.

Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk

[kidphc]

16 hours ago, Lscott said:

Are the filters too tight to try and get it on the Ham 33cm band?

At least the XPR6580's with a CPS in memory hack you can do it with no mod's to the radio.

Should add. Yeah, I know about some of the memory/cps hacks to get some models to open up.

Prime example is my XTL5000 it is an R2 "s" model. That was cps reconfigured to a quasi "Q" spec. With a CPS hack/hexedit.

The older harris radios some could be reconfigured "opened up" to transmit outside of their original band, using "sc" files. Initial research is showing not possible with the XG-100M/P series. 

[Lscott]

22 minutes ago, kidphc said:

The older harris radios some could be reconfigured "opened up" to transmit outside of their original band, using "sc" files. Initial research is showing not possible with the XG-100M/P series. 

[kidphc]

Unfortunately, I don't know how to mod older harris 900mhz radios.

From what I get, the public service usage is below and above the frequencies we hams get to use. So it might be possible to get what you are looking for in a single band radio.

I had looked at an old motorola, think it was an Mc series, sorry can't recall. They were about $100 on ebay. But the usage of 900mhz was so low in my area that I abandoned the idea. Plus, the whole 23cm/13cm opposite link nailed the coffin shut for me.

If it really something you want to play with there are some cheap 900mhz single band mobiles both from harris and motorola to play with.

Or play with the big boys with an icom ic9700, which lacks 900. Think it was more for the satellite boys.

Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk

[tweiss3]

How has it been working for you? How is the bluetooth programming?

[kidphc]

On 5/25/2023 at 8:22 AM, tweiss3 said:

How has it been working for you? How is the bluetooth programming?

Bluetooth works fabolous for programming. Haven't had an error yet during programming. But the radio is close and fully charged. Only negative with this style of programming is you plow through the battery life.

Bluetooth works well with the headset. There is no separate bluetooth profile for PTT buttons, so that is kinda out. I believe there is a bluetooth hand mic that will work but its from Harris (might be a Pyrme retag) and it is expensive as well as rare.

Radio has been working great. Its my go to radio, was a BF8HP then a Anytone 878uvii +, now it is the Harris. 

The biggest cons are no APRS, duh.  No Bluetooth PTT profile. Cost and Weight.

I was told a guy at Dayton had a cache from a police department of the XG100P. They were full feature set, new in box, with the charger, battery and antenna. One of my friends said the serial numbers and feature set matched the invoice which was in box. He was letting people buy "1" for around $450. He said the line was incredibly long (of course it was)

God I wish i could of gotten one. But I didn't even go.

[Lscott]

1 hour ago, kidphc said:

God I wish i could of gotten one. But I didn't even go.

The weather was great. A bit warm on Friday and sunny. Saturday it rained a bit early in the morning. By 10 AM everything was dry, NO MUD, partly sunny and it cooled off to the low to mid 70's. Looked like a really good turnout.

[kidphc]

The weather was great. A bit warm on Friday and sunny. Saturday it rained a bit early in the morning. By 10 AM everything was dry, NO MUD, partly sunny and it cooled off to the low to mid 70's. Looked like a really good turnout.

Yeah heard the weather was just about perfect. They did say that the infield was a mess. But it was just the design of it.

Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk

[Lscott]

1 minute ago, kidphc said:

Yeah heard the weather was just about perfect. They did say that the infield was a mess. But it was just the design of it.

Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk
 

Yeah, the infield was a mess. Looks like they ripped up the asphalt they put down the prior year but left chunks of it, pebble sized to fist sized, all over the place in the walkways. Made walking a bit tricky and if you had a wheelchair it was a poor experience.

[tweiss3]

@kidphc Long term impressions? What about battery life? I've still got an eye on these.

[kidphc]

[mention=2261]kidphc[/mention] Long term impressions? What about battery life? I've still got an eye on these.

It's my go to ht. Can do 2m,70 cm, gmrs and listen to local public services. It's also easier to inhibit when affiliating.

Only time I choose something else, is when I want aprs or dual receive.

The long antenna... well buy 2. Why? I am having one fail because it just is kinda long and interferes with a lot.

Cons...
price (its high) still cheaper than a comparable Apx, in radio, licensing and hardware.

Weight, she is heavy.

Buttons are chinzy (soft touch)

She's a bit slippery, shaped like a box with no real grips. Motorola puts Dumbo ears on their high end for a reason.

No parts availability.

Gl, getting a widebanded model. If you have friends at a harris dealer. They still may not open it up.

Battery life is meh.. even with the lith-ion. About a day with low usage, screen swallows a lot of power.

Overall, still love the radio. Especially, the zones and how it is configured, very flexible. It hears and transmit at par with a Motorola in my estimation.

Currently, hardest decision is 878 or big old clunky...lol tough decision right?


Sent from my SM-S901U using Tapatalk

[WRUI365]

Have had my XG-100P for a few weeks now. Liking it very much so.

[tweiss3]

So I found one that I was willing to part with my money for. This will be interesting.

 

What batteries are you guys using, OEM, aftermarket?

[Lscott]

19 minutes ago, tweiss3 said:

This will be interesting.

More like it will be expensive I'm guessing as well.

[tweiss3]

10 minutes ago, Lscott said:

More like it will be expensive I'm guessing as well.

The expensive part is past........

Now I'm looking at building mission plans. Any idea if a frequency can be mixed mode?

[Lscott]

1 minute ago, tweiss3 said:

The expensive part is past........

Now I'm looking at building mission plans. Any idea if a frequency can be mixed mode?

All I know about that model is what I've read on the forums and the radio's brochures.

I know the Kenwood TK-5210's program very differently than any of the other radios. I got the software to see what it can do but don't own any yet. It seems to use what is refereed to as "Personality" for each frequency. Then each is assigned to a zone in different combinations. I wonder if the Harris radio does something similar?

[WRKC935]

I got mine in Dayton as well.  Charger, used battery, antenna and the radio for $420.  One of the guys with the local group had a couple of them and a couple different mission plans to stick in it. 

I found the Bluetooth programming function to be great as I don't yet have a programming cable.  I also need to track down a KVL adapter as some of my personal radio stuff is encrypted. 

I did have one issue with dropping a mission plan in it that wasn't right.  Radio wouldn't boot correctly.  The three finger salute reset the radio and restoration of a known good mission plan got the radio running again. 

 

Being a Motorola guy, I was on the hunt for an APX for seemingly no good reason other than the desire to own one.  I ended up with a 7000 that was VHF/ UHF-R1.  Which is the most desirable option to get for frequency bands.  I was never a big supporter of NAS on a carried radio and I have a legit system ID and radio for work (radio service tech) with direct access to a full system key so I can build any codeplug I want for 'scanning' and when ask what I am doing with a system radio I have a reason to have it.    I mess with the Harris a bit, but I have found the accessories are stupid expensive.  And taking into account I have access to second hand accessories at the office, it's sort of a no brainer to prefer the APX.  I have one RSM for the Harris.  I have at least a dozen RSM's including the 'commander' type with display and channel knob for the APX.  Have the green XE RSM's, have a Pelitor headset and interface for the APX that is noise canceling.  The noise canceling feature on the Pelitor is good enough I can have a phone conversation on the Bluetooth model I have connected to my phone from the gun range I am a member of while I am shooting.   Of course batteries are not at all an issue as I go through the recycle bin and get out of date batteries.  Some that have only been charged a few times and are fine, but out of date.  Fire service doen't use out of date batteries.  This is due to the safety rating for the batteries while in combustible environments and in fires.  My radios are not used in life and death situations on a regular basis, so I am not effected by these things.

I will say that the 'mission plan' design with the ability for the radio to have multiple 'code plugs' that are user accessible is a really handy feature for building travel configurations when you are out of area but not needing to have endless  radio zones in a codeplug.  Sure you can have multiple codeplugs saved in a laptop for the APX and program the radio as needed with them.  But being able to store them in the radio, and switch them on the fly is much handier in my opinion. 

I will also say the programming software is a bit hard to navigate if you are accustom to other programming software.  And in truth it's just a pain all around.  But once you figure it out, it does it's job.  

Congrats on getting the radio, welcome to the Harris owners family and if you really like it a lot, there is a mobile version called the XG-100M.  Basically the same radio in a mobile configuration with some added features.  Might be something to look into.

 

[tweiss3]

1 hour ago, WRKC935 said:

I will also say the programming software is a bit hard to navigate if you are accustom to other programming software.  And in truth it's just a pain all around.  But once you figure it out, it does it's job.  

 

The programming isn't hard, but there are extra steps vs some of the other things. It almost follows the line of Astro25 Portable/Mobile process, but with a few extra steps. It looks like zone scan is going to be ideal. I did have to figure out the best way to program my zones like I have my other radios, and I'm doing 1 frequency set for 1 "system" for each zone I make.

Anyone know a way to edit the .cv5 files in excel/notepad? 

[tweiss3]

Well, few weeks use impressions:

1) OEM Harris battery with 208 cycles on lasts a "work" day listening, and that is about it. I do have a TAC1 4100mAh battery and charger on the way. I'm also on the hunt for a VC4000 charger for the car.

2) The radio isn't as heavy/big as I expected. I do have a Harris leather holster for it, it definitely is better than the belt clip when running around. 

3) I didn't intend to use it as a listening device, but it does it extremely well, and is easy to program. Enhanced CC for those that know.

4) The 48 channel (ABC switch) "capacity" is annoying coming from the NX-5k infinite channel selector. Not the end of the world.

5) Bluetooth is a bit finicky. I can do programming over BT, but sometimes it doesn't want to work for some unknown reasons. I have also yet to find anything bluetooth that works with the radio for listening. Annoying but not a deal killer. I may have to invest in the bluetooth Pelator headset before long.

Long and short, I agree above with WRKC935's assessment. Its a great radio, and a great option. 

[tweiss3]

Some more info, and some questions.

The TAC1 battery/charger is a dropship from PowerProducts. Charger is an Endura, which is top notch. I get 14+ hours on a single charge. Would buy again.

I ended up buying the 9" antenna from NLT, brand new. It is a significant improvement over the 6" on VHF. UHF/7/800 no noticeable difference. The flexibility of the antenna is a huge improvement as well over the  6".

Has anyone found any bluetooth compatibility, other than OTTO? Still looking for a listen only BT ear piece.

Anyone else have a VC4000? I think I will grab one, but some of the ones I see for sale don't have the cord, just the charger brick. Any idea where to get the power cord?

 

One other thing, my "feature list" doesn't use the numbers, but lists them by name for most. Anyway to get more information in RPM? I'm interested in a few that I never heard of. Radio info further confuses me.