Has anyone ever seen the out of band frequencies on these junkie Arcshell radios?

[TrikeRadio]

Some of the friends who go cycling with me use FRS radios for communications during our group rides. We usually use an FRS/GMRS channel with a CTCSS tone. Usually this works fine between FRS and GMRS radios we have, but one of our riders bought an Arcshell AR-5 which would not communicate with other radios in our group.
 

I assumed it was just a regular cheap FRS HT, but when I downloaded its factory setup into CHIRP it came up with this weird assortment of frequencies (and preset CTCSS tones) assigned to its 16 channels - most of which are out of band for FRS or GMRS and none that actually match FRS/GMRS frequencies!
 

It's a 2 watt radio and also has a removable antenna, so it is like a weird not quite FRS, not quite GMRS mutant, and for sure not on any frequencies it should be on for an unlicensed transceiver! I was able to change the frequencies in it to use legal channels for 1-7 and 15-22 but it would not even transmit on legal 8-14 channels (like the firmware was not allowing it).

Weird junk radio.

Anyone else ever seen on of these? How can they even sell these legally on Amazon?
 

Does anyone know if these frequencies are for some other country? UK? Europe? Elsewhere? (image shows what was in the radio when I first downloaded it on the left, compared to the legit GMRS frequencies on the right)

[amaff]

Europe's GMRS / FRS equivalent is PMR446 (which uses 446 MHz...), and Australia's UHF CB uses 476-477 MHz, so it's not that either. That's a fun one. And they're all labeled "GMRS" as well haha

[SteveShannon]

18 minutes ago, TrikeRadio said:

but it would not even transmit on legal 8-14 channels (like the firmware was not allowing it).

Perhaps because it can’t get down to 0.5 watts ERP?

[TrikeRadio]

22 minutes ago, SteveShannon said:

Perhaps because it can’t get down to 0.5 watts ERP?

possibly... i tried setting those on LOW power for the channels, but still would not transmit.

However, seeing as how it does not seem to have any restrictions about what out of FRS/GMRS frequencies it transmits on, I don't know why it would enforce the half watt FRS/GMRS restriction on those channels. it will transmit out of FRS/GMRS bands - some seem to be Marine Radio bands, others probably HAM or business bands and at least one or two I think are frequencies for the UK but not the US. The frequency/channel assignments are all over the place, and I know that the friends who bought them have not modified them... they are not tech savvy and did not have a programming cable or even any idea that these could be programmed with a computer.

[amaff]

33 minutes ago, TrikeRadio said:

some seem to be Marine Radio bands, others probably HAM or business bands and at least one or two I think are frequencies for the UK but not the US.

Marine Band VHF is between 156 and 174 MHz, so not those either, and IIRC there's some HF frequencies as well for longer range comms.

 

[Haroldo]

That HT looks just like a Baofeng BF-888S.

I bought a pair of those 888s years ago, and in the initial setup, all of the channels were mixed-up like the example that you included.

In CHIRP, the 8-14 had to be set for Narrow band, while all of the rest worked with normal FM. Because it only has 16 channels, I used the higher powered channels only.

By chance, does this HT have scanning set to channel 16? That is how you scan the channels on the 888S.

 

[Socalgmrs]

Yup. It’s not a gmrs radio so why would it have gmrs “channels” pre set.  But as you already found out just like many other non gmrs radios you can program them in chirp and make them work. But they are not gmrs so not ok 

[ULTRA2]

It looks to me the frequencies on the left are business itinerant channels some of these radios they do have these frequencies already downloaded as test use only and are not to use as regular chat channels you use them you better have the proper license to use these frequencies otherwise you are violating FCC rules

[WRTC928]

I picked up a few of those a while back, and they had a variety of frequencies in them, but I didn't try them. I immediately wiped the radios and installed the higher-power FRS channels. I did confirm with my farz-o-meter that high power is 2 watts and low is 0.5, but I didn't try to enter any of the 8-14 channels, so I don't know if it would let me. Now I'm curious, so I'll probably give it a try.

Edited to add: I just now tried it and was able to program in 3 of the low-power FRS channels and they Rx and Tx just fine. I don't know why yours won't.

I think calling them "junky" is a bit unfair, though. I think they're now $10 each. Considering the price, I've been pretty impressed. I was able to easily communicate over a repeater 20 miles from my house and the signal report was "almost full quieting". I have very favorable topography, but still, that's not bad for 10 bucks. I don't know how much of a beating they will take before they fail, but I've handed them out at three horse events and none of them have quit yet. I put a drop of Gorilla Glue on all the antennas, so functionally they're the same as an FRS radio, albeit not type-accepted. I'm not really concerned that the FCC is going to raid a horse show and take me away in handcuffs, but if you give radios to non-radio people, it's probably best to minimize the number of things that can go wrong -- losing an antenna, for example. I programmed them with the 15 higher-power channels and the local weather frequency, since the weather is kind of important to event planners. TBH, I couldn't be happier with them.

[TrikeRadio]

5 hours ago, Haroldo said:

By chance, does this HT have scanning set to channel 16? That is how you scan the channels on the 888S.

Not sure... I don't have them anymore. Gave them back to my friend who bought them after setting them to only transmit as FRS radios. They will likely never use them for much more than that.

[TrikeRadio]

4 hours ago, Socalgmrs said:

Yup. It’s not a gmrs radio so why would it have gmrs “channels” pre set.  But as you already found out just like many other non gmrs radios you can program them in chirp and make them work. But they are not gmrs so not ok 

Yeah, which is weird that they sell these on Amazon as cheap unlicensed walkie-talkies with no mention of licensing!

[TrikeRadio]

2 hours ago, ULTRA2 said:

It looks to me the frequencies on the left are business itinerant channels some of these radios they do have these frequencies already downloaded as test use only and are not to use as regular chat channels you use them you better have the proper license to use these frequencies otherwise you are violating FCC rules

Yeah, that is why I set them up with FRS frequencies ... weird that it was SOLD that way on Amazon without any information about it! These radios are sold to unsuspecting consumers with no knowledge of radio, or how to program them (they don't even come with a programming cable or a way to change them from the face of the radio!). Consumers who know nothing about radios or FCC requirements are buying these things!

[TrikeRadio]

1 hour ago, WRTC928 said:

I think calling them "junky" is a bit unfair, though. ...

I guess. For someone who knows how to program them and use them I suppose they are useful. For the regular joe schmoe who buys it cheap off Amazon and just uses it or hands it to their kids... they are going to be spouting transmissions all over on frequencies that are not permitted except for Ham licensed or other licensed users. My gripe is not really with the radios per-se.. more for hte fact that they sell these to unsuspecting consumer level users who have no clue about what they are doing.

[ULTRA2]

2 hours ago, TrikeRadio said:

weird that it was SOLD that way on Amazon without any information about it!

That's the reason some of these radios are previously used by businesses and may have changed to other form of communications don't tell you that so unsuspecting people will by them without telling them it was a used equipment their buying

 

[tweiss3]

Some of those are itinerants, some are not. That's an odd group of frequencies. 

[WRTC928]

12 hours ago, TrikeRadio said:

I guess. For someone who knows how to program them and use them I suppose they are useful. For the regular joe schmoe who buys it cheap off Amazon and just uses it or hands it to their kids... they are going to be spouting transmissions all over on frequencies that are not permitted except for Ham licensed or other licensed users. My gripe is not really with the radios per-se.. more for hte fact that they sell these to unsuspecting consumer level users who have no clue about what they are doing.

That's a fair criticism. 

[Lscott]

Some of the frequencies are in consecutive steps of exactly 100KHz too, so it's not even based on some standard channel spacing either.

My first guess is these were "test" frequencies used to "tune" the radio's PLL circuits. I know my commercial radios have a special bank of frequencies just for that purpose. The attached photo is from my NX-1300 for example.

[tweiss3]

57 minutes ago, Lscott said:

Some of the frequencies are in consecutive steps of exactly 100KHz too, so it's not even based on some standard channel spacing either.

My first guess is these were "test" frequencies used to "tune" the radio's PLL circuits. I know my commercial radios have a special bank of frequencies just for that purpose. The attached photo is from my NX-1300 for example.

You might be onto something there, just skipped the final programming before hitting the box.