Riktar

Thanks berkinet!

Maintaining 6.5" around the antenna mount, magnetic, permanent or otherwise is no problem. I was wondering if moving it away from the center of the car would still cause a bias in transmit/receive performance. IE: where the mount currently is, I have (approx) 2 feet of "ground plane" to the sides and 4 feet to the windshield and the back hatch. If I go with a permant mount I would maintain the 2 feet to the sides but the fore and aft would change from 4 feet in both directions to 3 feet from the back and 5 feet to the front. And just an FYI: I have 2 antennas I will employ on the vehicle: One is a Larsen LP450NMO antenna. This is a unity gain antenna that does require a ground plane. This is teh antenna that I will use around the property since it is REALLY low profile so no worries about low hanging branches and it will also come in handy when going through carwashes. The other antenna is a Browning BR-450 (No ground plane needed) that will be my "open road" antenna since I want maximum range on the road and I will net be concerned with low hanging branches on the interstates. Are you saying that as long as I have the 6.5 inches around the mount (for the ground plane needed antenna) the remaining roof placement would not make that much difference? As always, thank you for the info!

The inability to use different tones on the same channel is a BIG mistake by Midland. The first thing I noticed is that I couldn't use the only linked repeater in my area because of this. With the research I (should have done in the first place but oh well) did I discovered the wonderful world of used commercial grade radios on Ebay. For what I paid (And got refunded) for the MXT400 I purchased 3 TK-8180 radios for my house and 2 vehicles. And yes, I know there was also the cost of the coax and antennas but whatever. What this radio is capable of is outstanding compared to what Midland offers. But yes, I understand what Midland is probably marketing to. I have family in Pennsylvania, Virginia and North Carolina. I have already researched and placed the repeaters in their respective state/travel groups on the radios so when I hit the road (I HATE flying but I digress) I have another potential way of maintaining communication between my point of departure as well as my destination along the way. Midland would have to include some extensive features to their future line up and even then, the cost difference will most likely keep me shopping in the used market for the foreseeable future.

Your comment on the mag mount mobile antenna has me thinking. I did get a permanent NMO antenna mount in a used TK-8180 package I purchased and was considering installing it on my 2007 Trailblazer since I will (most likely) be the last person owning it until it goes to the bone yard. Right now I am using a Midland mag mount for my MNO antennas and have the antenna fairly centered on the roof. If I went with the "permanent" mount I would have to shift it back a couple of feet because of the moon roof option the vehicle has. In your opinion, does the change to a permanent over a magnetic mount have benefits that outweigh the need to place the antenna in a less centered position on the vehicle? As I understand it, the trailblazer body is acting as the ground plance which is why I tried to center the mag mount as close to dead center as possible. Because as it stands now I can still hit the repeater in my area with the mobile but because I am on the fringe of the repeaters range the connection is sometimes a bit sketchy. So any measure of performance improvement would be welcome.

FWIW I live in an area that has some hills in and around me. While I am not in a geographic bowl as you are describing I do have some topography differences to deal with. I have a repeater that is 30 miles away and another repeater that is 60 miles from me. Both are on the same linked system. Both are in totally different (nearly 180 degrees) directions. In my car (mobile) and in my house (base) I use Kenwood TK-8180 mobile units. The house or "base" radio is the "H" model so it kicks out 45 watts. The car or "mobile" is not an "H" so it is pushing 30 watts. I may be switching those 2 radios around, but I digress.... The 30 mile repeater can be heard clear as a bell by the base unit. This repeater can hear me quite clearly as well now that I have ironed out "some" of my initial setup issues. The mobile unit can hear the repeater fairly clear and can communicate fairly clearly depending on where I park the car on the property. The handheld(s) I use when I am pedestrian on the property are really hit and miss with hearing the repeater. This doesn't concern me that much since their primary function is talking to the base unit. The 60 mile repeater can be heard by the base unit but the static is about even with the voices being broadcast so while I can make out what is being said, it is hard to use. Just for grins I tried to broadcast and was told that while I was keying the repeater, nobody could make out what I was saying. Anywho.... Chances are that if you can CLEARLY hear the repeater from your location, you should be able to talk to the repeater without much of a problem on a base unit in your house with an antenna setup that is (reasonably) proper. If not, as was mentioned in an above post, Amazon is your friend when it comes to returns.

As someone who is new to this hobby (and sometimes confused by his own post's as well.. I noticed I incorrectly put down SA-239 in an above post when I do know from reading other posts it is an SO-239. Ugh, I try to use correct spelling and then do that... ) I want to ask if I am going too far in the quest to keep my coax one long continuous cable from the antenna to the radio. My antenna is in the attic of a 2 story home and the cable is fed down an unused chimney into the basement and back up to a first floor room where is exits out in the corner of the room and hooks directly into my radio. And it is a single piece of coax. The only break in the whole link is where I put a SWR meter in to check on the line and the antenna.0 I am assuming that when people use a tower install or have an extreme length between the antenna and the radio it is not feasible to use one continous length of cable. But I have no idea what the standard would be for when it is practical to add addtional connectors for extending or stepping down the cable size to complete the installation. IE: In my case, while it was a pain, I was able to wrangle the (approx) 60' feet of LMR400 all the way from the antenna to the radio in one continuous section. If I was ever inclined to try and get an antenna up on the 40 foot silo in my yard and into my house the path would be (again, approx) 200' feet long. Aside from the sheer bulk of handling one long piece of cable to do this AND considering that a run this long would mandate using something as heavy/large as heliax cable which (I am admittedly guessing here) is not as forgiving at being bent around multiple corners as LMR400 is as LMR400 is not as "bendable" as RG8x, etc, etc. So I am trying to find some type of guidance as to minimize my losses while still making my cable run a practical one. As a for instance: If I were to mount an antenna on the 40 foot silo in my yard would it be adviseable to run 1/2, 7/8, etc. Heliax from the silo down to the ground, form the widest 90 degree bend (6 inch radius? 9? 12?) under the ground (If not using burial grade the cable would be fed through some type pvc for protection) to the house where it would be stepped down to LMR400 as it got close to needing severe bends to get it to the room where the radio sits? And IF I wanted to avoid having cables just running through holes in the floor or wall, are there connectors that would minimze my losses while allowing more of an "attractive" install? I have been searching for some type of writeup/article online but have not come across anything that I can apply to this endeavor.

I should have mentioned the antenna connection is a N type. As to the PL-259 connections the only one is the connection to the back of the Kenwood since I am trying to have only one line (In my case the LMR400) going from the antenna to the radio. Now I am sure this is a real case of overthinking but would there be any benefit to removing the SO-239 on the radio and installing a Female N-connector so I could utilize Male N connections on both ends of the cable? I will get on the grounding stuff this weekend. Shame I don't have the nerve to tackle the roof mounting. There are lightning arrestors up by the chimneys with cabling you could use to pull a tank with, going down to grounding rods on two of the corners of the house. Maybe the Son-in_law will be up this weekend.....

Thanks for the tips. If I go over the 100 foot mark by moving the antenna out of the attic and onto the roof I will definately look into the Heliax. For now I am going to stay with my 55 foot run into the attic. I originally planned on a 90 foot run using a 15 foot pipe next to the house but went with an attic mount solution to avoid outdoor elements and allow me to shrink my cable length needs. Was a good thing too. I had enough extra to cable to allow a couple of "whoopsies" with my initial attempts at using crimp connectors on the LMR400. Along the line of grounding: Since I am mounted on an attic rafter, I don't have any metal contacting the antenna at all. I don't suppose I could just run a ground line to the plumbing vent in the attic? Run a grounding line down to the basement and ground to the well pipe coming into the building? Thanks again for the advice!

I guess it's all relative. IE: If I was suddenly blessed with getting as much 1/2 inch as you did, adding a $150+ dollars to the equation would be a no brainer. Congrats on scoring the cable!

I would like to simplex with my Brother who is 12 miles away as the crow flies in another direction. So then I am curious about a utilizing a rotor. The one I have on my CM4228 on the roof (And NO I am not going up on the roof again. The last time was up there was 20 years ago and frankly, my courage level is not to trying it now in my 60's) has a digital readout on the control box in the house so it's easy to aim. If I could employ something like that I could pull this off. I only need to cover 3 compass headings. Hmmmm......

Oh you betcha! I have my VOM ready after every crimp/solder/twist.etc. Standing by to verify a good connection!

Sorry if I am reviving a thread that is several months old but since I am trying to connect with rodro123's repeater I will ask about the best base antenna as well. But I think I know the answer already: DB404-B - The thing is I am limited to attic mounting my antenna. And given the height limitations (almost but not quite 6 feet to the inside peak) of my attic, I can't find any other antenna that would even come close to the abilities of the DB404 and still fit in my attic. The 2 antenna's I have tried so far are a Browning BR-6140 (Unity gain) and a Harvest BC200 (advertised 6.5dBi gain) antenna. The Browning can't make the connection much at all and the Harvest can half way connect but it is not solid enough to be useable. Too much break up. And at this point I can't seem to find anything else that will fit both my requirements: Connect to the repeater AND fit within the confines of my attic. Just thought of a 3rd "requirement". Meet the minimun standards for WAF.....

I am barely 3 weeks into GMRS and as impressed as I am with the performance of the GMRS radio over my prior use of CB MANY years ago, I am even more impressed with the community! Between the help I have gotten on these forums and the suggestions I have gotten while talking on the radio, I now have a system that FAR exceeds my initial expectations. So to everyone here and on the air: THANK YOU! Note to self: Try to leave well enough alone for now. Enjoy what you have before you "over tinker..."

Thanks for the explanation. But, well, nuts! That sounds like a great feature the Motorola's have. Shame Kenwood doesn't have something similar..... I have improved my antenna placement which has helped with the audio.

Deal! I will give you a try tomorrow. Maybe the new antenna placement will allow me to come through.

What is Big M?

I have removed all the FRS channels from my radio and yes, I do have all the GMRS/Repeater channels on high power and set to wide. The Kenwood software has a setting labeled as Mic sense which according to the help file is the gain. The only settings are high and normal.

On my TK-8180 I am getting reports that my audio is clear but very quiet when going through the repeater in my area. And while speaking closer to the mic helps, if I get any closer I will know what the plastic tastes like. On the flip side, when I am talking locally without the repeater, I am being told not to talk so loudly, or to back away from the mic. I looked in the programming software for my radio and the only thing I have found is an option for Mic Sense. My only 2 choices are high and normal. I have tried both settings and the difference is minimal. Is there a setting I am just not seeing to adjust the mic's gain? Is there such a thing as a "powered" mic with adjustable gain? The mic I am trying to resolve this issue with is a Kenwood KMC-9C desk mic. I was using KMC-35 that was better in the sense of audio output but the KMC-9C is much better in a desktop environment since the rubber base keeps it in place.

Thanks for the info! This forum (and the members of it) are great!!

One other question then: Other people have stated the DB404 antenna is the pinnacle of performance for a base setup. I have not seen and listing for one with a SO-239 connector. How would a person handle the difference between the 2 types of connector in that scenario?

Thank you for the replay and the info! I will try and digest that and use it going forward. While I said I wan't going to try any more PL-259 installs on the LMR400 I decided ti do one more this morning. My reflective power is now down to 0.42 and the SWR is holding at 1.37 so I am going to leave well enough alone. As to your explanation (and again, thank you) about the impedence mismatch between the N connector and the PL-259: Since my Kenwood does use the SO-239 and the antenna has the N, would it be better to just use an n to 259 adapter/connector? From the information I have gotten from others about minimizing the amount of added items between the antenna and the radio I figured that replacing the N connector with a PL-259 would eliminate the need for an extra connector. Or in the case of having 2 different types of connecters, it doesn't make enough difference adding an adapter in vs changing one adapter for another? And for future purchases and/or installs: Avoid getting an antenna with an N connector and sticjk with SO239?

The crimping too (and included PL-259 ends came from Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01E6804LQ/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o08_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 It does a reasonable job: The stripping/prep cutter I am still waiting on: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00HDPIG4C/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 And while I am waiting (and upon reflecting how "cheap" this stripping/prep too) I am pondering ordering this: https://www.amazon.com/Times-Microwave-Combination-LMR400-Cables/dp/B007JSCV12/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3LMA7BQMYQC2E&dchild=1&keywords=lmr400+stripper&qid=1586031073&sprefix=LMR4%2Caps%2C182&sr=8-1 Now if this was the only time I would be doing this than I would not consider this. But after wrestling with the LMR400 last night and considering my brother and my daughter want to get a home base setup similar to what I am putting together. Maybe I would be well served to buy this. Buy quality and you only cry once sort of thing.

Just tried another crimp. Pretinned the end of the conducter before putting the crimp/solder on this time. MUCH better results. I am comparing my 35 foot "practice" piece to a 90 foot premade MPD Digital LMR400 with PL-259 connectors that is also a bit long for what I need but anyway.... Now my reflected power is more in line. The premade piece is showing 0.53 with and SWR reading of 1.45 and my practice piece is showing 0.48 and SWR is at 1.40 Maybe the tinning helped? Maybe the 2nd time I had practice? In any event I am going to leave well enough alone since trying to wotk with LMR 400 is REALLY fricking hard without the proper stripping/prep tool. At least for someone with my experience level. Thank you all for the replies and info!

The solder/crimp terminals (and the crimp tool) I have are for LMR400. And, well, nuts on pooching the lifetime warranty. Then again, I mis-measured terribly and 100 feet was way more than I needed so I figured I would cut off the excess and experimaent with the shorter 35 foot long piece. Once I get the stripping/prep cutter tool I will give this another go on the "short" section. Hey, at the end of the day there will be a value (to me anyway) in learning about this process. For now my big concern is the increase in reflected power. Could a reading as high as mine cause damage to the radio?

Sorry for all the edits to the above post.