WRMH343

[deleted]

Seems like you could just use your 440 MHz / 70cm ham antenna with a coax switch.
I've tested several of my hamband UHF antennas on GMRS and all seem to match up well enough.
Vince

Good Day.

When I started playing with radio back in the 70s I used to wonder the same thing regarding full-wave antennas. If a quarter wave antenna makes for a good working antenna and a half-wave is better, why isn’t anyone using a full-wave antennas. Well, the simple answers are 1) Antennas are larger than their shorter counter parts(a really big issue at lower frequencies) and 2) through testing it has been determined that they are very poor performers. You can be certain that with so much experimentation and research into radio and antennas for over a century that if full-wave antennas performed even remotely better they would be in heavy use. However, 1/2 wave antennas have been determined to be the clear winner. Oddly enough, even the 1/4 wave antenna is in effect a 1/2 wave antenna in that the ground plane (or ground radials) effectively satisfy the function of the missing 1/4 wave portion. If you search the internet you will find the more technical reasons why the full-wave version performs poorly.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Your results sound completely normal for two radios operating simplex, antennas at 4-7’ AGL, and with loads of obstructions.

Midland’s lure of “38-Mile Range” is worse that saying “You too could win the lottery”. In the real world you are more likely to win the power-ball lottery 6 times before you would ever experience 38-mile range with their walkie talkies.

Obstructions are the enemy of range in radio communications. Never underestimate how much they negatively effect range and don’t accept any statements to the contrary.

Two GMRS handhelds will have a range of 6-miles if used on row boats over smooth water until the earth (water) becomes the obstruction and the signal is lost. That assumes both people are standing in the boat and holding radios at 6 feet AWL. If both people now sit in the boat, range will drop to about 3 miles until the earth becomes the obstacle again. Do an internet search on ‘Radio Horizon’ to see how this works. Also, here is a simple calculator to see what your best case scenario is: https://www.everythingrf.com/rf-calculators/line-of-sight-calculator.

As you will learn, the earth is an obstacle that blocks your signal quite dramatically. If there are hills between the two antennas, same thing. Hills are an earth obstacle. Now, if you go into a heavily treed area, or an urban area with lots of buildings everyone of these attenuates your signal to some degree too. All of these add up to reduce your range further. Mix distance, hills and other obstacles and range is squashed.

You will hear over and over phrases such as “Height is might”, “Height is King” and “Height is everything”. This is true for a couple of reasons. First, as each antenna goes up in elevation the radio horizon gets further and further way, so your theoretical maximum range on earth increases. Second, when you raise the antennas up, often the number and density of obstacles between the antennas drops too so your real-world range increases.

My simplex HT to HT range and HT to Mobile ranges mimics yours. However, when I use mobile to base communications with base antenna at 40’ I loose communications at around 4 miles. When I raise it to 56’ I loose all communications around 8 miles. Yet with both my base and mobile rights I can communicate with repeaters 22-50 miles away because the repeater antennas are so much higher than mine are. Higher antennas mean fewer obstacles, thus increased range.

Hope this helps


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Hey everyone, we've been trying to get Chirp integrated with myGMRS for a while but the problem has been a lack of interest, according to the creator of Chirp. There's now a request for integration but we could use your help to prove there's interest out there. 
Please post a comment in support of the feature: https://chirp.danplanet.com/issues/9169
Thanks!

You can count on all the Wouxon software being crappy, inconsistent, non-professional software. No, behaviors are not consistent between models. Worst software I have used since the 1980s.

What you can count on is that you can program your radio faster using the manufacturer’s software than you can manually. Just do not expect an Excel-like editing experience.

If you want a professional software experience you will have to pay for it from RT-Systems.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

I've experimented with a thin walled fiberglass mast in a heavy duty speaker tripod mount for a temporary setup. There is an AL-800 dual band telescoping antenna on the top. The top tubing section was a bit thin so I removed. As it is now I get the antenna up about 20 feet when mounted on the tripod. If its a bit windy a few 6 inch tent stake spikes with some nylon cord works to guy the mast so it doesn't blow over.
https://www.dxengineering.com/parts/mfj-1911
The antenna seems to match up OK on the GMRS channels when the coax is attached. No ground plane is needed thus reducing the wind load.
https://www.dxengineering.com/parts/pry-al-800
The mast pops out of the tripod and will collapse to about 4 feet. The tripod folds up to about the same dimension. Without any guy wires I can setup the whole thing in about 10 minutes.
I ran RG-58 cable up to the antenna. While a bit high on losses it is light weight and I'm not running the cable far anyway. I made the trade off with higher losses to get a light weight easy to setup and transport portable antenna system. If I have to I can use a 30 to 40 watt FM only amp that needs 4 to 5 watts drive power from an HT while drawing maybe at most 6 to 7 amps DC current, low enough to supply from a modest sized 12 volt battery.
For Ham use a Mirage dual band BD-35 amps works. For GMRS a wide band amp is necessary. One from BTECH will work, however it is not Part 95 certified.
https://www.dxengineering.com/parts/mir-bd-35
https://www.miklor.com/COM/Review_DMR-Amps.php
https://baofengtech.com/product/amp-u25d/
If you look around you can find good deals on the above used. I picked up a BD-35 and a U25D for $100 total at a recent Ham Radio flea Market.

I will be running 50w UHF and VHF, 50w GMRS.

I will let you know once it is operational. I may not have it installed for two weeks.

I do expect some desensitization of the listening receiver while I am transmitting on the other service, but nothing that I expect will affect my operations. I will have ferrite chokes on the GMRS feed-line to cut down on the noise and reduce ingress from the 2m/70cm since that line will be running parallel to the amateur antenna.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

I use a HD pushup fiberglass mast for semi-permanent use. Capable of 46’ AGL. Purchased from DX Engineering. It is available in shorter lengths with smaller vertical sections so it will collapse to shorter length. Here is a picture of mine un-guyed at max height (with antenna) located in my backyard during testing (56’ to tip). Amazing how plumb it stayed, of course it was not side loaded as would be the case with a Yagi.

Anchoring in this picture consisted of (4) 18” long screw-in earth anchors plus 4 adjustable straps from Harbor Freight.

I would have no problems taking this or a shorter one camping. Would take about 10-15 minutes to assemble, anchor and raise with antenna and coax once you know your system down and all parts on are hand. This one was put up solo. It has gone up and down about a dozen times thus far. It now sits next to the house.




Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

The 5 MHz spacing is an offset for duplex repeaters.

I own the KG-1000G, but I use it as a base within my home. I use HT’s in the car along with external antenna and speaker mic. If I were going to do an official install in the car, I would currently go with another 1000G. It is IMO the mobile equivalent of the UV9G. It does not do commercial FM like the 9G does, but that IMO is not needed since nearly every car on the road already has that.

While the 9G does have multi-band Rx capably, my 1000G is programmed exclusively for GMRS, and it handles it quite well in my environment. I do not use it to scan anything except GMRS, but admit on occasion I tune in NOAA, or enter a specific local amateur frequency I want to monitor.

I agree with WyoJoe, best is subjective. What is best for you may not be best for me and vice versa.

IMO Midland radios may be best when it comes to operational simplicity for GMRS. The 1000G may be best in terms of programability options. Commercial radios may be best from an RF performance and reliability standpoint.

Food for thought.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

I owner two mixed code repeaters. There were two reasons for doing this. A ) Security. For a bit I had an unknown user keying the repeater for minutes at a time. After asking the user not to do this they chose to key the repeater for nearly 30 minutes. Of course the repeaters TOT tripped after 2 minutes, however the user continued to key either until they were bored, or until their radio finally killed itself, nearly 30 minutes and long enough for me to figure out where they were. So I changed only the input tone so the user couldn't trip the repeater (or its twin) again. B ) We kept the original output tone to make it seem like we never changed tones at all. Trying to "scan" the repeaters output would only give the 223 code for output. I figured this would frustrate anyone who is trying to get access without checking with me first.

Hello Mike.
 
The primary reason I have my GMRS license is as means for family communications. Mobile to mobile, mobile to home, around home and more. It also serves as source of emergency communications for and with the family and neighborhood. Basically it serves as a utility service for me. Yes, I do use it to communicate with other GMRS’r too, mostly while mobile, occasionally from home.
 
I have my ham license for a variety of reasons. As a hobby and means to experiment and learn. As a means to connect with others in a fun way, both local and world wide. As a means to help with civic events and perhaps be prepared to help the community during a time of natural disaster or other local or national emergency. It also serves as a means to connect with others with like interests.
 
No one in the family has interest in amateur radio. The have not the interest to study for it, invest in it, nor interest in ‘talking radio’ with others.
 
Both work for me exactly the way I want them too. GMRS is utility. Ham is hobby and personal interest.
 
Hope that helps.
 
 
Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

I'm happy GMRS overlaps with FRS. It opens things up to a lot of people that would otherwise never consider it, myself included. If I want to sit by a radio and anxiously await for somebody to talk to using only correct phraseology and not hear any kids, I'll get in to ham.
 
I think some of you might be trying to think GMRS is something it isn't. It's test free, cheap, and overlaps with FRS for a reason.