Motorola XTS5000

[axorlov]

I can't say anything regarding Wouxun, I do not own any, my buddies do not own them either. But it worth noting that there is at least one CCR brand that is truly a garbage.

[DONE]

1 hour ago, OffRoaderX said:

 

The original proclamation was about "shitty Wouxun" radios.. Not UV-5R radios.

I was using the UV5R as an example.  But radio is radio.  And while the big name manufactures DO markup their prices a good bit from teh actual investment in the radio they are selling, there are still technical differences that make them better.  Now, granted the WouXun, BaoFeng and other CCR's are FAR less expensive new than the Motorola counterparts, there is a reason for at least PART of that difference.  And the part I am pointing out is the selectivity of the receiver.  And I will say that they are NOT what they were either. Going back to the Maxtracs and Maratrac's, you have to retune the first filter stages to get them out of band.  If you got a 150 - 174 radio and thought you would just put 2 meter frequencies, you found it didn't work worth a hoot.  At least until you retuned the front end.  They aren't that tight any more.  But they aren't bad either.  Point is that good filters cost money, and a 200 dollar radio is not gonna have those filters. 

Now I am not gonna argue that the radio will not perform without those filters, because it will work in most situations.  But when you get into an area with a lot of intermod and high RF, those missing filters become apparent. 

 

Guessing the Woo Sun or funky bowl radios all come out a different door at the same factory no doubt. 

And for the record,,, YOU said shitty,,, not me. 

[OffRoaderX]

13 minutes ago, WRKC935 said:

And for the record,,, YOU said shitty,,, not me. 

No, I didnt. I was quoting the proclamation made earlier in the thread. Keep up.

[DONE]

6 hours ago, OffRoaderX said:

No, I didnt. I was quoting the proclamation made earlier in the thread. Keep up.

fair enough

[SteveShannon]

There’s absolutely never been a doubt in my mind that Motorola radios have better receivers than Baofeng.  

My point was (and remains) that most recreational users of the GMRS would be better off with a set of radios they can just buy off the shelf and use, such as some of the Wouxun models or even Baofeng models.  They are not well served by suggestions that they buy a used commercial radio and have it reconfigured to work for GMRS.  They may not even know what to request, much less be able to find the right CPS, and certainly not aligning a radio.  

Now for a person who’s interested in radios, a true radio aficionado and especially if they’ve invested in the tools and software needed, these second hand commercial radios are excellent opportunities.

[axorlov]

1 hour ago, Sshannon said:

My point was (and remains) that most recreational users of the GMRS would be better off with a set of radios they can just buy off the shelf and use, such as some of the Wouxun models or even Baofeng models.  They are not well served by suggestions that they buy a used commercial radio and have it reconfigured to work for GMRS.  They may not even know what to request, much less be able to find the right CPS, and certainly not aligning a radio.

I agree with that. Not everybody needs Benz E-class, or can afford it, for many Yaris is fine. But if in car world the difference is obvious for recreational users, in a radio world few understand how sensitivity and selectivity work together and why selectivity may be important. Or may not be important, it all depends on usage case.  Certain clown on youtube, who kisses(!) and licks(!) Baofengs on camera is not helping. Disgusting...

[gortex2]

And folks continue to wonder why Midland is so popular in the market.... For the exact reasons you both mentioned above. Simple. Basic. 

[axorlov]

20 minutes ago, gortex2 said:

Simple. Basic. 

And expensive. It is simple basic Yaris for the price of Camry. Next year Midland will release MTX650 where they add banks/zones, and bump number of programmable slots to the whopping 64, and will price it at $800. It will be Yaris for the price of Lexus GS. And it'll go like hotcakes too! All thanks to youtube influenzers.

[gortex2]

I agree they may be a bit more, but $150+/-  for a 15 watt mobile in either HHCH or not is expensive when folks are looking. Its simple. I had bought a DB-20 for my father and he hated it. He came from CB and just wanted a channel number and easy to change PL. The 115 was the perfect fit for him, then when my mother grabbed a new Jeep she wanted something with just the head. The 275 fit that bill. I run the 115 on all my tractors and utility vehicles. Its simple rugged to some extent and cheap. And anyone can pick up the mic and talk. That's the benefit Midland has. I agree features are lacking but as said a real radio person will grab another devise. Myself its an APX. But as far as simple the Midland is what works. This weekend my Brother in law was here with his side by side. I grabebd a couple midlands from my box of junk and handed him one to use while we rode around. Simple and effective. When we got back he got on Midlands site and ordered the 115 bundle with mount and antenna for his sxs.

I guess I am a bit biased to Midland for GMRS being my first GMRS rig was a midland (xstal radio I may add) that I had to wait 3 months for from the radio shop after giving a copy of our license to the vendor before he would order it..... Times have changed....but Midland is still the leader in the market and will continue to be for the simple folks who just want to order a radio and use it. 

 

Anyway we are way off the XTS5000 topic so I'll stop here. The XTS is a rock solid performer for UHF. If you can find a Vehicle Adapter and use the antenna, speaker and mic you will have a slick little setup. Ran one like that for years on public safety, ham and GMRS. Never installed an amp on mine because I would swap out handhelds depending on the days function but know many that run VHF or UHF amps with the VA that love them. 

The little brother per say is the XTS2500 and that is also a great little UHF radio. Bit smaller form factor and no XTVA for it but solid and in use for PS all over the country. 

 

[OffRoaderX]

42 minutes ago, axorlov said:

Certain clown on youtube, who kisses(!) and licks(!) Baofengs on camera is not helping. Disgusting...

That clown has never licked or kissed a Baofeng on camera.. That clown is also responsible for introducing more people to GMRS and helping them get their license than anyone else on Youtube and has brought laughter and joy to thousands...  What have you done?

2 hours ago, Sshannon said:

My point was (and remains) that most recreational users of the GMRS would be better off with a set of radios they can just buy off the shelf and use, such as some of the Wouxun models or even Baofeng models.  They are not well served by suggestions that they buy a used commercial radio and have it reconfigured to work for GMRS.  They may not even know what to request, much less be able to find the right CPS, and certainly not aligning a radio.  

Excellent point - sadly, "some people" do not seem to have the ability to grasp this concept as they appear to be totally incapable of thinking outside of their own existence - as proven already right here in this thread, and thousands of times in other posts on this forum.  

..all that said, I do love my XTS5000..

[axorlov]

11 minutes ago, OffRoaderX said:

That clown has never licked or kissed a Baofeng on camera.. That clown is also responsible for introducing more people to GMRS and helping them get their license than anyone else on Youtube and has brought laughter and joy to thousands...  What have you done?

Or really? Never? Lol. And if you keep patting yourself on your own back that hard, you're at risk of growing hair on your palms.

[gman1971]

16 hours ago, Sshannon said:

There’s absolutely never been a doubt in my mind that Motorola radios have better receivers than Baofeng.  

My point was (and remains) that most recreational users of the GMRS would be better off with a set of radios they can just buy off the shelf and use, such as some of the Wouxun models or even Baofeng models.  They are not well served by suggestions that they buy a used commercial radio and have it reconfigured to work for GMRS.  They may not even know what to request, much less be able to find the right CPS, and certainly not aligning a radio.  

Now for a person who’s interested in radios, a true radio aficionado and especially if they’ve invested in the tools and software needed, these second hand commercial radios are excellent opportunities.

Fair points.

There are several people I know around here (where I live) that work in construction related jobs, some are crane operators, some do siding work, glass, etc, but they all use inexpensive Midland FRS/GMRS bubblepack radios from Walmart. We usually get together on a weekly basis, and they've shown unusual interest in the Motorola stuff I carry, but then I am the first person to tell them its just not worth the hassle, nor the cost. I keep telling them that if the Midland gives up the "smokey ghost", just go get another one, and there will be a lot of "giving up the ghost" before you can break even with one XPR7550e (especially now given the pricing of things) 

But then again, these guys don't need 50+ miles range, they aren't building digital interconnect systems, have no interest in a GMRS license, nor a HAM, and let alone acquire a membership in this forum, nor any of the other radio sites either; which clearly shows that they are not interested in the radio hobby at all, not even a hint. They use cellphones and don't think for a moment about using a radio to communicate with their family, friends, or their cat.

Now, it is probably safe to assume that the people who come to this forum, and become members after getting the GMRS license, are present or future/potential radioaficionados (people who like radios and/or have shown interest in them), well, provided they can endure the rigors of figuring things out in the beginning, and dealing with not so great ranges like the "movies" promise you'll have, etc... and for that I feel its just best to not sugarcoat the reality of things: If you want performance, you'll have to pay to play at some point: be it with higher grade equipment, or paying up for a rental space on a tower, a better antenna,  filters, etc.

Sometimes it just feels (to me) that the more experienced members only push for the cheap stuff, all the time, (which might be okay for some, fair point) but perhaps should also convey the other points you've mentioned as well: the points about the higher tier brand radios; maybe even hinting the new GMRS operators that if they really want to go all in, they'll probably have to go the extra mile, or invest in higher tier equipment, learn a few things, etc. That is all.

G.

[gman1971]

13 hours ago, OffRoaderX said:

Excellent point - sadly, "some people" do not seem to have the ability to grasp this concept as they appear to be totally incapable of thinking outside of their own existence - as proven already right here in this thread, and thousands of times in other posts on this forum.  

And... would you care to enlighten all of us about my existence? Have we met in another life?

G.

[gman1971]

On 5/30/2022 at 9:37 PM, axorlov said:

I can't say anything regarding Wouxun, I do not own any, my buddies do not own them either. But it worth noting that there is at least one CCR brand that is truly a garbage.

Yep, UV5R is just the bottom of the barrel, I think the BF-888s is a better radio b/c its cheaper. Those UV5R radios drop a whopping -27 dBm in RX desense when exposed to strong RF interference... 

I owned a Wouxun KG-UV6D back in the day, which also was one of my first radios, BTW, along with a bunch of GT-3, a Puxing with crossband, an UV-82. Around the same time I also purchased my first Kenwood TM-V71a as base. Range wasn't that great from base to portables, well, until I got my first TH-F6a, and somehow range improved quite a bit, I was able to reach a lot further in congested Detroit outer suburbs vs. any of the other radios I had at the time (10 miles, although spotty coverage, vs less than 2), that was including the Wouxun, and the Puxing, which both were some of the better CCRs at the time, in fact, I think the Wouxun still is but anyhow, the GT-3 (an UV5R clone) range was literally measured in tenths of a mile.

At the time I had no idea about what dynamic sensitivity was, nor what receiver desense meant, selectivity, etc, all I remember reading in the forums was a call for more sensitivity, buy the latest and greatest CCRs, I remember the disparage and hatred towards Motorola, to avoid them b/c they'll send black SUVs to my door if I tried to use their equipment without license, and to top it off was that I'll get a mega fine if the FCC found out I didn't have a license.... and so I did: I followed the "experts" advice to the letter: Radios had to have the highest sensitivity in the brochure, I avoided Motorola like the plague, got my GMRS license to avoid those hefty fines and doubled down in CCRs... 

Unfortunately following the "experts" advice didn't get me very far. B/c most "experts" weren't concerned about explaining what a radio system required to have long reach, or to be reliable, nobody ever explained to me you how you can compare receiver performance, taking opinions out of the equation... As a noob I kept hearing the same talking points: the feedline is very important, antenna is the most important component on the system... but nobody gives you a clue as to how the heck do you evaluate antennas, how you measure the quality of a feedline?... or what the heck is desense, or this or that? So you are left with trusting the most vocal and the best bro-science members in the forum. 

Anyhow... need to work on my existence outside of this forum now...

G.

[SteveShannon]

5 hours ago, gman1971 said:

Fair points.

There are several people I know around here (where I live) that work in construction related jobs, some are crane operators, some do siding work, glass, etc, but they all use inexpensive Midland FRS/GMRS bubblepack radios from Walmart. We usually get together on a weekly basis, and they've shown unusual interest in the Motorola stuff I carry, but then I am the first person to tell them its just not worth the hassle, nor the cost. I keep telling them that if the Midland gives up the "smokey ghost", just go get another one, and there will be a lot of "giving up the ghost" before you can break even with one XPR7550e (especially now given the pricing of things) 

But then again, these guys don't need 50+ miles range, they aren't building digital interconnect systems, have no interest in a GMRS license, nor a HAM, and let alone acquire a membership in this forum, nor any of the other radio sites either; which clearly shows that they are not interested in the radio hobby at all, not even a hint. They use cellphones and don't think for a moment about using a radio to communicate with their family, friends, or their cat.

Now, it is probably safe to assume that the people who come to this forum, and become members after getting the GMRS license, are present or future/potential radioaficionados (people who like radios and/or have shown interest in them), well, provided they can endure the rigors of figuring things out in the beginning, and dealing with not so great ranges like the "movies" promise you'll have, etc... and for that I feel its just best to not sugarcoat the reality of things: If you want performance, you'll have to pay to play at some point: be it with higher grade equipment, or paying up for a rental space on a tower, a better antenna,  filters, etc.

Sometimes it just feels (to me) that the more experienced members only push for the cheap stuff, all the time, (which might be okay for some, fair point) but perhaps should also convey the other points you've mentioned as well: the points about the higher tier brand radios; maybe even hinting the new GMRS operators that if they really want to go all in, they'll probably have to go the extra mile, or invest in higher tier equipment, learn a few things, etc. That is all.

G.

I agree with nearly all of this and I especially appreciate the tone much more than the one you typically take against CCRs and “shitty Wouxuns”, which comes across as more of a condemnation of the people who buy them.  We should be able to discuss the things that make radios great without needing to constantly denigrate less expensive radios and all who own them.

I’d like try a high end Motorola someday to see what it’s like.  Instead I have a really nice Garmin that works best for my purposes with it’s built in mapping of other Garmin users and I have Yaesu and Alinco analog/digital handhelds for 2m/70cm.  

I did buy a couple Baofengs to see what all the hoopla was about and learn Chirp, and they work, but I rely more on the other radios.  The Baofengs are good to give the grandkids.  I also have some older Midland GMRS/FRS handhelds and a pair of Motorola Talkabouts that were their highest power bubble pack radios at the time.  But I don’t have a Wouxun, yet.

Thanks for the pleasant post.