Guest, asking for input on a Community communication system

[Guest Leslie Benscoter]

We have a small community group and a communications group. There is an interest in some form of radio communications to set
up for general and emergency uses. The community is in the Oregon Coast Range, mountains in the Deadwood Creek Area.

For general information we would appreciate an estimate of costs to set up a repeater at the community center. The rural fire building is also close by. The coverage would approximate a 10 mile radius and could involve 20 to 30 folks who are in the group.The general population of the area is 300 or so. -- a larger area. If there was need of another relay repeater it could be located in the Post Office and General Store which is apron 6 miles down river and covers area along Lake Creek.

Roughly -- an estimate of the repeaters and to each family for a radio. I guess the license is $35.00 to each family for 10 years.

Some in the group have been talking about LoRa stuff -- which I guess is not voice? Maybe not less expensive over time??

I have an Amateur License (AG7X) and am aware that this is not for everyone -- expense being one of the hurdles and of course the tests ... etc .... I know very little about the GMRS possibilities and advantages.

Thank You
Mr. Leslie Benscoter
90110 Lake Creek Mt Rd
Deadwood, Oregon
scooter@peak.org

[SteveShannon]

38 minutes ago, Guest Leslie Benscoter said:

We have a small community group and a communications group. There is an interest in some form of radio communications to set
up for general and emergency uses. The community is in the Oregon Coast Range, mountains in the Deadwood Creek Area.

For general information we would appreciate an estimate of costs to set up a repeater at the community center. The rural fire building is also close by. The coverage would approximate a 10 mile radius and could involve 20 to 30 folks who are in the group.The general population of the area is 300 or so. -- a larger area. If there was need of another relay repeater it could be located in the Post Office and General Store which is apron 6 miles down river and covers area along Lake Creek.

Roughly -- an estimate of the repeaters and to each family for a radio. I guess the license is $35.00 to each family for 10 years.

Some in the group have been talking about LoRa stuff -- which I guess is not voice? Maybe not less expensive over time??

I have an Amateur License (AG7X) and am aware that this is not for everyone -- expense being one of the hurdles and of course the tests ... etc .... I know very little about the GMRS possibilities and advantages.

Thank You
Mr. Leslie Benscoter
90110 Lake Creek Mt Rd
Deadwood, Oregon
scooter@peak.org

In GMRS relay repeaters which are networked to the original repeater are discouraged by the most recent interpretation from the FCC.

A lot depends on what infrastructure already exists.  Does your fire department already have a communications tower that a repeater antenna could use?
GMRS is really not a good choice for dedicated emergency services. The only positive attributes are price and availability. 
Each of your families will have to make a choice for which radios to buy based on price and features. They range from under $20 to hundreds of dollars. Repeaters can range from hundreds to many thousands of dollars.  If it must be reliable in an emergency don’t go cheap.

If you’re serious about wanting a price hire a commercial communications contractor to put together a quote backed by path studies and whatever kind of special needs your community has. 

[WRUU653]

One of the things you will find that is different in having a GMRS repeater is that it has to be opperated under one persons call sign unlike having a club call sign in Amateur radio. Your local Ham club is probably a good place to start for setting up a GMRS repeater. Just incase you didn't know there is one near this location called Herman Peak and another called SHUTTERS LANDING, to the south. The owners of those might also be worth speaking with. As @SteveShannon noted the linking of repeaters for GMRS is now officially frowned upon by the FCC. There is a collection of repeaters around Guerneville, Duncan Mills and Jenner California (I linked one of the larger ones). This area is similar to your area in terrain and proximity to the ocean and these are used for the community for fires, floods and local communication. You may like to get in touch with them. 

My wife and I like the Brookings area south of you so I'm always checking repeaters in the area and I have noticed more taking place. Good luck. 

[SteveShannon]

2 minutes ago, WRUU653 said:

One of the things you will find that is different in having a GMRS repeater is that it has to be opperated under one persons call sign unlike having a club call sign in Amateur radio. Your local Ham club is probably a good place to start for setting up a GMRS repeater. Just incase you didn't know there is one near this location called Herman Peak and another called SHUTTERS LANDING, to the south. The owners of those might also be worth speaking with. As @SteveShannon noted the linking of repeaters for GMRS is now officially frowned upon by the FCC. There is a collection of repeaters around Guerneville, Duncan Mills and Jenner California (I linked one of the larger ones). This area is similar to your area in terrain and proximity to the ocean and these are used for the community for fires, floods and local communication. You may like to get in touch with them. 

My wife and I like the Brookings area south of you so I'm always checking repeaters in the area and I have noticed more taking place. Good luck. 

We like the Brookings area also.  It has been years since we’ve been there, but we used to stay at a Best Western which had rooms that opened up right above the beach.

One thing I would do is make sure the radios I picked for this community communications project are all capable of receiving the fire department’s transmissions and make that a priority channel on power up.  That communication system is much more likely to receive the needed funding to make it reliable.

[Socalgmrs]

I totally disagree that gmrs is not a good service for emergencies for a small community.  Radios are cheap range is good and set up is super simple and 1 cheap license is needed for a whole family.   It works out extremely well here where I live.  Our valley is about 60 miles wide and about 100miles long and 1 repeater covers most of it and another one covers the rest. Then we have a bunch of neighborhood repeaters that keep smaller  areas in contact.   The cost of an ok repeater with a great antenna can be offset by having every donate a few bucks.  Heck you can even get a professional Motorola repeater I already set up on eBay for around $300 add coax and an antenna and as long as you have good height yiur going to cover more then enough ground. 

[WRTC928]

If you want to go the easier but more expensive route, BTech has a plug-and-play repeater system. It's not cheap, but it's literally all you need except the antenna and coax. It has all 8 repeater pairs and includes an auto-ID module. Put up your antenna, plug it in, and you're up and running. 

[OffRoaderX]

4 minutes ago, WRTC928 said:

Put up your antenna, plug it in, and you're up and running. 

Except for the tones.. You have to program your desired tone(s).

[WRTC928]

1 minute ago, OffRoaderX said:

Except for the tones.. You have to program your desired tone(s).

Okay, but that's pretty minimal and you don't even have to do that if you don't want to.

[Radioguy7268]

I don't think anyone really answered the OP's questions, although the information given is a bit lacking in details. A few questions that might help narrow things down.

1. What's your budget? Who will be in charge of decisions? Is this a centralized control, or left up to individuals that may or may not want to spend $$?

2. Do you plan to supply your own labor, or purchase a plug & play system?

3. Do you have ownership/control already of a location for the repeater?

4. Do you have a need to communicate with other existing radio users in the area? Will this be a private system just for your users? Or do you wish to share?

5. What is the elevation at this Community Center?  Do you have the ability to place an antenna and/or mast/tower at this location? What's the surrounding terrain like?

As far as a general shot at answers:

Bare repeater.  Used $500 to $1500   New $1000 to $5000  Need to allow for labor costs if you don't know how to program/install

Antenna & Duplexer system   New is the best option here, costs will vary greatly, but as little as $400, as much as $2500

Individual portables could be less than $50 or more than $500 depending on what folks might want. Bare bones GMRS repeater capable units are fairly cheap. Mobiles that mount in vehicles are more expensive.

LoRa  i'm assuming is LoRaWAN - which is effectively Long Range data bursts in the 900 MHz ISM band. Good for telematics & GPS, not so great for voice, but that begs the question of what's the primary use and purpose of this system?

If you're looking to do chit chat for local folks on a wide open community channel that anyone and everyone could join in on, then GMRS might be a pretty good choice. If you're looking for exclusivity or privacy, and you want to do tracking or data transmission, there might be better options.

[SteveShannon]

10 minutes ago, Radioguy7268 said:

I don't think anyone really answered the OP's questions, although the information given is a bit lacking in details. A few questions that might help narrow things down.

1. What's your budget? Who will be in charge of decisions? Is this a centralized control, or left up to individuals that may or may not want to spend $$?

2. Do you plan to supply your own labor, or purchase a plug & play system?

3. Do you have ownership/control already of a location for the repeater?

4. Do you have a need to communicate with other existing radio users in the area? Will this be a private system just for your users? Or do you wish to share?

5. What is the elevation at this Community Center?  Do you have the ability to place an antenna and/or mast/tower at this location? What's the surrounding terrain like?

As far as a general shot at answers:

Bare repeater.  Used $500 to $1500   New $1000 to $5000  Need to allow for labor costs if you don't know how to program/install

Antenna & Duplexer system   New is the best option here, costs will vary greatly, but as little as $400, as much as $2500

Individual portables could be less than $50 or more than $500 depending on what folks might want. Bare bones GMRS repeater capable units are fairly cheap. Mobiles that mount in vehicles are more expensive.

LoRa  i'm assuming is LoRaWAN - which is effectively Long Range data bursts in the 900 MHz ISM band. Good for telematics & GPS, not so great for voice, but that begs the question of what's the primary use and purpose of this system?

If you're looking to do chit chat for local folks on a wide open community channel that anyone and everyone could join in on, then GMRS might be a pretty good choice. If you're looking for exclusivity or privacy, and you want to do tracking or data transmission, there might be better options.

Also, if a high tower must be erected that could cost a few thousand depending on how high, new or used, and who does the work. 

[Guest Leslie Benscoter]

I need to digest all of the input.

Thanks to everyone, this is all helpful.

We are on emergency power right now. Have had a couple of outages this afternoon.

Have to go and tend to everything before it gets dark.

 

A thought I had when reading everything ... I am aware of the Herman Peak machine and have had lunch with the group.

We need to run this question by them next Wednesday when they have lunch in town and a general check in in the evening.

I can break W7FLO from my deck at 300 feet (Herman is at 2,000 plus a few) not sure how the coverage is up Deadwood creek.

The Community center owns the building and the fire hall so antenna placement is not a problem. We are getting a container of

emergency gear, not sure what communication gear is in this container? I think Ham Radio would cover everything really well -

except some folks are shy about license and money for gear. The cost of gear is significant - 2 meter may be an exception?

We have to do all of this by group and that means 30 people take a look at where we have been and where we want to go.

73 & The best to everyone. Thanks.

Mr. B - Deadwood, Oregon

[TDM827]

Sounds like you already are familiar with the need for emergency power. Unless you have something you can use, budget for battery backup and perhaps an emergency generator for your repeater. 

[SteveShannon]

On 2/24/2025 at 8:56 AM, SteveShannon said:

GMRS is really not a good choice for dedicated emergency services.

 

On 2/24/2025 at 11:28 AM, Socalgmrs said:

 

I totally disagree that gmrs is not a good service for emergencies for a small community.

 

Notice the word “dedicated” in my quote above. I think GMRS is great for regular community communications. But a repeater for the community is hard to dedicate to emergencies. People will use it to chat, kids will play with radios, and hobbyists will talk about antennas. The community has no legal way to reserve the frequency for emergencies. As a result some people will leave their radios off. How do you tell them to turn them back on? Remember, this is a ten mile radius community.