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I had to circle back to this. Congratulations sir, you have successfully planted this ear worm. I’m walking around humming this for hours wondering why…

I feel the community at large is welcoming. There're a lot of people i have met that love to share knowledge and experiences. Especially to help new people. I will say that there are several things that happen that can make some individuals seem abrasive. One is a combination of two things, being some folks just don't do well expressing opinions in writing, and others read things that have been written and attribute malice when there was no intent. Both of these cases can lead to misunderstandings and hurt feelings. Another issue that can make some people (including myself on occasion) have decades of experience, correct someone who is simply mistaken, and then the thread turns into a shit-show because ego starts to kick in. That said, i feel like those instances are far and few between. I also know for a fact that several members here argue like that hate each other, but are literally friends and spend social time together in person. (This applies to me and a small group here, too) So, not everything here is as it seems. So, generally speaking, if think GMRS operators and the community at large are welcoming and friendly. I would hope money isn't the only reason. I have seen Rich be very forgiving to people on all sides, paid members and free members. That said, if there truly is a problem with someone, paid member or not, I think there should be some grace... but if it's not resolved, definitely let them go after a few attempts.

Much less coughing up $$$ a year for a magazine, assuming they'll have one. I mean no self-respecting Nation Organization for GMRS Radio (subtle dig at Arrrrl) would not have a glossy, advert filled Magazine, would they? I can count on 1 hand for the most part, the number of people I talk to on GMRS, and we're all local to each other, no need for a nationwide group for us.

Question - what platform are you using so we can better address what’s happening.

Right or wrong, here is my take on national organizations. It is easy for them to lose their way once they get to a certain size/membership level. Two prime examples are: the NRA and the ARRL. I know my local amateur club is a non profit and they ask for a yearly $20 membership fee. The paid membership gives one voting rights in what the group does. Outside of voting rights, one can still use the repeaters and participate in meetings and other activities. Could GMRS benefit from a national group that lobbies Washington for us? Yes we could. But it has to be done right with plenty of checks and balances so it doesn't end up like the NRA or ARRL.

I didn’t know it was one, I just wanted to be sure I understood what you were saying and not make assumptions.

Cables with the FTDI chip are pretty much guaranteed to work with Linux, Mac OS and Windows 10/11 without any issues. One should always install the correct drivers before plugging the cable into your computer, especially Windows. The reason is that some operating systems will install a generic driver that may or may not work correctly. I have a couple of cheap Amazon cables with the Prolific chip in them. I had to manually install the correct drivers to get them to work with Windows. I never could get those cables to work with my 2018 Mac mini or my Mac mini M4.

I wanted to address this quote separately. For the most part this is correct. There is explicit additions for the use of "public service" type activities, (ie CERT and SkyWarn) - and businesses. But I also see that they are trying to push the businesses side out even though they have them grandfathered (for now).

Well, my local gmrs repeater has weekly nets. They use the radios to communicate with others around the area in a “hey hows it going today “ fashion. Yes people just have conversations on ours. I’m can call out anytime and someone will respond. Most of the time its a local ham operator. We have several pf them here that utilize the gmrs as well. As well as joining the weekly nets. Coming in the near future they will use said repeater for communication for an AIDS ride event. So as I see it, Different regions different types of transmissions. Yes, I am newly licensed, however also had a unit # under family for quite some time before that.

I think this is all spot-on. As a relatively experienced ham and relatively new GMRS user, I see GMRS/FRS as a highly individual service, focused on family and small groups using it for local commo. To look to GMRS for linked repeaters, higher power or social groups is trying to make it something it wasn't intended to be. Some of these ideas would actually be detrimental to the core users for the reasons discussed in their respective threads. When someone suggests these expansions of GMRS are already well-covered by the amateur radio service, I see ham criticized as being elitist, hostile and difficult to enter, yet I also see complaints of the same (human) behavior here in GMRS land, like this thread. For anyone interested, ham is very easy to get into these days and already offers ALL of the things that some GMRS users, especially new users, think would benefit GMRS/FRS. Want to work with repeaters? Ham repeaters outnumber GMRS repeaters 10:1 or more. Most repeater operations are local, but that can vary as desired. Want to participate in nets? Ham radio nets occur just about every day, often several times a day, on all bands. VHF for local and HF for longer distances. Want linking? Ham repeaters not only link to other ham repeaters, but also offer "Echolink", where one can participate in repeater nets with only a computer. Want more power? Amateur radio offers a power limit of 1,500 watts on most bands. Want more range? When propagation is good, one can literally talk around the world on a simple wire stretched up in the trees. Want to socialize or join a club? Ham radio clubs abound, and most have many activities. Want to help out in emergencies? Many hams are very active in emergency and community service contexts. Ham has ARES, RACES and works closely with the National Weather Service during weather events. Our reports go directly to the NWS for distribution to the public and equipment calibration. During any emergency, surviving repeaters are dedicated to emergency service. Individuals maintain battery/generator operated equipment that supports their stations and can continue working during grid-down situations. The equipment for UHF/VHF is about the same as GMRS and many devices can operate in both arenas. There are three levels of the amateur radio license: Technician, General and Amateur Extra. The technician exam is pretty easy and requires a minimum of study, which is well-supported by many 'practice exam' sites. I am a Volunteer Examiner for the FCC and our club give exams almost every month. We seldom see people fail the Tech exam and have had kids as young as 9 years old pass the exam. We are very welcoming and encouraging and are honestly disappointed when someone fails the exam. We give new Tech free membership to our club for the first year, and some clubs provide free radios to new Techs. Help and technical advice is freely given, although, just like here, you will occasionally encounter a person who insists that since you got you license you should therefore know everything needed. As one progresses through the several license levels, privileges are increased, but even Technician offers all of the things I mentioned above, except perhaps talking around the world on a piece of wire. It is true you will find some elitist, grumpy old hams (not like here where everyone is jovial, friendly, welcoming and non-critical), but the clear answer is to simply spin the dial to another of the almost unlimited frequencies. Ham radio is not channelized like CB or FRS/GMRS and there are plenty of good places to be. Bottom line: If the GMRS radio service doesn't fit your idea of good radio, there may be another radio service that does. Instead of trying to change the service to match your ideas, it is likely better to find a radio service that actually serves your needs.

I really like the way you said this. That is one of the big reason I (and a few of my friends) have no interest in HAM. Many of the things we do are very much - locally. There is no need to chat with people a couple states away who are disconnected to what we're doing or going through (storms, etc). That's what email, social media, and cell phones are for. (although the prepper types will point out that potential issue here, and that, I understand the need for a dedicated communications expert to get information from further distances. but not everyone needs that)

ah yes, You're right on that. That is my bad. However, I do generally see some of the unwelcome vibe in social media sites. It does seem more 'specific' I guess here on this site. Thank you for pointing out my mistake.

You think that's amazing, consider that with a handheld Yagi antenna an amateur can talk through the International Space Station's 2m/70cm (VHF/UHF) crossband repeater using a 5w handheld radio. Five watts, to reach a repeater hundreds, even a thousand miles away. But what's different about the ISS? It's not that the repeater is a ham repeater. It's not that the repeater has some amazing antenna. It's not that it's got a million dollar radio. It's that there's nothing between you on the ground, and the repeater up in space. Line of sight. So if you're able to reach a repeater 75 miles away reliably from an antenna that is 10 feet above the ground, that repeater's antenna must be at about 1050 feet above the ground between the two of you. Otherwise the curvature of the earth gets in the way. As an example, I can easily hit this repeater: But I can hit it because I live at 1600m, the repeater is at 1700m, and everything between us is at 1200m. We have line of sight.

I thought I would try to give an explanation about repeater codes since it has been a topic lately on the air. I think it is much easier to grasp if you look at it from the point of view of LISTENING. Codes are a way for a radio to IGNORE or REJECT signals that the listening operator DOES NOT want to hear. Any radio with a code set on its RECEIVE frequency will only open the squelch to let the properly coded signal audio “break” through. The code is a key to the lock. The assigned code must be present in the signal from the TRANSMITTING radio to open that lock and for the receiver to hear. Our community repeaters are programmed with that RECEIVE code set and expected so they only engage properly coded transmissions. They reject every other stray transmission that might be occurring on that receive frequency, (467 mHz). We have to put that code in our TRANSMITTING frequency when we program so the repeater will respond to our transmission. When the repeater “hears” you because the code indeed matches, electrical circuit magic instantaneously happens, and the repeater simultaneously re-transmits your message on the designated output channel (462 mHz). But, people listening for your radio signal from the repeater usually are only interested in that particular repeater’s transmissions, not the other noise happening in the background. So, for your benefit, repeaters are usually set with their own TRANSMIT code. If your radio has that matching code set for your RECEIVE frequency requirement, you, too, will only hear that repeater’s properly coded transmission. Your lock has been opened. But if you don’t set a receive code, ALL POSSIBLE signals on that channel will be heard by you, including the repeater signal you want. This code setting also provides a low level of protection against unauthorized people using the repeater or talking to you on your receive frequency, since a person must know the code being used to unlock either radio. Since there are only 8 repeater pair channels, there is a high level of duplication of the frequencies across the region. If they are close together geographically, these codes help keep the overlapping chatter separate, but it’s not perfect. Closing notes: 1) There are a couple hundred possible alpha numeric codes available consisting of two different types: CTCSS and DCS. 2) Not all manufacturers make available all the same codes. 3) It is possible to have any radio “fooled” into “hearing” a non-coded signal if a coded signal comes in at the same time, opening the squelch. 4) Your own radio is not required to have a receive code set, if you want to hear everything possible on the channel. I have done that with our own Gallatin and Grassland repeaters at times. I listen to two repeaters at once, no code. 5) It is possible, but uncommon, for a repeater to have one alpha numeric code for RECEIVE and use a different one for TRANSMIT, so you need to double check on the repeater listings for what is being used. 6) Remember when using the term TRANSMIT and RECEIVE, make sure you understand which radio in the conversation is being referenced. 7) Our community repeaters are “duplex” requiring the use of two frequencies. They listen on one and simultaneously and instantly retransmit our signals on the other. Our radio’s frequencies are “flipped” to do the same. The repeater receive (our transmit) is 5 mHz higher, with the decimal being the same. A radio hiccup (feature?): I noticed when I am scanning, my radio will rest silently on the Gallatin repeater when someone is transmitting on Grasslands, and vice versa, even with my codes set. So, the radio does “know” there is a transmission occurring, but it won’t let the audio come through the squelch without the right code. In my inexperience, it took me a minute to figure out what was going on! That’s why you may still see a receive light on a channel that has a silent radio. I've talked enough! Steve WSGH297

To think that linking, which in many ways was harmful to the objectives of a general mobile radio service. The FCC says the service is for the following: That really doesn't seem like the intent is for cross regional linked repeater networks. And I'm not really the bearer of bad news here; the FCC clarified this position a few months back. There may BE a case for cross-regional linked repeater networks available to people with "pay to play" instead of "test and pay to play" licenses. But that's almost going to have to be a separate service. The FCC has made it rather clear that service is not GMRS. So if there's a strong enough use case for such a thing to exist in the VHF or UHF spectrum, it would probably need to be addressed as its own distinct service. What killed GMRS? I would say that the news of its demise is greatly exaggerated. It's just not as interesting to repeater linking people. But there are somewhere around 1000 new licenses granted every month, and that number is growing, not shrinking. Discontinuation of linking, to me, seems like it would make GMRS more friendly as it becomes more dedicated to neighborly regions, less about if someone in KY can talk to someone in VA and someone else in MA. But that's just speculation on my part. As for forum friendliness, we seem to have gotten the most abusive forum contributor sorted out. The rest of us are just typical grumps, not blatantly abusive grumps. Within individual repeaters where people talk amongst themselves, and where weekly nets often get held, I haven't seen any change in my area recently, other than a few repeaters becoming more active over time. In my area, for example the "West 1" repeater used to be a lot more quiet, and now seems to host nets and have more chatting going on than it used to. But again, the real purpose the FCC envisions for GMRS doesn't seem to be weekly nets and idle repeater rag chewing with other strangers. It's short-distance two-way voice communications ... to facilitate the activities of licensees and their immediate family members. The word "activities" is useful here. While rag chewing might be considered an "activity", I suspect they used the word thinking more of family outings, friends out doing things, and so on. Hiking, caravaning, RVing, offroading, skiing, small-craft boating, going to amusement parks, shopping, being tourists, camping, cycling, road-rallying, motorcycling, family reunioning, facilitating events... sorry to disappoint but radio as a hobby in and of itself is more in the domain of ham radio.

Is there a mountain between you and the further away repeater like with the closer one? I regularly and normally connect to a repeater 69 miles away on my handheld radios and using my base-station with a big antenna on the roof, i can connect to repeaters 80 or 90 miles away - yet there are other repeaters 10 miles away that I cant connect to because of hills/mountains.

Gregg is unlikely to be harassed. He has an easy going pleasant personality.

I have to agree with @SteveShannon. He tends to articulate better than I do. I don’t think you are being met with gatekeepers but rather people who want to preserve the availability to all users of the GMRS/FRS channels. That’s where I am coming from at least. Including those that have no interest in getting a license. People that use FRS for talking in campgrounds, between vehicles on family trips, little kids having fun, four wheelers, and on and on. People who will never even come to this site get a license or join a club but just want to use radios for what they are doing. These are all as important and valid as anything else. Try and organize and change a simple service for the people and make it into something that already exists elsewhere and you may see some pushback. For instance local ham clubs near me support bike races, marathons and other activities. just the sort of thing you look to do. They use simplex or their own repeaters to do so. One such club even has a dedicated repeater for such things. Plenty of room on the ham frequencies to do this as well as organized use of the bands and frequencies and it’s great that they do this. Would this also be great on GMRS? Not so much room on GMRS. I have witnessed people thinking that because they put a repeater on a GMRS frequency/channel that they somehow have priority to that channel, that it’s theirs. It is not, they do not. Yes we should all be respectful. So people may have concerns and wish to preserve what is all of ours. As for helping people understand how to use radios, set up repeaters, use of tones, programming, equipment reviews or troubleshooting this place, this forum is here for all that. No gatekeeping isn’t met very well here. My interpretation of gatekeeping is not sharing knowledge, which is just wrong. We can all work on making this site more welcome. But you didn’t ask about this site, you asked “Has GMRS lost its welcoming vibe?”. I don’t know but if it has it’s because some people think it’s theirs and I would just bet they are part of a club and not the kids up the street giggling on their radios.

It’s possible that it is tropospheric ducting. It’s also possible that the farther repeater’s signal is getting to you because they have a very high antenna or because it is reflecting off something or refracting over a sharp edge. And it’s also possible that the distant repeater is linked with a nearby repeater. If your radio doesn’t have a receive tone set, it won’t matter what the repeater output tone is; your radio will allow the audio to be reproduced.

You're not being targeted/harassed (yet). Say (post) something the Jeep crowd doesn't like and report back later. There are several that should have been banned but they have paid memberships.

I'm not completely convinced about the HAM part. but I am going to defer my opinion and agree with this. I do feel that each of the systems have many great uses for them.

I had not considered all of that, but now that you mention it. I see it, and have to agree whole heartedly. I myself used to only listen from my FRS and an old Baofeng UV-82 for years. I was lazy and was convinced at one point that if I even tried to talk on GMRS without a license I was going to jail. So I was content with listening in like a car radio. I remember when the repeaters around me all started going silent too. Thank you for that perspective.

HAM is the ultimate emergency communications. It's just the ham'ers are going about it the wrong way. I had to explain to my county's EM Coordinator why ham was not only important but would be the fallback when the county's 911 system failed. And it isn't either/or anyway; ham and gmrs (and frs) can all be used together as needed.

greetings all! new to gmrs radio and had a repeater question. anyone now how its possible for my base station (20w) radio to make contact (receive & transmit) to a repeater that's over 75 miles away? i'm using a amazon special gmrs fiberglass antenna that's only mounted 10 ft off the ground. i have a local repeater approx. 6 miles away that uses .575 frequency with a tone of 162.2 in and out. i can't connect with it due to a mountain in between it and my location. as stated, the other evening i was able to communicate with the repeater that's further away which does have a .575 frequency with a tone of 162.2 in but 198.8 out. i'm not sure how this is possible; am i some how connecting to the repeater local to me and it relaying he signal to the further repeater even though it has a different output tone?

I did, and thank you. I might go out on a limb here and say for the most part that seems like the only "nice" section. It's gets a little wild outside of there.