berkinet

Well, actually you were questioning the rules. And, IMO, it was a legitimate and fair question and a question others here might also have. Unless we ask questions, how else can we learn how and why things are, and what we can, should and shouldn't change.

If you can already hit the repeater from the handheld, I would go as low-cost as possible for the external antenna. A simple quarter wave with ground plane should do just fine and cost very little. In fact, with a little bit of searching you can probably find several sites with plans for making one of your own.

I covered this topic on another thread. I downloaded the software, and ran it in a VM. It looks like it is written by the same OEM company that manufactures the MXT400 for Midland. Of course, that is not to say the copy on Dropbox is safe. But, if you use a VM (VirtualBox works fine, and is free) you don't really have to worry7.

You are only reading half of section (a). Read the entire paragraph. (a) Exceptions. Under certain exceptions, non-certified Personal Radio Service transmitters, or transmitters certified for use in the land mobile radio services may be operated. Any such exceptions applicable to stations in a Personal Radio Service are set forth in the subpart governing that specific service. See e.g., §§ 95.735 and 95.1735. That means in order for there to be an exception, it must be spelled out for the particular service the exception applies to. §Section 95.735 applies to Radio Control services and lists the allowed exception. However, although §95.1735 is in PartE, GMRS, it its empty. Therefore, there is no no exception set forth and paragraph (a) does not apply to GMRS.

Of course, it also depends on the availability of a frequency pair. Unlike GMRS, ham repeaters rarely share a frequency.

I think your radio club's interpretation may be incorrect. To start, we have... 47 CFR § 95.335 - Operation of non-certified transmitters prohibited. § 95.335 Operation of non-certified transmitters prohibited. Except as provided in paragraph (a) of this section, no person shall operate a transmitter in any Personal Radio Service unless it is a certified transmitter; that is, a transmitter of a type which has obtained a grant of equipment certification for that service, pursuant to part 2, subpart J of this chapter. Use of a transmitter that is not FCC-certified voids the user's authority to operate that station. See sections 302(a), (b, and (e) of the Communications Act (47 U.S.C. 302(a), (b, and (e)). (a) Exceptions. Under certain exceptions, non-certified Personal Radio Service transmitters, or transmitters certified for use in the land mobile radio services may be operated. Any such exceptions applicable to stations in a Personal Radio Service are set forth in the subpart governing that specific service. See e.g., §§ 95.735 and 95.1735. ​§ 95.735 is about radio-control services. But 95.1735 is in Part95R, GMRS. However, that section is [Reserved]. I.e.it is blank. So, there is a place to allow exceptions, but it was never used. Not a good sign. Next, The statement quoted by the radio club is from a 2017 PowerPoint presentation and is not actual law. In other words, it is not in Title 47 of the Code of Federal Regulations (CFR) which contains Part95, Personal Radio Services. But, the biggest problem is the statement... We will continue to certify equipment that meets the respective technical standards for Part 90 (land mobile) and Part 95 (GMRS) in both services, if requested. This does not say it is Ok to use Part90 radios in GMRS. It clearly says such radios can be submitted for GMRS certification (As long as they are not "...equipped with the capabilities to operate in services that do not require equipment certification, such as the Amateur Radio Service.") Now, it is possible an individual or group, other than a seller of the radio, could apply for certification. But, as far as I know that has never been done. And, given the costs, it is not likely it will ever happen. I, for one, wish your radio club's interpretation were correct, but it certainly seems it is not.

While the information you posted is correct, without any further explanation it might not explain the whole issue of using Certified GMRS equipment. This is especially true for those new to GMRS. So, for their benefit... a quick search of the MyGMRS forum will show that this is a regular, and oft debated topic. I think the major points come down to: The FCC specifically mandates the use of certified GMRS equipment on the service.Part90 certified equipment exceeds the technical requirements for GMRS, but does allow the user to operate outside the GMRS band, which is not allowed. BTW, The ICOM F221 is Part90 certified.There is some evidence, though not explicit, that the FCC turns a blind eye to the use of Part90 equipment on GMRS.There is no way anyone can tell if a given signal comes from a certified GMRS radio. (Though, you can tell if it comes from a poor quality transmitter.)There are no recorded cases of anyone ever being cited for operating a non-certified radio on GMRS.Most GMRS repeaters on the air today are not certified.There is some question as to whether older certified GMRS Part95A equipment (I.e. from before the end of combined GMRS/FRS radios in 2017) is still certified for use under the new Part95E. The FCC has never addressed the question, so, it is assumed it is still certified. But, the certification standards are not the same.Now, I am not going to tell anyone they should not concern themselves with the FCC rules. What I will say, and this just echoes an opinion commonly expressed on this forum, is each person has to decide for themselves what they should do as far as their choice of radio equipment.

Yup, you missed it ;-) Look for CTCSS (Continuous Tone-Coded Squelch System)

There has been a fair amount of discussion on the Midland antennas. You might want to look through some other threads. But, in general, I think the comments were not particularly favorable towards the Midland products.

Thanks for the clarification. So, I carefully went back and carefully re-read all of the posts in this thread. Honestly, I do not see any that were, to me anyway, in any way snarky or critical of anyone, at least up until you made the claim that such posts had been made. However, there were a couple written in a jocular style, often common in tech/radio discussions. There are also people who write straight declarative information and just start and end with facts. I am sorry if you thought anything in this thread was directed negatively at you or at someone new to GMRS or radio in general. Without referring to anyone in particular, I would note it is an odd irony that people into radio are often not the best communicators. I would also suggest some people you have blocked may be among those who have the best technical understanding on the forum and if you do not see their posts, you may miss some important information. And, before closing, if you wish to PM me with a pointer to a post you find specifically concerning, I would be happy to discuss it with you offline. Finally, in any case, thanks again for answering and I think the matter is pretty much closed, at least for me.

I do not go in for beatting of dead horses. But, IMO, after the comments made about participants on this forum, I think perhaps @marcspaz's post deserves a reply. I, for one, would like to know if you somehow confused two separate forums or did you mean you reported the posts you found offensive to the moderator's and they removed them, or is there some other explanation. I like this forum, and I'd like to see it remain a friendly place for all. So, to me, leaving unresolved issues to fester is not a good idea.

Start with a good quality 1/4 wave antenna on an NMO mount. If you find there are stations that you hear, but weakly, then try a 3db gain of some type. Lots of recommendations on the forum. But, most likely, you will be fine with the 1/4 wave.

Not to be (too) picky. But, I am pretty sure ERP is measured at the antenna and would therefore not include any external reflectors, etc. The FCC defines ERP as the product of the power supplied to the antenna and the antenna gain (when the power and gain are represented in linear terms).

I did not see the posts in question. However, I am very surprised to hear about snarky criticism on this forum. This is probably the best behaved online group or forum I have ever participated in. Yes, I have seen a couple of disagreements, but even then, the discussion was always fact based and never mean spirited. Is it possible you are being a little sensitive? That has actually happened before, and when the issue was noted and people explained their views and why they had posted them, the problems vanished. And, on a few rare occasions, the criticism of the poster was justified, behavior changed and we all moved on. Just my 2¢ worth.

No disagreement. Only a reminder to readers of a point @Jones made earlier. There is a place for thin cables, particularly in a mobile environment. Also, in a case where the radio is at a window and the antenna line goes out the window and a few feet up to an antenna. Noted in these forums before, but always important to keep in mind: Perfect is the enemy of good. If someone deployed 50 feet of RG58 to their antenna and can reach all the repeaters and mobiles they want, then that is probably a good time to stop.

I would say (and have said to anyone who will listen) start with a cheap 1/4 wave antenna (I.e. no gain). Then, if that doesn't work, take a look at something else. 9 time out of 10 you will just stick with the 1/4 wave.

You, and the FCC are both correct in principle. However, in practice a 3 or even 6db difference with FM transmission is not going to overpower someone like it would on CB. There are a few things that affect that. First is capture effect. With FM transmission (remember GMRS is FM, CB is AM) you tend to hear the most powerful only and nothing else on the same frequency - it is called capture effect. However, since distance is a huge factor is signal strength, proximity usually counts far more than a 3db or 6db difference in power. Second, and more important, on UHF communications the common rule is make sure the channel is clear before you transmit. This can be an issue when there is more than one repeater on a frequency, using different PL/DCS tones. You won't hear if the channel is busy. So, in practice people will tell you you were cut off, or you just try again a minute later. Some higher end radios will have a channel busy lamp that lets you see if the channel is busy even if you are not hearing something. And, last, again unlike CB, because UHF is line of sight, the number of stations you can interfere with is limited. It sound confusing, but you will get used to it and in the end it is not a big problem. I would say go with the lowest gain antenna that suits your needs.

I do not own an MXT 400, so I can’t comment on how you should program it. However I can’t answer your question regarding regarding the travel tone,. “Travel Tone” is just a nickname for the 141.3 Hz PL tone. And, regarding input and output tones. The input tone to the repeater is the tone the repeater requires to be present in order to repeat your signal. The output tone is the tone the repeater transmits to allow you to listen to only the repeater you want and not other activity on the same channel. The input tone and output time do not have to be the same tone. And in fact fairly frequently they are not. This can create a problem if you have an MXT 400 because by default that radio uses the same tone to send to the repeater as well as to receive from the repeater. As noted earlier in another thread, it seems that it is possible to configure the MXT 400 to use different tones. But, for now in your case you don’t need to. I think I have probably already answered your question number two, but in case it wasn’t clear here is the answer directly. The tones are specified usually with the repeater frequency. For example where you have listed 462.55 MHz/141.3 Hz. The 141.3 Hz is the PL tone. has noted at the start of this post, I don’t know exactly how are you set the tone for a channel. But I’m sure it’s in the manual somewhere, and someone else is likely to come along with an answer for you as well.

As there are no more GMRS or FRS channels, there is no need to block transmission on any frequencies other than the GMRS repeater inputs on those radios that are repeater capable*. OTOH, depending on the default configuration of the radio, it may be necessary to adjust bandwidth and power settings on some channels for FRS users. * EDIT Footnote added. There were never many GMRS/FRS combined radios that were repeater capable anyway. And, any new FRS certified radios don't need to (can't?) be configured.

A) This is true only as applies to the channels you note (1-7) A fixed station is defined by the FCC as A station at a fixed location that directly communicates with other fixed stations only. C) Repeater control is one common use of fixed stations. The control is usually done by audible (DTMF) tones since data is not generally allowed on GMRS. However, a Fixed station could also be used to control a remote station. For example if you lived in a deep valley and had installed a station on a hill-top that you could remotely manage and use as a relay. There are other possible fixed scenarios, but they are similar in nature.

For most purposes the difference between 3 and 5 watts will be undetectable. OTOH, the 3 watt radio is likely to have better battery life. As commented elsewhere, GMRS/UHF is not as much about power as it is about antenna location. Higher is always better.

Probably. As long as the same tone is used on both the repeater's input and output, which would typically be the case where "travel Tone" is used.

That would not qualify as a fixed station. A "fixed" station is one that communicates solely with one or more other stations, usually for control or linking purposes. The fact that @Riktar's station could, and probably will, contact stations other than his brother makes it a base station and not a "fixed" station. The FCC defines a Fixed Station as: A station at a fixed location that directly communicates with other fixed stations only.

This has been addressed before. But, in very basic terms UHF range is limited to line of sight. If a basic 1/4 wave antenna (I.e. no gain) covers the line of sight area, adding more gain will make no difference. On the other hand, if you have a clear view to the horizon, and will be contacting stations near the edges of that coverage, extra gain might help. Keep in mind, this is not CB and the radio propagation is quite different.

Read this post, and the thread it is found in before you do anything else. https://forums.mygmrs.com/topic/1837-midland-gmrs-product-updates/?p=17118