kidphc

NO HOA... You are lucky. No one said you had to start HF with a 50 foot tower and complete array with rotator and amplifiers. A good dipole, fan dipole will work up in the trees If you are a hobby technician/electrical guy. Then shocking enough you have the skills and 1/2 the tools to home brew everything from antennas to radios. You might want to check out DIY antennas, and DIY QRP HF radio kits (not the best choice for todays conditions). The ground, you can drive an 8 foot ground and tie it into your house electrical ground. Pretty sure your house has main ground for the sub panel or the water main. You tie into those. On the second floor you have to be-careful because your ground line to the outside can become an antenna. There are artifical ground kits, to tune out the ground acting like an antenna, not to create a ground. If you knew CW... there is the key chain CW kit ($44 on Etsy) with a long wire, a 9 volt and a HF receiver you could be tapping CW for less then a $100. Either case have fun, shake your notions of what can and can't be done and get experimenting.

Congrats, wish I had done the same. Have fun. for me the learning never stops with this hobby. I never thought I'd have to become a pseudo electrician (all the electrical knowledge) pseudo astrophysicst (sunspots you know)pseudo mathematician (ideal angle for the sloper is, know how do I calculate they hypotenuse again?)pseudo audiologist ( omg was that dit-dah or dah-dit need to check why I can't hear it)pseudo botanist (now honey we can't plant that tree, it won't grow fast enough to give me the height I need for the dipole, or the venerable I think this antenna needs this leaf, so it looks more like a potted plant)pseudo camo expert (paint it this shade, it hides with the sky better).

Conversely, my local RC shop, went their for helis will do them for a nominal fee. It also introduces you into another very expensive hobby The peak rating for the power poles is the reason I went for them. My HV heli will generate in the order of 5000 watts [cant remeber exact numbers] of power at peak ( milliseconds) and about 80 amps. Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Yes crimp it on. I would recommend authentic tools and same with the poles. Knock offs don't work well, have a bag full of cheap Chinese ones to prove it. Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Aww ok.. I been having problems with focusing lately. I guess I must have had some more micro strokes. :/

Another style and a pic of the breakout/buss bar/distribution bar Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Round pieces? The terminals on the power supply? I took some 12 away wire and tinned them and inserted mine in. They had a screw to hold the leads in on my supply. From that wire I put power poles on and connected it to a power pole break out box. Then put power poles on my radio and connected to the breakout box. The breakout box has fuses for each of the connections. Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

For me power poles when ever I can. Generally, red 22-16awg wires, blue 16-14and yellow 12-10 awg. I imagine it is going to be 12-10 for most radios which has an eyelet of #10

*** UPDATE There was some concern about the fact that the NMO2/70B might have been a fake. The order was validated with Gigaparts as an original. Not sure if there are differences (material etc) from the original Larsen and the post merger PulseLarsen antennas. They say nothing has been changed. They did say not to tune the antenna due to the design. If I tune for 460 it will bring the 2m band out of tune. Due to the fact that the 460mHz band is about 10 mHz out of design band. The SWR looks about right, the more you get out of tune the faster and higher the VSWR climbs. if you are looking for something closer you may want to try something that has a wider range on 70CM or tuned up to 460 mHz. This is a reactance and SWR chart from some one who tested the antenna only on 2m. The SWR looks about the same https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/larsen-nmo-2-70-swr-reactance-chart-plus-a-tuning-question.562729/

True. that did a calculation, with all the pl259 connectors, and lightning arrestor and it came out to a little less then a dB. Sadly, still came out almost to a 4dB loss (estimated) with a 100ft run of LMR400.

Yeah figured it was something like that with you seaming to be heavy into public service. Just found out that the MARS anntennas are protected by the DOJ. Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Don't forget. Connectors. Boy do the losses add up with those.

Big negative to IRLP/digital over the internet is that if you have an infrastructure failure you may lose the whole system or at least large parts of it. Sooooo. Marc you MARS certified?

I reviewed it, either case the Larsen NMO 2/70b is a genuine from Gigaparts. It was bent up in transit and still has a kink in it. Beats me why Gigaparts took a 3 foot long whip and jammed it inside a 6"x6" box. Keep in mind the numbers are from the antenna not being tuned. I simply mounted the whip to the coil/base and took measurements. I also noted that there was a paint drip on the coil, not sure if that is affecting the numbers. Probably going to contact Larsen to see if I can get a new whip. The I will be getting clippers out to tune it bit better in the future. I don't transmit much on the GMRS/FRS frequency so the numbers didn't matter.They were acceptable for me as is. Since the signal reports are great. I have to really concentrate on rebuilding the center console, so I can get the FTM400 and android radio (APRS display) in.

Part of the reason Marc seams to dislikes the newer CB antennas. Even when they are at 102" he feels they are they are two short and make the radio even more deaf. He wish they were closer to 110" from what I gather. GMRS I would just suggest what ever you are going to install it. Make sure the antenna has no obstructions in it's line of sight. Even more so if it has a loading coil. The coil has to be above the roof rack, the windshield ect... I have seen significant noticeable differences just by clearing obstructions to the coil. Police cars can have the antennas about anywhere, from what I gather there are repeaters everywhere for them at least in an urban environment.

Whole heartland agree with all the above. The more I look at antenna designs the more all the different designs in a particular category tend to look similar. There is no one better antenna. A lot of manufacturing limitations do show up and effect the antenna. Type of materials used, how was everything soldered up etc. This seem to constitute a majority of price differences. Buy cheap get cheap, you don't do something for nothing neither does the manufacturer. The lower cost are usually due to no R&D (cloning), materials, lower labor cost and QA. Conversely, buying expensive doesn't assure you quality. Same with the name. I am finding more and more it is about what you can get away such as 1/4 vs 1/2 vs 5/8ths wave. The installation choice (how it is installed) has a much greater impact. Mobile is already a compromise at best. If you jam a 1/4 mounted to roof rack or magnet mount, you have to be realistic with the overall performance of the package. You have take a compromise and added more compromises, small and easy. You effect gain and ground plane. Both work with a multitude of factors and add up. In the VHF being cheap (quality) with connector, cabling etc, are worse with the losses. Thankfully, not as bad on mobile vs a base. They add up to make your radio more and more deaf. Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

If you like rag chewing about weird topics. Then HF or using a digital hot spot (old ham operator calls it fake amateur radio) may be the way to go. We had a 30 minute conversation over WiresX. He brought up a valid point, "i should just call you".

Now for the ear subjective test. Larsen NMO2/70B (open coil variant) The longest antenna out of the three, it is the thinnest of the the 3 antennas. Many antenna designers have a very similar or identical design. Don't let the SWR numbers fool you. This antenna due to the height and gain numbers easily hears repeaters and FRS users from far away. Although, mobiles can handle high SWR numbers better it is really starting to get border line. There is much less picket fencing (signal going in and out when moving), easily gets out further, when compared to the Larsen 2/70SH. A 2m repeater (60 miles away) was starting to break squelch but could not be copied with the 1/4 variant. Yes, the repeater is doing all the work, but it was annoying to have squelch breaks of white noise constantly. With the 2/70B I am able to make out copies with heavy to moderate hashing. The 2/70B, I am hearing a lot more FRS/GMRS users about, and can actually hear them. Not sure if I want to risk a radio transmitting on GMRS/FRS with it though. In a real emergency "F" the radio. It does wag around like a dog tail over every bump, I have yet to notice any ill effects due to this. Because of the flexibility, this will probably survive the longest, and I believe the NMO will rip out first. Because of how happy I am with this antenna, I am eyeballing 60" super gain antennas for the long trips up to Toronto through the mountains. A huge negative to many, you gotta look at drilling to maximize this antenna. Larsen 2/70SH This little 1/4 wave has a spring built into the base. The coil is about half way up the antenna clearing the roof rack. It is an enclosed type, so an eyeball needs to be kept on it as it gets older, to avoid water/ice buildup inside the coil wrapper as it ages.The whip is sturdy, it is about 8-10 gauge in diameter. Did I mention the beefiness. It out performed the UT72 on reception and transmitting. There was still a fair amount of picket fencing, I was starting to believe I couldn't do much about the multi-pathing. However, this antenna out shines the UT72 in reception. It was able to pick out signals 2-3 miles further out then the UT72. The 2/70sh is a keeper, for the trails and around town with low obstructions. When compared to the UT72 I believe a lot of the differences has to do with the coil location (couldn't get a clear view with the UT72) and the ground plane NMO vs magnetic mount. A huge negative to many, you gotta look at drilling to maximize this antenna. Nagoya UT72 The UT72 hears the least and gets the most static. It also has the most amount of picket fencing . I believe it is because the loading coil is built into the magnetic base. Which on my truck is below the roof rack. The big negative is that you can't swap out the antenna, since the magnetic mount uses and N style female connector. I may try in the future to get a ht whip and adapter. The pro, the cheapest and easiest to deploy, since with the base the antenna is about $27. Also the antenna base incorporates a spring. The antenna is fairly stiff, I have managed to knock off the magnetic mount when the spring failed to give enough, it is loud when this happens. SUMMARY A lot of the differences between the different antennas come down to ground plane and loading coil locations. Not so much who makes the better antenna. Really in honesty, that will change with materials and how it was designed. I choose Larsen, since every one of the antennas and NMO has parts available from the manufacturer. Not all manufactures will have parts available much less sell you every component. Either way you will see similar results with similar style antennas. So net effect, listen to the old timers, Break out the drill, and get yourself a nice SWR meter to maximize your antenna.

Larsen NMO 2/70B (Untuned) 2 meters 144-148 MHz 3.8 dBi 1/2 70 cm 440-450 MHz 5.2 dBi 1/2 + 3/8 144.000 MHz SWR 1.14:1147.999 MHz SWR 1.86:1 Lowest (144.4 MHz) SWR of 1.11:1 420.000 SWR 1.88:1450.000 SWR 1.82:1Lowest (438 MHz) SWR of 1.06:1 FRS/GMRS Frequencies462.5625 SWR 2.68:1467.7250 SWR 2.52:1Lowest (465.750) SWR 2.51:1 (doesn't matter out of band)

Larsen 2/70SH 144.000 MHz SWR 1.37:1147.999 MHz SWR 1.14:1 Lowest (146.96 MHz) SWR of 1.09:1 420.000 SWR 1.77:1450.000 SWR 1.44:1Lowest (444.6 MHz) SWR of 1.18:1 FRS/GMRS Frequencies462.5625 SWR 1.59:1467.7250 SWR 1.48:1Lowest (466.320) SWR 1.44:1 (doesn't matter out of band)

Nagoya UT72 on baking pan The stats from BTech 's website: https://baofengtech.com/NAGOYA-UT-72 144.562 National 2m SWR 2.53 :1144.000 MHz SWR 2.89:1147.999 MHz SWR 2.21:1159.300-163.500 lowest SWR of 1.18:1 420.000 SWR 1.92:1450.000 SWR 1.33:1444.900-445.800 lowest of SWR of 1.3:1 FRS/GMRS Frequencies462.5625 SWR 1.35:1467.7250 SWR 1.40:1 Nagoya UT72 on truck with about 20" of ground plane in all directions. Loading coil is below the roof rack. 144.000 MHz SWR 1.90:1147.999 MHz SWR 1.3:1 Lowest (148 MHz) SWR of 1.3:1 420.000 SWR 2.28:1450.000 SWR 1.36:1Lowest (447.3 MHz) SWR of 1.3:1 FRS/GMRS Frequencies462.5625 SWR 1.13:1467.7250 SWR 1.48:1

Heard the very simular setups when some agencies need to run more antennas on the old Bronco fiberglass topa. Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

Could always get a gladiator (probably not inclined as much to take the top off. Then you get a bed to work with. Or you can drill through the roof and put a big old piece of sheet metal inside as a ground plane

Those extra channels on the Midland are bit of bs. They basically are the regular channels set with tones. https://www.buytwowayradios.com/blog/2008/05/how_midlands_extra_channels_work.html Make sure the btech is set the same. Plus past channel 30 on the BTech settings won't be saved.

No offense. Just sad you went through the troubles and kinda got outed. Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk