Transmitting Power Limits

[NWHov]

 

I'm trying to understand the maximum power output for an FCC certified GMRS hand held.  This section is pretty clear except for (a) (1) "The transmitter output power of mobile, repeater and base stations must not exceed 50 Watts."  It doesn't mention the hand held maximum on the 462/467 MHz main channels. 

While looking at FCC GMRS certified hand held radios on Amazon, they all seem to have a maximum power output of 5 watts.  Anything over 5 watts were advertised as HAM.  I am assuming an FCC GMRS certified hand held must not exceed 5 watts on ANY GMRS frequency?  Is this correct or is it that no one make a GMRS radio with anything higher than 5 watts?

§ 95.1767 GMRS transmitting power limits.

This section contains transmitting power limits for GMRS stations. The maximum transmitting power depends on which channels are being used and the type of station.

(a) 462/467 MHz main channels. The limits in this paragraph apply to stations transmitting on any of the 462 MHz main channels or any of the 467 MHz main channels. Each GMRS transmitter type must be capable of operating within the allowable power range. GMRS licensees are responsible for ensuring that their GMRS stations operate in compliance with these limits.

(1) The transmitter output power of mobile, repeater and base stations must not exceed 50 Watts.

(2) The transmitter output power of fixed stations must not exceed 15 Watts.

(b) 462 MHz interstitial channels. The effective radiated power (ERP) of mobile, hand-held portable and base stations transmitting on the 462 MHz interstitial channels must not exceed 5 Watts.

(c) 467 MHz interstitial channels. The effective radiated power (ERP) of hand-held portable units transmitting on the 467 MHz interstitial channels must not exceed 0.5 Watt. Each GMRS transmitter type capable of transmitting on these channels must be designed such that the ERP does not exceed 0.5 Watt.

[SteveShannon]

Just now, NWHov said:

 

I'm trying to understand the maximum power output for an FCC certified GMRS hand held.  This section is pretty clear except for (a) (1) "The transmitter output power of mobile, repeater and base stations must not exceed 50 Watts."  It doesn't mention the hand held maximum on the 462/467 MHz main channels. 

While looking at FCC GMRS certified hand held radios on Amazon, they all seem to have a maximum power output of 5 watts.  Anything over 5 watts were advertised as HAM.  I am assuming an FCC GMRS certified hand held must not exceed 5 watts on ANY GMRS frequency?  Is this correct or is it that no one make a GMRS radio with anything higher than 5 watts?

§ 95.1767 GMRS transmitting power limits.

This section contains transmitting power limits for GMRS stations. The maximum transmitting power depends on which channels are being used and the type of station.

(a) 462/467 MHz main channels. The limits in this paragraph apply to stations transmitting on any of the 462 MHz main channels or any of the 467 MHz main channels. Each GMRS transmitter type must be capable of operating within the allowable power range. GMRS licensees are responsible for ensuring that their GMRS stations operate in compliance with these limits.

(1) The transmitter output power of mobile, repeater and base stations must not exceed 50 Watts.

(2) The transmitter output power of fixed stations must not exceed 15 Watts.

(b) 462 MHz interstitial channels. The effective radiated power (ERP) of mobile, hand-held portable and base stations transmitting on the 462 MHz interstitial channels must not exceed 5 Watts.

(c) 467 MHz interstitial channels. The effective radiated power (ERP) of hand-held portable units transmitting on the 467 MHz interstitial channels must not exceed 0.5 Watt. Each GMRS transmitter type capable of transmitting on these channels must be designed such that the ERP does not exceed 0.5 Watt.

Unless specifically called out a handheld is regulated the same as a portable or a mobile. Thus, while not practical, you could have a 50 watt handheld on some of the channels.

[OffRoaderX]

7 minutes ago, NWHov said:

It doesn't mention the hand held maximum on the 462/467 MHz main channels. 

While looking at FCC GMRS certified hand held radios on Amazon, they all seem to have a maximum power output of 5 watts

As @SteveShannon, certified & anointed H.E.R.D. mentioned, there is no limit specific to handhelds.  And if you look hard you will find several 8W units, and if you really apply yourself, you might even find a 10W or two..

But it is important to understand that in most cases, on-average, usually, most of the time and in most situations, most people will not notice any difference between 4 or 5 watts and 8 or 10 watts other than noticing the battery draining much faster.

[Lscott]

2 minutes ago, SteveShannon said:

Thus, while not practical, you could have a 50 watt handheld on some of the channels.

Which reminds me of the people who want those "High Power" HT's claiming 10 watts plus output.

I don't have a link to it but there are some FCC specifications for specific absorption limits based on frequency. Hams are "supposed" to do basic RF exposure calculations above certain power levels at various frequencies per the FCC for RF safety. 

[marcspaz]

Under FCC Definition, handheld radios are mobile radios.

 

Straight from § 95.303 Definitions.

Hand-held portable unit. A physically small mobile station that can be operated while being held in the operator's hand.

[NWHov]

3 minutes ago, marcspaz said:

Under FCC Definition, handheld radios are mobile radios.

 

Straight from § 95.303 Definitions.

Hand-held portable unit. A physically small mobile station that can be operated while being held in the operator's hand.

Copy that!  What sparked my confusion was in section (b) & (c) when talking about the interstitial frequencies it specifically mention "hand-held portable" radios but in section (a) when talking about the main frequencies it didn't say "hand-held portable".   

[SteveShannon]

4 minutes ago, NWHov said:

Copy that!  What sparked my confusion was in section (b) & (c) when talking about the interstitial frequencies it specifically mention "hand-held portable" radios but in section (a) when talking about the main frequencies it didn't say "hand-held portable".   

Correct; they’re only called out separately when regulations apply to them differently.

[NWHov]

17 minutes ago, OffRoaderX said:

As @SteveShannon, certified & anointed H.E.R.D. mentioned, there is no limit specific to handhelds.  And if you look hard you will find several 8W units, and if you really apply yourself, you might even find a 10W or two..

But it is important to understand that in most cases, on-average, usually, most of the time and in most situations, most people will not notice any difference between 4 or 5 watts and 8 or 10 watts other than noticing the battery draining much faster.

So I'm in a hilly area.  Will a higher watt radio help my transmissions or is the hill going to do what hill do and block it no matter what kind of power I have?  I'm referring to only the UHF GMRS frequencies. 

[SteveShannon]

5 minutes ago, NWHov said:

So I'm in a hilly area.  Will a higher watt radio help my transmissions or is the hill going to do what hill do and block it no matter what kind of power I have?  I'm referring to only the UHF GMRS frequencies. 

The hill is going to do what it does.  Where that additional power sometimes can help is if you’re transmitting through vegetation.  Vegetation attenuates the signal so more power can make a difference. Hills block the signal and power won’t overcome that. But a high antenna can. In fact the single most effective improvement most people can make is to get their antenna up in the air. The second is to feed it with a cable that doesn’t convert the signal to heat. Power is way down in priority.

[OffRoaderX]

6 minutes ago, NWHov said:

So I'm in a hilly area.  Will a higher watt radio help my transmissions

No. Getting a bigger/better antenna and/or getting it higher will help more.

[LeoG]

Not so sure about bigger better antenna doing anything to the immutable impenetrable hill. But getting it above said hill will do the trick.

[amaff]

1 hour ago, LeoG said:

Not so sure about bigger better antenna doing anything to the immutable impenetrable hill. But getting it above said hill will do the trick.

now if the antenna happens to be shaped like a Cat D9, it might do something to the hill...

 

But other than that, no.