APRS on GMRS.

[TNFrank]

Watching this video about GMRS possibly getting some VHF frequency allocation make me wonder if a VHF frequency could Bo set aside for APRS use. I think that might give a little boost to GMRS use/usefulness for those who'd like to use APRS but don't want to get a HAM license.

 

[gortex2]

What ? APRS is a HAM thing. Its not commercial and not GMRS. GMRS is UHF. 

On top of that what makes APRS what it is is the thousands of digi's, Igates and servers out there for the ham world. Even when we run sar events and switch to anther ham frequency we have huge holes in coverage and only use it locally to our command post. The majic in APRs is the infastructure thats been built for 25+ years. Our first digi went up in 1995 and was one of the first in the state. 

People get on here and complain about no good GMRS repeaters in their are already. How about we leave services alone and whats therei s there. 

[WRYZ926]

Do a search on this and other forums about giving a portion of the low HVF band to GMRS. It's not likely to happen.

Plus the fact that the portion of the low VHF band is already allocated to the US Military along with federal, state, and local law enforcement and first responders. 

Even if a portion of the low VHF band was given to GMRS, there still is not enough band width available for voice and the different digital modes to include APRS.

IF someone wants to use APRS, DMR, or any other digital modes, then they should get their amateur radio license.

I have my amateur radio license and GMRS license, I sure don't want to see GMRS turn into HAM Lite.

[TNFrank]

I think GMRS would benefit by becoming "HAM Lite". Not everyone wants to bother with taking a test to get their HAM license and for some it's too intimidating.  I think adding more function to GMRS would be a good thing. I know a lot of HAMs want to keep their little club exclusive with a barrier to entry and that's fine but if GMRS could be made to have more utility like adding APRS and the ability to link Repeaters for more range more people would take the time to get their GMRS license.

We need to open the hobby up(both GMRS and HAM)to more folks so the FCC doesn't start selling off our bandwidth.  

[Northcutt114]

I swear...the amount of time some people have on their hands. SEVENTEEN minutes listening to some guy prattle on about an article that can be read in less than 2. It's your life, of course, spend it how you will.

As to adding VHF to GMRS, which is a UHF service? Nah.

[Lscott]

2 minutes ago, TNFrank said:

We need to open the hobby up(both GMRS and HAM)to more folks

The misconception is GMRS is a hobby, that wasn't the FCC's goal. It's moving in that direction, but the FCC likely will resist it. I'm sure if one were to press the FCC on the issues they would point out if you want repeater linking, APRS etc. there is a service for that. Pay your $35 and pass a simple multiple choice test.

10 minutes ago, TNFrank said:

and the ability to link Repeaters

The FCC has this to say about the idea:

"In addition to violating Commission rules, linking repeaters is not in the public interest.  Because GMRS spectrum is limited and used on a shared “commons” basis, the service only works well on a localized basis when users can hear each other and cooperate in the sharing of channels.  Linking repeaters not only increases the potential for interference, but also uses up a limited spectrum resource over much larger areas than intended, limiting localized availability of the repeater channels."

Remember there are only 8 "channels" for GMRS repeater use. For Ham Radio there is 20MHz of spectrum, 430-450 MHz, to pick from. At 20 KHz, that's the bandwidth spec for GMRS to keep things on an equal footing, that amounts to the equivalent of 1000 channels, far more that the 22 that GMRS has. 

[SteveShannon]

7 minutes ago, TNFrank said:

I think GMRS would benefit by becoming "HAM Lite". Not everyone wants to bother with taking a test to get their HAM license and for some it's too intimidating.  I think adding more function to GMRS would be a good thing. I know a lot of HAMs want to keep their little club exclusive with a barrier to entry and that's fine but if GMRS could be made to have more utility like adding APRS and the ability to link Repeaters for more range more people would take the time to get their GMRS license.

We need to open the hobby up(both GMRS and HAM)to more folks so the FCC doesn't start selling off our bandwidth.  

GMRS already has the ability to share locations in simplex. It also has the ability to send short text messages.  I don’t see what it would gain by somehow being allowed to do APRS. 
Second, ham radio operators are allowed advanced privileges such as being able to build their own radio stations and conduct radio related experiments. All experimental equipment can pose a risk to the ability of others to use the same bands. In order to mitigate that risk ham licensing requirements involve an examination. That’s not gatekeepers trying to keep amateur radio exclusive for our own enjoyment; it’s a sincere attempt to ensure that only people who take the responsibility seriously become licensed. In that regard it’s similar to licensing to drive a car, pilot a plane, or practice as a teacher, doctor, lawyer, or engineer. 
It is true that people never get licensed because they’re intimidated. That’s on them; it’s simply not practical or even wise to make complex activities that can affect others available for just the cost of a license. Nor is it possible to make everything unintimidating. Life is intimidating. But friendly people can help others overcome the intimidation. 
There are a ton of us who are willing to teach people and to conduct the exams. We give our time freely and even at personal expense. Anyone who wants to become licensed should take advantage of these opportunities. In many places there’s no charge to take the exam. In other places it might cost $15. Our VEC charges nothing. 

[WRUU653]

 

35 minutes ago, TNFrank said:

I think GMRS would benefit by becoming "HAM Lite"

 They are two completely different services with different uses and objectives. It’s about preserving the usefulness of GMRS. Sometimes less is more. 

[OffRoaderX]

46 minutes ago, TNFrank said:

We need to open the hobby up(both GMRS and HAM).....

Your mistake is that you think GMRS is "a hobby".  GMRS is not a hobby and please stop trying to ruin it by H.A.M.ifying it.

...and, just to be clear, GMRS will never get those VHF allocations.  Haters can bookmark this post and come back in 10 years to thank me for being right.

[WRUE951]

7 minutes ago, OffRoaderX said:

Your mistake is that you think GMRS is "a hobby".  GMRS is not a hobby and please stop trying to ruin it by H.A.M.ifying it.

...and, just to be clear, GMRS will never get those VHF allocations.  Haters can bookmark this post and come back in 10 years to thank me for being right.

Logic at its finest display...   Even Common Sense at work..    

[WRYZ926]

We have had this discussion many times before with the same results. We do not want to turn MRS into HAM Lite. As @SteveShannon stated, there are valid reasons for requiring amateur radio license tests. GMRS was never intended to be anything like amateur radio and it should not turn into HAM Lite.

Also as mentioned by myself and others, GMRS is limited on the amount of bandwidth we have available to us. We already have issues that pop up from people linking repeaters or setting up repeaters on the same channel too close to each other. 

I can say from personal experience that adding low VHF frequencies will not be the "fix all end all solution" that some think. For one that portion is already allocated. And reason two is the fact that the low VHF band is very limited when it comes to long distance communications. The portion being asked for is right below the amateur 6m band. I suggest go play on 6m and see how well you do. 6m is called the magic band because it is either open or closed and heavily relies on the atmospheric conditions being just right.

When I was in the military we used the low VHF from 30 MHz to 70 MHz. It was only good for short distance coms. Relay stations had to be used for long distance coms.

Again, we do not need APRS, DMR, or other types of digital modes on the already limited band width we have. 

If you want to use all of those different modes then get your amateur license. The tests are not hard to pass.

This type of discussion comes up regularly and with the same results. The majority of GMRS users do NOT want the service to turn into HAM Lite.

[WRYZ926]

@TNFrank I suggest you do a search on this forum and on the QRZ forum and radio reference forum. You will see that most do not want GMRS to turn into HAM Lite.

 

PS: I do believe that the dead horse has been turned into a mince meat pie and it is over cooked.

[LeoG]

57 minutes ago, TNFrank said:

I think GMRS would benefit by becoming "HAM Lite". Not everyone wants to bother with taking a test to get their HAM license and for some it's too intimidating.  I think adding more function to GMRS would be a good thing. I know a lot of HAMs want to keep their little club exclusive with a barrier to entry and that's fine but if GMRS could be made to have more utility like adding APRS and the ability to link Repeaters for more range more people would take the time to get their GMRS license.

We need to open the hobby up(both GMRS and HAM)to more folks so the FCC doesn't start selling off our bandwidth.  

No HAM lite.  If you want to be hammish then get the license.  I don't, so I won't.  Don't need more hobbies to spend money on.  This one is just like a boat.  A black hole you throw money into. 

[WRUU653]

Okay then, the nays have it.

Let’s get doughnuts

[WRYZ926]

10 minutes ago, WRUU653 said:

Let’s get doughnuts

Only if you can find some diabetic friendly sugar free donuts that actually taste good. 

[WRUE951]

12 minutes ago, WRUU653 said:

Okay then, the nays have it.

Let’s get doughnuts

already had my donut fix this morning..     Now its time to swap out repeater antennas..   Beautiful Day  

[TNFrank]

43 minutes ago, OffRoaderX said:

Your mistake is that you think GMRS is "a hobby".  GMRS is not a hobby and please stop trying to ruin it by H.A.M.ifying it.

...and, just to be clear, GMRS will never get those VHF allocations.  Haters can bookmark this post and come back in 10 years to thank me for being right.

So are you going to do a video on your channel about this topic? 

[OffRoaderX]

Just now, TNFrank said:

So are you going to do a video on your channel about this topic?

I am guessing you are joking, but I have already mentioned that GMRS is not a hobby about a bazillion times in videos.

and...

Josh (Ham Radio Crash Course) and I will be discussing the ridiculous and unwarranted excitement and radio-dork fervor about the PROPOSAL (one of thousands of proposals every year) to add the VHF frequencies to GMRS in our episode together next week.

[LeoG]

39 minutes ago, WRUE951 said:

already had my donut fix this morning..     Now its time to swap out repeater antennas..   Beautiful Day  

Rainy, humid, cool.  Not a nice day here.

Good luck with the swap out.

[RoadApple]

4 hours ago, TNFrank said:

Watching this video about GMRS possibly getting some VHF frequency allocation make me wonder if a VHF frequency could Bo set aside for APRS use. I think that might give a little boost to GMRS use/usefulness for those who'd like to use APRS but don't want to get a HAM license.

IMHO - Not Gonna Happen.   The objective of videos like that are to get YouTube clicks/views.

[TNFrank]

2 hours ago, OffRoaderX said:

I am guessing you are joking, but I have already mentioned that GMRS is not a hobby about a bazillion times in videos.

and...

Josh (Ham Radio Crash Course) and I will be discussing the ridiculous and unwarranted excitement and radio-dork fervor about the PROPOSAL (one of thousands of proposals every year) to add the VHF frequencies to GMRS in our episode together next week.

LOL, I watch both you and Josh and love the content. I'll be looking forward to any new videos you post. 

[OffRoaderX]

43 minutes ago, RoadApple said:

The objective of videos like that are to get YouTube clicks/views.

As a certified and licensed Youtube Superstar I can confirm that you are correct.

[WRUE951]

1 hour ago, LeoG said:

Rainy, humid, cool.  Not a nice day here.

Good luck with the swap out.

she is working beautifully,,  right in time..  starting to get warm here in the west coast desert.  

[LeoG]

Driving into fall.  Low temp at night so far was 45F.  Still getting into the high 70s and a couple low 80s.  All that will be ending soon as Oct rolls in and the leaves change their colors. 

I don't mind this season, it's the next that I never look forward to.

[Northcutt114]

4 hours ago, SteveShannon said:

GMRS already has the ability to share locations in simplex. It also has the ability to send short text messages.

Um....what? We can talk over GMRS? How's that?