You just got your GMRS license, now you want your own repeater?

[SteveShannon]

47 minutes ago, gortex2 said:

Height is key. The taller your antenna the better. 

Unless the gain of the antenna and the height combine to create poor reception area near the ground close to the antenna.

[gortex2]

True but for home repeaters I dont see that being an issue. The issue is normally height at a home repeater. I have a SAR site in UHF that we do run into this about a mile from the site. Site is at 2500' and has a DB409 as TX. When dropping down the mountain you loose all RX from the site until you get off the hill. But the goal was to cover 25 miles to the north and there it works great. 

 

[SteveShannon]

26 minutes ago, gortex2 said:

True but for home repeaters I dont see that being an issue. The issue is normally height at a home repeater. I have a SAR site in UHF that we do run into this about a mile from the site. Site is at 2500' and has a DB409 as TX. When dropping down the mountain you loose all RX from the site until you get off the hill. But the goal was to cover 25 miles to the north and there it works great. 

 

Great example!  Thanks!

[WRVD377]

On 12/11/2022 at 10:02 AM, Sshannon said:

Great example!  Thanks!

I wish I could have 25' AGL on the hill north of me in my map I would get 100+ more altitude.  But I can't today. I may get 4 - 5 ' on my mast and go from 5W to 40W on a repeater, that will be the best I can do for now.  Interestingly I have had 4 peeps ask to test on my local test repeater already thanks to the mygmrs site.  Can anyone point me to any data about setting up a local club, do's / don'ts is it as simple as paying here and I don't have to deal with taxes? Do I need to do other things I am completely new to this.?

[Fernleaf]

On 12/11/2022 at 12:28 AM, WRVD377 said:

I'll have to see how far away my 50W MXT500 can still trigger the tiny repeater.

I’ll be interested in seeing what you find out. 
 

I may just stick to making a home base again instead of using a repeater. Unless someone out there in GMRS land can let me know if the repeater increases coverage... Is think it best if there was a lot of traffic, not necessarily for range. 
 

But I’m no expert at this stuff... yet.

[WRVD377]

On 12/13/2022 at 9:27 PM, Fernleaf said:

I’ll be interested in seeing what you find out. 
 

I may just stick to making a home base again instead of using a repeater. Unless someone out there in GMRS land can let me know if the repeater increases coverage... Is think it best if there was a lot of traffic, not necessarily for range. 
 

But I’m no expert at this stuff... yet.

Repeater, even my tiny 5W one with 20-25' Antenna does extend range if you want end to end range.  So, like my example a few pages back.  My handhelds, 1.3 miles without.  2.6 apart with repeater, small town hills two sides.  Then mobile to handheld 2 miles, bounce off the repeater 15w mobile 4 miles and handheld can be 1.3 opposite direction, about 5.3.   The question is how far you want to talk to others you know or want on your repeater.  I have not tested my 50W mobile except once, 4 miles to repeater in a valley, mobile on a hill behind trees and buildings.  Seems like 5W repeater is limit out at 4 miles in a valley @ 20ish agl in town, 200' hill between them plus trees, per google earth pro.  So in my case it is how far can I reach around the home to include people using handhelds.  I still don't have alot of traffic, only 4 requests to test on my test repeater.  I am no expert either.  From my results, Sshannon sure is correct. I need more height. Next, I will test more power on a repeater since elevation is not a possible option except 4 - 5 feet, likely less then a mile gain.

[VETCOMMS]

Good to make it to your repeater from the ice cream shop this past Tuesday.  I've tried to gain access to the local water tower where I live but at $1000/month that isn't happening.  Thanks for granting me permission on your repeater and I'll try you again some weekend when in your area 

[gortex2]

More power isn't going to increase gain for the most part. If you only have a 4 watt portable just changing the repeater to a 25 watt from 5 watt isn't going t increase range. 

[WRVD377]

On 12/16/2022 at 6:42 AM, WRTZ750 said:

Good to make it to your repeater from the ice cream shop this past Tuesday.  I've tried to gain access to the local water tower where I live but at $1000/month that isn't happening.  Thanks for granting me permission on your repeater and I'll try you again some weekend when in your area 

No problem WRTZ750! And thanks for the knowledge you checked into, that is far out of my range of $ also.  I will put in a continuous duty repeater from Bridgecom since I don't have the time to learn all the other buy this that and this "then program this that and this" to get some area coverage and I think I will just make it public at that point. Maybe later I'll work on seeing if our area can find someone or some place with some altitude and other hardware.

[WRVD377]

On 12/16/2022 at 12:15 PM, gortex2 said:

More power isn't going to increase gain for the most part. If you only have a 4 watt portable just changing the repeater to a 25 watt from 5 watt isn't going t increase range. 

Thanks for the facts, as I have proved that with 5w handhelds. (1.3 miles max) It was wishful thinking on range.  But I bet I can have a more stable continuous duty repeater that can handle more traffic than a Retevis RT97 (Simple and super easy to make work, does not broadcast ID).  It is pretty simple no special features or functions like the Bridgecom.  I have 2 handhelds @ 5W 4.79w, Mobile 15W and 50W. 6db midland antenna.  I was wishful in the 15 - 50 watt, to 40watt (20w likely after duplexer) repeater to gain range verses 10W (5W) test box. Repeater antenna Opek UH-2401, 6.5dB gain.

At this point it is for fun now to see my limits at my $$ willing to spend as altitude is a no go for me mostly.

Great to see others knowledge!  

[Bande1]

2 hours ago, WRVD377 said:

Thanks for the facts, as I have proved that with 5w handhelds. (1.3 miles max) It was wishful thinking on range.  But I bet I can have a more stable continuous duty repeater that can handle more traffic than a Retevis RT97 (Simple and super easy to make work, does not broadcast ID).  It is pretty simple no special features or functions like the Bridgecom.  I have 2 handhelds @ 5W 4.79w, Mobile 15W and 50W. 6db midland antenna.  I was wishful in the 15 - 50 watt, to 40watt (20w likely after duplexer) repeater to gain range verses 10W (5W) test box. Repeater antenna Opek UH-2401, 6.5dB gain.

At this point it is for fun now to see my limits at my $$ willing to spend as altitude is a no go for me mostly.

Great to see others knowledge!  

 

I cant recommend enough an air cannon. This little $40 project changed everything. First shot, first try got my line 100ft over the exact branch I was aiming for. antenna at about 80'-85' vs 25'-35' is a massive difference.

 

 

 

[VETCOMMS]

15 hours ago, WRVD377 said:

No problem WRTZ750! And thanks for the knowledge you checked into, that is far out of my range of $ also.  I will put in a continuous duty repeater from Bridgecom since I don't have the time to learn all the other buy this that and this "then program this that and this" to get some area coverage and I think I will just make it public at that point. Maybe later I'll work on seeing if our area can find someone or some place with some altitude and other hardware.

WRVD, in case you're interested there's a gentleman on the Aledo Repeater FB page with a Bridgecom repeater for sale.  I don't know him personally but if you're interested I can look for his contact info for you.

[WRVD377]

On 12/17/2022 at 9:26 PM, Bande1 said:

 

I cant recommend enough an air cannon. This little $40 project changed everything. First shot, first try got my line 100ft over the exact branch I was aiming for. antenna at about 80'-85' vs 25'-35' is a massive difference.

 

Years ago, I built one of those less the fishing gear.  No large trees in my yard anymore.  So I am out except what I can do here.  

[WRVD377]

WRTZ750, thanks for the offer.  I looked that FB page up, I did not see it, but I don't have FB account either.  I will just order one.  Late Jan 2023 before they will have any.

[wayoverthere]

2 hours ago, WRVD377 said:

WRTZ750, thanks for the offer.  I looked that FB page up, I did not see it, but I don't have FB account either.  I will just order one.  Late Jan 2023 before they will have any.

I was able to locate the relevant posts, which mention leaving a comment or dropping an email to (n1usa at ARRL dot net).

post link

[WRVD377]

49 minutes ago, wayoverthere said:

I was able to locate the relevant posts, which mention leaving a comment or dropping an email to (n1usa at ARRL dot net).

post link

Hello wayoverthere,

I must have missed the comment.  I see what they said, I don't want something that might need fixed.  I rather pay retail new and be mad if it is not good than to know it may not be good and pay more in time and cost.  Oddly I wrote two MFG's Midland and Retevis and asked them why they don't offer higher power repeaters (later) or a repeater at all the (first) since they both target recreational people.  I actually got a reply from both.  Midland said they would pass it along.  Retevis asked me for use cases, then told me to watch for web site updates as they have some items in the works.

 

thanks for finding that,

Royce

[wayoverthere]

4 minutes ago, WRVD377 said:

Hello wayoverthere,

I must have missed the comment.  I see what they said, I don't want something that might need fixed.  I rather pay retail new and be mad if it is not good than to know it may not be good and pay more in time and cost.  Oddly I wrote two MFG's Midland and Retevis and asked them why they don't offer higher power repeaters (later) or a repeater at all the (first) since they both target recreational people.  I actually got a reply from both.  Midland said they would pass it along.  Retevis asked me for use cases, then told me to watch for web site updates as they have some items in the works.

 

thanks for finding that,

Royce

You bet. I totally get people not wanting to have Facebook, and don't blame you for not wanting to take on someone else's problems...hope the link at least let you see the full post.

Interesting tidbit from retevis, though

[WRVD377]

To be specific she said a 40w analog repeater, can't say when, but watch for it.

[WRVD377]

Well a short follow up.  RT97 5W.  New max range from the fish bowl.  I raised the Antena 5' to what should be 25'9" plus or minus some inches agl.  I managed to still talk to it from 5 miles.  731' ground altitude at 5 miles, repeater 600', ground +25', plus trees and buildings, per google earth pro.  So for a low power repeater in a fishbowl I would have to say it works pretty well.  It is certainly impacted by other radios around the airport area and some areas on the north hill (extended over 6 blocks more).  Too bad It was not the RT97s.  Maybe a few more watts could have cut threw some of the interference, but I sure would not know if it works like that or not.  My simple tests show a best case of +1 mile on a 5' increase in height.  Mobile 50W, past test 15W and 50W on same mobile antenna no range change @ 4 miles, thus to me that was the repeater height primarily and likely some power limits too.

So anyone wanting 5 miles, these little 5W repeaters are very capable. If you want 5 miles and public, sounds like the RT97s is the one you might be able to spit out a call sigh as most say you should or must. Who knows if it is better when on a hill, but I would bet it is.   Such a simple device to deploy.

[VETCOMMS]

Thx for the update WRVD.  I think you said you're around the radio a little more on the weekend so I'll have to drive down your way and do a little test of my lip mounted Tram antenna.

You teased me with the possible 40 watt model possibly coming out so I'll be watching for that release date.

Happy New Years to you all 

[WRVZ612]

I, and my buddy are retired from the same job. He is now disabled and doesn't get out much. We both got licensed for GMRS and quickly found out that we couldn't talk house to house, just too far apart. There are some repeaters in our area, but the owners already denied me because I was honest and said that my buddy and I would chit chat and they didn't like that. They wanted to keep there's open for emergencies, travelers and business type communications. They were former first responders from what I gather. I have applied to other repeater owners who are on my travel routes and are friendly and looking forward to hearing from me. We are going to both put up base antennas and see if that works. I would put up a repeater so that he and I could communicate easily and I would have it open so that others in my town could make use of it. I also work events at a campground and would use a low power repeater since it's a stretch from one end to another with a hill in between. 

[WRQC527]

42 minutes ago, WRVZ612 said:

we couldn't talk house to house, just too far apart

Just curious, how far apart, and what kind of obstructions are in the way?(Houses, terrain, foliage, structures, etc.)

[SteveShannon]

2 hours ago, WRVZ612 said:

I, and my buddy are retired from the same job. He is now disabled and doesn't get out much. We both got licensed for GMRS and quickly found out that we couldn't talk house to house, just too far apart. There are some repeaters in our area, but the owners already denied me because I was honest and said that my buddy and I would chit chat and they didn't like that. They wanted to keep there's open for emergencies, travelers and business type communications. They were former first responders from what I gather. I have applied to other repeater owners who are on my travel routes and are friendly and looking forward to hearing from me. We are going to both put up base antennas and see if that works. I would put up a repeater so that he and I could communicate easily and I would have it open so that others in my town could make use of it. I also work events at a campground and would use a low power repeater since it's a stretch from one end to another with a hill in between. 

Certainly, the decision to put up a repeater is one you could make, but as you already suggested, a much easier one for you and your buddy might be to just put up an external antenna at each of your houses.  Try that and see if it works. Nothing helps more than getting your antennas up in the air, but even placing a mobile antenna on a cookie sheet in the attic would be a lot better than the antennas that came with your handheld radios.

Otherwise, the portable Retevis RT-97S or the equivalent Midland repeater would be good for your campground.

[WRVZ612]

5 hours ago, WRQC527 said:

Just curious, how far apart, and what kind of obstructions are in the way?(Houses, terrain, foliage, structures, etc.)

Probably about 7 miles straight line. I already have a base antenna up. It's my 440 Ham antenna. He has a mag mount on a steel plate screwed to the window sill. There is a 300 foot high hill directly in between us. I just built a couple of j-pole antennas and matched them with a Nano VNA. I'm going to try one at his house up on a mast and see if that does the trick.

[WRVZ612]

3 hours ago, Sshannon said:

Certainly, the decision to put up a repeater is one you could make, but as you already suggested, a much easier one for you and your buddy might be to just put up an external antenna at each of your houses.  Try that and see if it works. Nothing helps more than getting your antennas up in the air, but even placing a mobile antenna on a cookie sheet in the attic would be a lot better than the antennas that came with your handheld radios.

Otherwise, the portable Retevis RT-97S or the equivalent Midland repeater would be good for your campground.

I have a base antenna and it works good. I am going to get a J-pole that I built and matched up at his house and see if that works. There is a 300 foot high hill in between us, so that is probably the biggest problem. I have been looking at various repeaters including the RT-97 and have thought about using 2 Wouxam 1000's with a duplexer as well. I might just try the 97 and see what it does. I have seen the 97S and another just called the 97, no S what is the difference?