Linking GMRS repeaters?

[Werdna]

Ski Bum's question about expanding repeater coverage in an area with challenging terrain got me thinking. In the ham radio and business/professional LMR circles, repeaters are sometimes linked via another frequency band (e.g. VHF repeaters in an area may have a UHF link between them), allowing anyone with VHF to communicate within the entire linked area).

 

So if I have two GMRS repeaters covering a site and want to provide extensive coverage, I could link them. I could run a hardwire between them, link them via Internet, infrared, carrier pigeon, etc... But what I'm wondering is whether I could configure a MURS link between the sites?

 

I know MURS does not allow repeaters explicitly (I expect due to the limited number and close proximity of frequencies), but for a cross-band repeater linkage, the MURS units would be running in simplex, doing a basic rebroadcast of the traffic from the GMRS output frequency.

 

I don't see anything in MURS or GMRS regs about not performing this kind of relay. Is this considered "store and forward"? It doesn't seem like the MURS stations would be functioning as a simplex repeater either, since they would only be broadcasting in real-time.

 

So... where is my thinking going wrong? (Other than this being perhaps a prohibitively expensive and technically complex solution that may be over-engineered for a simple problem.)  

[PastorGary]

You may find some of your answers in a long-running thread located here:

 

https://forums.mygmrs.com/topic/295-repeater-linking-discussion/

 

Please read the entire thread, because the legalities of linking leave only a few options... most of which are discussed in that thread.

[jwilkers]

MURS and GMRS are two different radio services. Using one radio service to carry traffic from another is highly illegal.

 

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[ISkiBum1]

Thanks for your help wrodina!

[Werdna]

Please read the entire thread, because the legalities of linking leave only a few options... most of which are discussed in that thread.

 

That thread is very interesting, but it seems to mostly discuss linking repeaters via the Internet or an equivalent TCP/IP network. I did not see discussion about linkage via other frequency bands.

 

 

MURS and GMRS are two different radio services. Using one radio service to carry traffic from another is highly illegal.

 

I understand they are different, but I did not see anything in the regs for either service specifically forbidding this type of rebroadcasting. Is there another regulation somewhere that covers this type of activity, outside of the service-specific sections? (Not that I disbelieve you, just looking for the info.)

 

 

Thanks!

[zap]

That thread is very interesting, but it seems to mostly discuss linking repeaters via the Internet or an equivalent TCP/IP network. I did not see discussion about linkage via other frequency bands.

 

 

 

I understand they are different, but I did not see anything in the regs for either service specifically forbidding this type of rebroadcasting. Is there another regulation somewhere that covers this type of activity, outside of the service-specific sections? (Not that I disbelieve you, just looking for the info.)

 

 

Thanks!

A link radio is still retransmitting a received message from a receiver.

 

There is also an old FCC idea about only allowing links above 200 MHz.

 

That being said, the rules don't specifically condone linking to Part 90…but you have to remember, it's been just shy of 30 years since those rules were written.

 

 

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[jwilkers]

That thread is very interesting, but it seems to mostly discuss linking repeaters via the Internet or an equivalent TCP/IP network. I did not see discussion about linkage via other frequency bands.

 

 

 

I understand they are different, but I did not see anything in the regs for either service specifically forbidding this type of rebroadcasting. Is there another regulation somewhere that covers this type of activity, outside of the service-specific sections? (Not that I disbelieve you, just looking for the info.)

 

 

Thanks!

Well, each radio service has its own rules and licensing requirements. Nowhere in any fcc regulation on any radio service allows this type of interconnect. Plus allowed frequencies are directly published in the rules. A MURS frequency is not listed as an allowable frequency.

 

You wouldn't interconnect a cb radio on a police frequency.

 

Same deal.

 

I no longer quote regs. If I were to cite anything, people still won't believe me. Why do work when there is no return on my investment?

 

I tell people to do their own research.

 

AntiSquid disclaimer: All information provided is personal opinion only and may or may not resemble actual fact.

[Werdna]

Ok.

 

I see this stipulation in Part 97 for ham radio: "No station shall retransmit programs or signals emanating from any type of radio station other than an amateur station, except propagation and weather forecast information intended for use by the general public and originated from United States Government stations, and communications, including incidental music, originating on United States Government frequencies between a manned spacecraft and its associated Earth stations."

 

That tells me, for example, that I would not be allowed to link CB and ham radio. I get that. However, I don't see anything similar to that paragraph in the regulations for GMRS or MURS... so I'm assuming since there are active regulations prohibiting it for the amateur service, there would be active prohibitions for other services as well. Alternately, I realize there may be other general-coverage provisions outside of the specific service areas to the effect of, "In general, transmissions from one service covered by FCC regulations may not be rebroadcast on another service," or something similar. This is what I was hoping to find out, if there is such a rule.

[n4gix]

Apply a bit of deductive logic to the matter. GMRS is a licensed to family radio service. MURS is licensed by rule. Trying to use any MURS frequency for a link would also allow anyone with MURS to use that frequency and (a) interfere with the link, but more to the point ( allow an unlicensed person to be heard on a GMRS frequency.

 

No one would thank you; legions would curse you; the FCC possibly would fine you.

 

Now it just might be possible to use a link in the 900 MHz band for a link, but I'd have to research the legality of that. Since I have zero interest in the matter, I'll not invest the time to do so however.

[Werdna]

I guess that makes sense, I hadn't considered interference as an issue. (MURS is absolutely dead in my local area.) I appreciate the input from everyone!