GMRS on a Road Trip?

[V73C]

I have a new GMRS license. I've got an 1,800 mile one way trip from Oregon to Kansas coming up. Is this service used at all on the road? Is it worth purchasing a mobile for the road? Obviously, I can use the rig and service at my destination. I'm wondering if it's worth a head start before I leave.

 

Thank you,

 

Ken

[Lscott]

That depends. The range on UHF is 3 to 5 miles between mobile radios. You can get more range if you can access a repeater. However you will likely drive out of range of the repeater in 15 to 30 or so miles, if the repeater antenna is located high enough. As an example there is a Ham Radio UHF repeater by me with the antenna at 800 feet. The usable range is about 40 miles more or less. 
 

The problem with repeaters used on a long trip are two fold. First you need to know where they are and the channel used. Second most use an access tone, without it you won’t even activate it. Trying to input a tone as you’re  driving down the road isn’t recommended. Many of the real GMRS mobile radios require some measure of screwing around to set the tone, that is if it’s even possible. Some you have to use the programming software.

 

If you’re lucky you may get a contact with a base station, in which case you don’t need to normally worry about access tones. If the base station has their antenna up 30 feet or more you could get 10 to 20 mile range.

 

Some of the other people here have pointed out in other posts that running a 40 to 50 watt radio mobile didn’t really increase their range much. 
 

I would recommend just using a hand held radio, typically 4 to 5 watt output, connected to a good magnet mount antenna on the vehicle roof. You can buy a hand held GMRS radio for under a $100, some are even less. While you can get a cheap mobile radio for about the same price the output power is about the same. Also the hand held you can use the stubby antenna while out walking around and keep the radio in your pocket when not in use. Don’t even think about trying to use a hand held with the stubby antenna inside the vehicle, you’ll be VERY disappointed.

 

Your most likely contacts are a few others operating mobile GMRS, some base stations and likely a fair number of people using FRS radios mobile. Remember FRS and GMRS share the same exact frequencies exclusive of the repeater ones. My experience with people using FRS radios mobile inside of a vehicle is the range seems to be no more than 1/2 to 1 mile. In fact the FRS users are likely to hear you well past the point where you will hear them.

[Jones]

As a contract radio broadcast engineer, I am on the road a LOT in Nebraska and Kansas.  I very rarely hear anything on GMRS other than my own family, but I did just a few weeks ago hear a couple of truckers on 462.675 (Channel 20) on hwy 81 north of Salina.

 

I usually monitor either 462.675 (20) when I'm on the road, or 462.625 (18) when I'm around my hometown, since my family uses 625.

 

Channel 20, with a CTCSS tone of 141.3 (Midland "privacy code" #22) is sort of the "official/not quite official/depends who you ask" traveler's channel for FRS/GMRS, so that is where like-minded people should hang out if they want to have a chance at talking to someone else on a road trip.

 

So, one-way to Kansas?? Where in Kansas, and why?

[Mikeam]

Here in WA state there is a repeater 52.5 air miles from a parking lot in Lacey that I can hear traffic on and bump the repeater but I can not talk to them. The reason is the BTECH GMRS V1 hand held in my Jeep with the factory antenna and low power just is not strong enough which is what I expected. I am interested in a mobile unit as there are more repeaters going up in our area that I travel in. So to help you I make a log of the 8 frequencies and then list the repeaters in any area I am going to with the PL code for each one. I can always pull over and change the PL code then as needed. Of course I would prefer the ability to add the same frequency to different channels multiple times so all I have to do is change channels on the road. The GMRS map on this site is a big help in my learning curve.

[berkinet]

...I make a log of the 8 frequencies and then list the repeaters in any area I am going to with the PL code for each one. I can always pull over and change the PL code then as needed. Of course I would prefer the ability to add the same frequency to different channels multiple times so all I have to do is change channels on the road....

This is exactly why people look for Part 90 and older Part 95 radios that have greater internal channel assignment capacities. Some new Part 95 radios may do this, but they are usually not as flexible.

[Mikeam]

This is exactly why people look for Part 90 and older Part 95 radios that have greater internal channel assignment capacities. Some new Part 95 radios may do this, but they are usuals not as flexible.

Maybe a sticky under equipment with brands where to find specifications (size of unit amp draw channels)  and where to buy them for us newbies?? I know I would like the information before I invest in a mobile unit

[berkinet]

Maybe a sticky under equipment with brands where to find specifications (size of unit amp draw channels)  and where to buy them for us newbies?? I know I would like the information before I invest in a mobile unit

Sure, it just needs someone to start it. Rich can make it sticky if it gets enough information. Abut, there are 2 considerations. 1) similar ideas in the past have fizzled because the people who have the skills and knowledge needed are not the ones who will benefit. And, 2) There are A LOT of UHF radios out there. In many cases two or three identical looking radios will have very different specs. Also, especially for used equipment, it can take some effort to research each radio you find on ebay.

 

Just as an exercise, look into Motorola P1225 HTs. You will find a huge number of models that offer differing: channels, interfaces, displays, bands and technology (trunking vs non-trunking). Each variant has its own unique model number and even then you find some radios that shouldn’t exist. Like a 16 channel non-trunking UHF radio with LCD display and 16 button keypad.

[Mikeam]

Sure, it just needs someone to start it. Rich can make it sticky if it gets enough information. Abut, there are 2 considerations. 1) similar ideas in the past have fizzled because the people who have the skills and knowledge needed are not the ones who will benefit. And, 2) There are A LOT of UHF radios out there. In many cases two or three identical looking radios will have very different specs. Also, especially for used equipment, it can take some effort to research each radio you find on ebay.

 

Just as an exercise, look into Motorola P1225 HTs. You will find a huge number of models that offer differing: channels, interfaces, displays, bands and technology (trunking vs non-trunking). Each variant has its own unique model number and even then you find some radios that shouldn’t exist. Like a 16 channel non-trunking UHF radio with LCD display and 16 button keypad.

Thanks I see your point, for me it is just the BTECH and Midland GMRS units are limited in useable channels and not real forth coming in new product details most likely due to a limited market. I will live with the hand held for a while longer!

[berkinet]

... I will live with the hand held for a while longer!

Well, there are other options, especially if you would consider used equipment and possibly Part 90 gear. Motorola (which I use) is excellent, but getting the programming software can be an issue. OTOH, there are a lot of other quality brands out there and many have been reviewed on the MyGMRS forum. Take a look around. Also, Maybe someone will suggest something here as well with a large channel capacity.

[WRFV510]

3-5 miles? im doing better then that with my 4w handhelds inside my truck. a mobile with a external antenna at 40w should do better then that. i know repeaters dont count with range but with a 4w hand held i can hit a our repeater 20miles away and talk to my dad who is another 20miles further. so 40 miles as crow flies using 4w radios. i was just talking to my dad simplex 10 miles away. but he is at 1750' elevation. So that had alot to do with it.  Cant wait for the Firing pin to get the other 3 repeaters up linked together. it will cover most on NY state.  

[Riktar]

This is exactly why people look for Part 90 and older Part 95 radios that have greater internal channel assignment capacities. Some new Part 95 radios may do this, but they are usuals not as flexible.

I have family in North Carolina, Virgina and Pennsylvania. I also prefer driving over flying when I visit with family as does my Daughter.

 

As I did my research into GMRS I discovered the repeater network for it that almost covered (Pennsylvania is lacking on the west side in terms of the national linked system) every destination we visit. 

 

So every radio that is installed in our family vehicles are Kenwood TK-8180 which has the ability to program various groups of channels.

 

Every repeater that is on our driving route(s) has been programmed (by state) into the radio by repeater name. I have gotten permission by all the repeater owners to access their systems that we have traveled past so far. I still have to get permission from the North Carolina repeaters but that will be done before my next trip this Fall.

 

Everyone in the family has been encouraged and taught how to use the scan functions in their radios so as they travel they can switch to their corresponding "state" as they drive. I will be doing a little tutorial explaning the regional nets and how they are linked for family use. IE: When my daughter leaves home she can be 3 states away and still reach me via the Midwest GMRS repeater network in the event her cell signal is poor and she needs to contact me or I her.

 

This is used as a backup in the event they are in an area with less than ideal cell coverage and they suffer a breakdown/emergency and require assistance.  

[Mikeam]

I have family in North Carolina, Virgina and Pennsylvania. I also prefer driving over flying when I visit with family as does my Daughter.

 

As I did my research into GMRS I discovered the repeater network for it that almost covered (Pennsylvania is lacking on the west side in terms of the national linked system) every destination we visit. 

 

So every radio that is installed in our family vehicles are Kenwood TK-8180 which has the ability to program various groups of channels.

 

Every repeater that is on our driving route(s) has been programmed (by state) into the radio by repeater name. I have gotten permission by all the repeater owners to access their systems that we have traveled past so far. I still have to get permission from the North Carolina repeaters but that will be done before my next trip this Fall.

 

Everyone in the family has been encouraged and taught how to use the scan functions in their radios so as they travel they can switch to their corresponding "state" as they drive. I will be doing a little tutorial explaning the regional nets and how they are linked for family use. IE: When my daughter leaves home she can be 3 states away and still reach me via the Midwest GMRS repeater network in the event her cell signal is poor and she needs to contact me or I her.

 

This is used as a backup in the event they are in an area with less than ideal cell coverage and they suffer a breakdown/emergency and require assistance.  

Three questions, 1 where did you get the software to program with - 2 Is this unit legal for GMRS? Sounds like a solid unit - New or used? Thanks

[berkinet]

 2 Is this unit legal for GMRS? 

The term legal is a misnomer. The correct question would be: is a given radio certified for GMRS operation. 

 

The specific requirement is stated in Part-95E

§ 95.1761 GMRS transmitter certification.

(a) Each GMRS transmitter (a transmitter that operates or is intended to operate in the GMRS) must be certified in accordance with this subpart...

If your radio is not GMRS certified then you are in violation of the rules. However, you are no more, or less, in violation than you would be if you did not properly identify.  Nobody can or should tell you it is ok to violate the rules, that is a decision you have to make for your self. However, I will tell you that many people have chosen to use high-quality non-GMRS certified (but often certified to the more stringent Part 90) equipment. I will also say, that there is no recorded case of anyone ever having been cited or punished for running Part-90 equipment on GMRS. In fact, there are no know citations for running any non-certified equipment on GMRS.

 

What I would advise is to always run quality equipment maintained in good working order and operate that equipment in accordance with the GMRS regulations.

[Mikeam]

The term legal is a misnomer. The correct question would be: is a given radio certified for GMRS operation. 

 

The specific requirement is stated in Part-95E

§ 95.1761 GMRS transmitter certification.

(a) Each GMRS transmitter (a transmitter that operates or is intended to operate in the GMRS) must be certified in accordance with this subpart...

If your radio is not GMRS certified then you are in violation of the rules. However, you are no more, or less, in violation than you would be if you did not properly identify.  Nobody can or should tell you it is ok to violate the rules, that is a decision you have to make for your self. However, I will tell you that many people have chosen to use high-quality non-GMRS certified (but often certified to the more stringent Part 90) equipment. I will also say, that there is no recorded case of anyone ever having been cited or punished for running Part-90 equipment on GMRS. In fact, there are no know citations for running any non-certified equipment on GMRS.

 

What I would advise is to always run quality equipment maintained in good working order and operate that equipment in accordance with the GMRS regulations.

My fault I should have asked if the listed radio was Part 95 approved. What I was hoping for was more than BTEC or Midland to chose from for a mobile. Wanting more frequency storage for traveling. Definitely not asking anyone to state they are breaking any rules again thanks for the feedback it is a learning curve here.

[tweiss3]

Kenwood: TK-8180-K------(30 watts) FCC ID: K4437313110 Part 95 certified.

 

You do need kenwood software KPG-73D or KPG-89DK, which can be found online for $75.00 or less.

[Mikeam]

Kenwood: TK-8180-K------(30 watts) FCC ID: K4437313110 Part 95 certified.

 

You do need kenwood software KPG-73D or KPG-89DK, which can be found online for $75.00 or less.

Thanks that is what I was looking for to review should be a good unit for my needs.

[berkinet]

Kenwood: TK-8180-K------(30 watts) [/size]FCC ID:[/size] [/size]K4437313110 Part 95 certified...

Isn’t there also a higher powered version of that radio?

[tweiss3]

Isn’t there also a higher powered version of that radio?

Yes, TK-8180HK is 45W.

 

Edit: FCC ID: K4437313210

[Riktar]

As to your question of new/used: I purchased all my radios from Ebay. Brand new this radio was just under $500 and the "H" (higher 45w transmit power) was a few hundred more.

 

Ebay pricing is all over the place but the cost is still WAAAAAAAY below what retail was when this model was new. 

 

I do believe Kenwood has recently discontinued this from a sales standpoint but the unit information is still on their website:

 

https://www.kenwood.com/usa/com/lmr/tk-7180h_8180h/

[tweiss3]

As to your question of new/used: I purchased all my radios from Ebay. Brand new this radio was just under $500 and the "H" (higher 45w transmit power) was a few hundred more.

 

Ebay pricing is all over the place but the cost is still WAAAAAAAY below what retail was when this model was new. 

 

I do believe Kenwood has recently discontinued this from a sales standpoint but the unit is still on their website:

 

https://www.kenwood.com/usa/com/lmr/tk-7180h_8180h/

 

I've been looking for quite a while, and the HK models across the board are hard to find. Used Kenwood prices have been going up, but when I purchased, I grabbed my two TK-8150's from a local police auction for about $140 for both (with remote head kits included). You really have to do your research and find a deal anymore. Ebay prices are stupid. I had been looking at Ham HT's and Mobiles, and the price is 70%+ of the new price, which at that point, get the warranty, quick shipping and peace of mind.

[Riktar]

I wouldn't worry too much about the lack of HK models. I have a mix of both and after doing field tests , whether it's in a mobile or base/home unit setting, the biggest difference I notice is temperature of the units heatsink when transmitting. 

 

That' not to say that their isn't any difference in transmission performance but it's not as big a difference as I would have hoped the extra 15 watts added. 45 watts does give you a slightly louder voice, but it doesn't make your ears anymore sensitive.

 

Or put another way who cares if you can yell father if you can't hear any farther?    

[Mikeam]

Thanks for all of the input so far it is looking like a cheaper project with the Kenwood for what you get and the benefit of increased frequency storage.

[WRFV510]

remember if buying new on ebay. most companies only offer warranties if sold by authorized dealers. 

[Jones]

I love my Kenwood TK-8180 - Much better than my 880s or my 862s.  I can't tell the difference between them on the air, they all have the classic "Kenwood sound" on the other end.  I do like the fact that the 8180 has so much more flexibility in programming, a better alpha-numeric display, and LOTS more channels.

 

I just ordered another 8180 from eBay for $70. They say it works, but as usual, we'll see.  If it does, that's a great deal.

 

The 8180 also seems to have a hotter receiver than my 880s, but not as hot as the receive on my old Midland LMR 70-1526Bs (That's Midland Part 90 professional, not MicroMobiles) Those old Hitachi-made Midlands were great in the day, but hard to program, hard to find, and impossible to get parts for these days.

[Mikeam]

Kenwood: TK-8180-K------(30 watts) FCC ID: K4437313110 Part 95 certified.

 

You do need kenwood software KPG-73D or KPG-89DK, which can be found online for $75.00 or less.

I have looked at and most likely will get the TK 8180 also looking at my Chirp software see that it is now supported. Admittedly I can not comment on how well it works but just an FYI.