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Canadian rules RSS210 - GMRS Repeaters in Canada


Guest TickingMind
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Guest TickingMind

It would seem like the rules for GMRS in Canada are different than FRS rules after reading RSS-210.

They specify that for FRS you cannot have a detachable antenna and your power output can be a max of 500mw. You cannot use a packet store and forward device.

Now, for GMRS they mention nothing about detachable antennas, the power output is higher but again you cannot use a "packet store and forward device".

By interpretation this means things like packet modems, AX.25, things like that. No mention of base operations, repeaters, etc.

So to their word, it is technically legal to operate a repeater in Canada using a GMRS radio on a GMRS channel with the appropriate 5 mhz split.

Glad I really read this publication from the government. It's making sense now.

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14 hours ago, Guest TickingMind said:

ISo to their word, it is technically legal to operate a repeater in Canada using a GMRS radio on a GMRS channel with the appropriate 5 mhz split.

Read section "A6.2.1 Channel Frequencies:". It specifically states

The following 8-channel carrier frequencies are reserved for possible future use as repeater input channels and are not available for simplex communications:
Channel Frequency
16467.5500
17
467.5750
18
467.6000
19
467.6250
20
467.6500
21
467.6750
22
467.7000
23
467.7250

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Guest For simplex....

Yes, but for simplex. If the input is 467 and the output is 462 it's duplex, so I do not see an issue. They are so vague with policies and regulations, so we just take it as it is.

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Read section "A6.2.1 Channel Frequencies:". It specifically states
The following 8-channel carrier frequencies are reserved for possible future use as repeater input channels and are not available for simplex communications:


Note: not available for simplex communications. This clearly states, it's illegal to use these radios for simplex.

Sent from my SM-A125U using Tapatalk

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15 hours ago, Guest For simplex.... said:

Yes, but for simplex. If the input is 467 and the output is 462 it's duplex, so I do not see an issue. They are so vague with policies and regulations, so we just take it as it is.

That’s not really duplex. It’s simplex operation using split frequencies. 

TX’ing on a 467 frequency and RX’ing on a 462 frequency, well good luck hearing anything since there is no repeater to translate the signal on the 467 frequency down to the 462 frequency you’re listening too.

Off course the other radio could be setup to do the reverse, however trying to use more that two radios just won’t work because one of the other radios will be using the wrong TX and RX frequencies in relation to the other two.

I’ve thought doing something like split frequency simplex to frustrate jammers, at some point in the past, but to accommodate more that two radios requires a more sophisticated method involving fast scanning radios, PL or digital codes to have any hope of getting it to work.

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5 hours ago, WyoJoe said:

All of this makes me wonder about the legality of using a GMRS radio in Canada to contact other users through a repeater in the U.S.

As far as I know this isn't legal. Also the Canadian GMRS radios, at least the legal ones, don't have access to the 467 repeater input frequencies anyway.

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15 hours ago, Lscott said:

As far as I know this isn't legal. Also the Canadian GMRS radios, at least the legal ones, don't have access to the 467 repeater input frequencies anyway.

My guess as well is that it wouldn't be legal. With the 467 frequencies being reserved for "future" repeater inputs, I would assume transmitting on those frequencies wouldn't be legal, but the other part of the picture is the crossing of the U.S./Canada border. I'm not sure what the legalities are in that regard, other than the restricted use areas we have in the U.S.

Obviously, radio waves won't just fall to the ground at the border, so whether intentional or not, users close to the border could very well communicate with each other even if they weren't trying to.

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8 hours ago, WyoJoe said:

My guess as well is that it wouldn't be legal. With the 467 frequencies being reserved for "future" repeater inputs, I would assume transmitting on those frequencies wouldn't be legal, but the other part of the picture is the crossing of the U.S./Canada border. I'm not sure what the legalities are in that regard, other than the restricted use areas we have in the U.S.

Obviously, radio waves won't just fall to the ground at the border, so whether intentional or not, users close to the border could very well communicate with each other even if they weren't trying to.

The Canadians don't have access to the repeater input frequencies, however I haven't found anything that specifically prohibits communications using the common simplex frequencies for cross boarder communications. I could be wrong here. Anybody have any info on this?

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  • 5 months later...
Guest theRadioMan

Does anyone know, if a Canadian buys a portable repeater directly from someone like retevis, do they know if the Border inspectors automatically confiscate it, because technically based on the current laws there is no use for it in Canada, even on private property. One hears stories of Farmers in the north using repeaters on their own property, but I don't know of those are fables or not. 

IE:

I saw this review, "I recently purchased a RT97. Watched some reviews online and appeared to be the right product for my application. I have several 100 acres of forest in northern Ontario, Canada with many hills and valleys. Cell communication is spotty at best. Radios work until your separated by a hill or valley. This product solved all of my issues. Highly recommend. Make sure to buy the antenna and cable as it is sold separately"

This almost seems like fiction with the current laws.

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10 hours ago, Guest theRadioMan said:

Does anyone know, if a Canadian buys a portable repeater directly from someone like retevis, do they know if the Border inspectors automatically confiscate it, because technically based on the current laws there is no use for it in Canada, even on private property. One hears stories of Farmers in the north using repeaters on their own property, but I don't know of those are fables or not. 

IE:

I saw this review, "I recently purchased a RT97. Watched some reviews online and appeared to be the right product for my application. I have several 100 acres of forest in northern Ontario, Canada with many hills and valleys. Cell communication is spotty at best. Radios work until your separated by a hill or valley. This product solved all of my issues. Highly recommend. Make sure to buy the antenna and cable as it is sold separately"

This almost seems like fiction with the current laws.

The RT-97 can be ordered to work within the UHF or VHF ham bands instead of the GMRS band...

Perhaps that's how the reviewer was using it?

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  • 4 weeks later...
Guest theRadioMan

Hmm, maybe that is how ha, bands. You can program it for anything you want once you receive it. 

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On 8/15/2021 at 6:14 AM, n4gix said:

The three key words: "possible future use" seem to preclude use until and unless repeater operations are sanctioned.

I don't know how it works in Canada but my basic understand of US law goes along the lines of "If it isn't expressly forbidden, it is allowed".

 

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