Input Tone? Output Tone? Am confused.

[ClockworkComic]

So I'm trying to set up a Wouxun KG-805G radio to use a repeater.  
Specifically, it's @Cactusboy19 's lovely looking repeater.  

The repeater lists Input Tone, and Output Tone.  I've tried the manual, and NotaRubicon's lovely videos, but I am still not sure I'm setting this up right. 

Is it that "Input Tone" = T-DCS  and "Output Tone" = R-DCS?
 

or am I way off track? 

[Guest]

The nomenclature is this:

12	R-CTC	Receiving CTCSS
13	T-CTC	Transmitting CTCSS
14	R-DCS	Receiving DCS
15	T-DCS	Transmitting DCS

CTCSS are listed as frequencies (Hz) / DCS are listed as numbers

Please note that you need to TRANSMIT (output) the repeater's RECEIVING tone.

 

[nokones]

When discussing ctcss/pl tones and dcs/dpl codes that are split between the mobile/base stations and the mobile relay (repeater) stations can be confusing to most users when using terms such as encode and decode, transmit and receive, input and output. I believe it would be less confusing to most people when discussing split tones/codes that if naming terms such as uplink and downlink where used would help a lot.

[SteveShannon]

9 hours ago, ClockworkComic said:

So I'm trying to set up a Wouxun KG-805G radio to use a repeater.  
Specifically, it's @Cactusboy19 's lovely looking repeater.  

The repeater lists Input Tone, and Output Tone.  I've tried the manual, and NotaRubicon's lovely videos, but I am still not sure I'm setting this up right. 

Is it that "Input Tone" = T-DCS  and "Output Tone" = R-DCS?
 

or am I way off track? 

YES, assuming the repeater uses DCS, the “input tone” for the repeater is T-DCS on your radio, the tone that you must transmit.

For the receive side you must either program the right receive tone or code OR tell your radio to not require a tone or code.  That can be helpful when first starting.  In that case your radio reproduces everything received on that frequency.

[ClockworkComic]

Y'all are a ton of help, thanks so much!

I'm going to test my setup later today.  

[Cactusboy19]

Keep in mind, you still might not be able to hit the repeater from your current location.

[Cactusboy19]

1 hour ago, ClockworkComic said:

Y'all are a ton of help, thanks so much!

I'm going to test my setup later today.  

Let me know when you want to test and I can probably monitor the repeater to see if I can hear you.

[WRYE463]

On 8/1/2023 at 11:09 PM, ClockworkComic said:

So I'm trying to set up a Wouxun KG-805G radio to use a repeater.  
Specifically, it's @Cactusboy19 's lovely looking repeater.  

The repeater lists Input Tone, and Output Tone.  I've tried the manual, and NotaRubicon's lovely videos, but I am still not sure I'm setting this up right. 

Is it that "Input Tone" = T-DCS  and "Output Tone" = R-DCS?
 

or am I way off track? 

Try ctss some are ctss aome are dcs 

[wayoverthere]

On 8/1/2023 at 9:09 PM, ClockworkComic said:

So I'm trying to set up a Wouxun KG-805G radio to use a repeater.  
Specifically, it's @Cactusboy19 's lovely looking repeater.  

The repeater lists Input Tone, and Output Tone.  I've tried the manual, and NotaRubicon's lovely videos, but I am still not sure I'm setting this up right. 

Is it that "Input Tone" = T-DCS  and "Output Tone" = R-DCS?
 

or am I way off track? 

You're close, imo. Input for the repeater is what you're transmitting from your handheld, though it may be T-DCS or T-CTCS, depending what the repeater is using (dcs or ctcss)...I haven't seen the data for that repeater. Output tone is the signal coming from the repeater, which fits with your receive tone on your handheld.

One easy way to (usually) tell ctcss vs dcs is the number format...if there's a decimal, it's ctcss. If it's just 3 digits, it's most likely dcs, especially if they're followed by a letter N (normal) or I (inverted).

[WRYY364]

Sorry to revive this thread. Trying to program my 805G for local repeaters, but CHIRP doesn't work, so trying to figure out how to program split tones on the factory software.

Basically there are two columns on the channel table: 

QT/DQT Dec and QT/DQT Enc. These appear to be the only places I can set tones. They have pop-up CTCSS and DCS tones in the same menu.

This is nomenclature I have not seen anywhere else.

So which one do I need to program to set the tone to open the repeater?

I think I have seen at least four different ways to characterize tones, and I'm sure someone out there has dreamed up at least four more...

TIA 

[Guest]

Entering the world of SPY lingo ... 

Decoding and Encoding makes it sound like there is real privacy to the use of "tones" -- plain and simple - it's not decoding and encoding it's just 'hearing and listening' vs, 'hearing and ignoring'.

As you send a message and add a tone ("encode") you make sure that the receiver that is hearing that tone ("decode") is actually listening to what you say if the tone is present.

However, anyone can hear and "decide" to listen by ignoring the "tone filter" and just listen to any (tone or no tone) transmission.

Note: If operators encounter problems hearing repeaters, one of the first steps to diagnose is to turn off their own radios "tone squelch" / "receive tone" / "decode" / ... 

 

 

[WRYY364]

23 minutes ago, WRXD372 said:

Entering the world of SPY lingo ... 

Decoding and Encoding makes it sound like there is real privacy to the use of "tones" -- plain and simple - it's not decoding and encoding it's just 'hearing and listening' vs, 'hearing and ignoring'.

As you send a message and add a tone ("encode") you make sure that the receiver that is hearing that tone ("decode") is actually listening to what you say if the tone is present.

However, anyone can hear and "decide" to listen by ignoring the "tone filter" and just listen to any (tone or no tone) transmission.

Note: If operators encounter problems hearing repeaters, one of the first steps to diagnose is to turn off their own radios "tone squelch" / "receive tone" / "decode" / ... 

 

 

Thanks. Just trying to figure out which term applies to opening the receiver. It would help if Wouxun's manual employed the same terminology as their software, at least.

As the radio comes from the factory there is nothing set for either decode or encode for any of the channels, so basically the radio is good for simplex, but not for repeaters (which makes sense).

I'm going to go with enc to send the tone and see if that works. Then I can get in on all the conversations about the weather, etc. 

[SteveShannon]

52 minutes ago, WRYY364 said:

Sorry to revive this thread. Trying to program my 805G for local repeaters, but CHIRP doesn't work, so trying to figure out how to program split tones on the factory software.

Basically there are two columns on the channel table: 

QT/DQT Dec and QT/DQT Enc. These appear to be the only places I can set tones. They have pop-up CTCSS and DCS tones in the same menu.

This is nomenclature I have not seen anywhere else.

So which one do I need to program to set the tone to open the repeater?

I think I have seen at least four different ways to characterize tones, and I'm sure someone out there has dreamed up at least four more...

TIA 

Encode

[dangerruss]

Newbie here....  I have a Midland MTX500 and need some help correlating different terms.  Which one in the input tone and which one is the output tone?

CTCSS/DCS Decode= 

CTSS/DCS Encode=

Thanks,

Russell

[SteveShannon]

3 hours ago, WRMC776 said:

Newbie here....  I have a Midland MTX500 and need some help correlating different terms.  Which one in the input tone and which one is the output tone?

CTCSS/DCS Decode= 

CTSS/DCS Encode=

Thanks,

Russell

Your radio encodes its transmissions which then go to the input to the repeater. 
Your radio decodes the signals it receives from the output of the repeater. 

[WSAA635]

On 12/17/2023 at 9:39 AM, WRYY364 said:

Sorry to revive this thread. Trying to program my 805G for local repeaters, but CHIRP doesn't work, so trying to figure out how to program split tones on the factory software.

CHIRP will work for programming frequencies if you use the KG-UVD1P profile. It won't let you do settings since the 805g is a single band UHF and the UVD1P is a duel band VHF/UHF but I set mine up today with that profile then went back in with the menu to do my settings.

[priller]

Silly question here, for a typical duplex repeater, do I need to program Tx and Rx tones into radio?  

[Guest]

1 minute ago, priller said:

Silly question here, for a typical duplex repeater, do I need to program Tx and Rx tones into radio?  

Yes. The repeater owner Will tell you want those tones are.  Some repeaters have them listed and some repeaters don’t use tones but most do and most need permission.  Some people wil tell you you can leave the rx tone off.  While that is true if you have a lot of local simplex you will here all other traffic all the time and that will get old really fast. 

[wayoverthere]

3 minutes ago, priller said:

Silly question here, for a typical duplex repeater, do I need to program Tx and Rx tones into radio?  

If the repeater needs an input tone (which many do), you'll need to set a tx tone on your radio. Rx tone is optional, but can be used to filter out other/simplex traffic if the repeater has an output tone

[priller]

Thank you SoCal and WayOver!

[WQAI363]

On 8/2/2023 at 12:09 AM, ClockworkComic said:

So I'm trying to set up a Wouxun KG-805G radio to use a repeeater.  
Specifically, it's @Cactusboy19 's lovely looking repeater.  

The repeater lists Input Tone, and Output Tone.  I've tried the manual, and NotaRubicon's lovely videos, but I am still not sure I'm setting this up right. 

Is it that "Input Tone" = T-DCS  and "Output Tone" = R-DCS?
 

or am I way off track? 

I know that you're asking something about an input tone, right? Most new Hams ask this same question. If you're asking about systems that use split tones, that were confusion sets in. If you know where the general location of certain repeater, you drive to vicinity and monitor in put frequency while scan the receive tone, I mean if the tone isn't listed. Heck, try other's advice, don't just take my advice. For you know, I may be rambling on other than the topic which you're trying to obtain knowledge on.

Take Care!