GMRS Expanded Personal Business Use

[WRUQ758]

A few thoughts.... With the damper put on Internet connected networks GMRS as a "hobby" seems to be waning, at least in my area. Repeaters dead and mostly unused. Repeater owners should look into bringing in family farms, small family businesses etc to use their repeaters for "personal business". You can easily have a club "membership fee" or "repeater maint fee" (not charging for business use which is illegal) and show users the value of GMRS and ease of licensing. Many farms use it in the Midwest. Back in the day my radio tech had a "community" GMRS multi-use repeater. Taxi, Cement trucks, family's staying in touch each with their own tone board. You could only license 2 pairs and "675" was thrown in for travelers' emergency. I know that has all changed but you can be creative while staying within today's rules. Just some thoughts. 

[Socalgmrs]

Every farm/ranch I know has a repeater and they use it daily.  I use a few repeaters each and every day for all types of reasons.  But why would a general person or ranch want strangers or other business on their repeater?  To what end?  Gmrs is for using while doing something.  If a group of people need a repeater they should put one up.  I know a few white water rafting company’s that have repeaters on the river since it’s a deep canyon and simplex doesn’t work so well.  Many of the skii places have gmrs repeaters on the top for winter skiing and summer biking and hikers. Same with many of our local neighborhoods, hunting clubs, off road parks and even some race tracks But I would not really want randos chit chatting on any of them.  Especially dudes that call them selves queens. 
 

with the price of professional used repeaters being less then $400 it’s not a huge expense for a group to put together. 

[WRUQ758]

If you look at the map on MyGMRS there are lots of shared repeaters. In Indiana they are busy but everywhere else I have travelled silent since the FCC ruling. I'm not talking about your "farm repeater" with an antenna on a silo, I referring to the ones on 300' towers being used for more than just radio checks. 

[amaff]

1 hour ago, WRUQ758 said:

Repeater owners should look into bringing in family farms, small family businesses etc to use their repeaters for "personal business".

Why?

[WRUQ758]

2 minutes ago, amaff said:

Why?

Because repeaters are not getting use after the FCC debacle with linked network. Users are allowed to use for "personal business", why not get more users on. The amateurs have a saying - use it or lose it.  They lost the 220 band due to lack of use. 

[TDM827]

Much of this would come down to comfortability with control of the repeater. If you don't own a repeater you don't control it. You don't control up-time, down time,  power considerations, back-up power plans, emergency power plans, maintenance, how to deal with interference, when an owner has to pull the plug or the drama that surrounds some repeater users, especially on the big repeaters. 

Despite some repeater "clubs" and "groups" having rules and expectations, it's the repeater owner who really has the final say on things. As it should be.

Bottom line: If you don't own a repeater you don't control it. If you don't have control of your communications you don't have control of your family business. If a family business is fine with taking that risk, and dealing with potential issues on an existing repeater,  there are no rules or regulations preventing them from utilizing existing repeaters.

The best repeater in our area has a fair amount of traffic. Adding family businesses to the mix would, in my opinion, decrease the whole user experience. But that's just my favorite repeater. And, current traffic on each existing repeater would determine that. 

[WRUQ758]

TDM827, fair enough. In the 70's there were community repeaters. Everyone got along and no nonsense. With the way people act today your point is valid. 

[TDM827]

1 minute ago, WRUQ758 said:

TDM827, fair enough. In the 70's there were community repeaters. Everyone got along and no nonsense. With the way people act today your point is valid. 

Yeah, I can't believe, but have gotten used to, some of the things I hear on GMRS. 

[WRYZ926]

Here is what we have experienced with commercial farms in the mid Missouri area and it isn't good.

The area commercial farms will only have a single license in the owner's name while letting every non related employee use their call sign. That's if they even use call signs at all.  We have also had commercial farms not even bother with having any license.

Then they will try to use repeaters owned by others without bothering to get permission.  Plus there is no etiquette and lot's of cussing by the farm employees. 

Most of the local GMRS repeater owners have banned any type of business/commercial farm use on their repeaters because of this.

You don't dare run a repeater without tones on both receive and transmit. Otherwise you hear all of the local farm workers on the corresponding simplex channels cussing. And again most never use call signs and probably don't even have licenses. Yes I know they could easily find the repeaters' tones, but most are too lazy to do that.

If farms want to invest their own time and money putting up their own repeaters then that is fine as long as they aren't interfering with the existing repeaters all ready in place.

[gortex2]

22 hours ago, WRUQ758 said:

Because repeaters are not getting use after the FCC debacle with linked network. Users are allowed to use for "personal business", why not get more users on. 

Why does it matter. Are you paying electric bil, tower fees and such for them ? You ever think the owners just dont care about users or nets on them ? I have multiple repeaters in multiple states. Some are those "300'" tower you speak of. They are my repeaters and I pay for maintenance and upkeep. they are there for me, my family and a few freinds. I can say 100% if you drive by some of them they are dead all week long as no one is there. Weeks are different. No way I'd want to put farmers or any of that on my stuff. Thats what LMR Part 90 is for. Additionally there is absolutely no requirement to have a repeater on the air. 95% of my traffic is simplex. repeater is there when needed. So its used. 

 

[WQAI363]

After reading the subject of using repeaters that seem to be silent most of the time, sounds similar to the ones that I have posted. I will admit that I've narrow minded on this subject.  Besides, the General Mobile Radio Service wasn't intended as HOBBY.

Of course, GMRS is technically intended for recreational, or an alternative use Telephone Systems aren't available. I may be wrong with what just said, but I know I'm not totally wrong about what I tried to say.

Edited 20 hours ago by WQAI363
I need it to fix it.

[WSHH887]

Okay, here's a silly question.  Why can't the collection and use of gmrs radios be a hobby?  Folks will say they're for use as an adjunct to other "hobbies" such are hiking, off roading, fishing, hunting, etc.  But I'd bet more that a few folks here have considerably more radios than they actually need for these activities.  The whole programming thing seems to be an area that sounds hobbish.  Then you get into setting up and maintaining repeaters.  Other than for your personal use that sounds very much like a hobby.  GMRS clubs, well that's definitely in hobby territory.  

Personally, I'm looking at it as just another hobby for my retirement years.  Another new field to study and learn.  And actually for the most part cheaper than some of my other hobbies.

[SteveShannon]

3 minutes ago, WSHH887 said:

Okay, here's a silly question.  Why can't the collection and use of gmrs radios be a hobby?  Folks will say they're for use as an adjunct to other "hobbies" such are hiking, off roading, fishing, hunting, etc.  But I'd bet more that a few folks here have considerably more radios than they actually need for these activities.  The whole programming thing seems to be an area that sounds hobbish.  Then you get into setting up and maintaining repeaters.  Other than for your personal use that sounds very much like a hobby.  GMRS clubs, well that's definitely in hobby territory.  

Personally, I'm looking at it as just another hobby for my retirement years.  Another new field to study and learn.  And actually for the most part cheaper than some of my other hobbies.

You’re exactly right. I asked a while back (slightly tongue in cheek) “What if my hobby is talking to people on the radio?”

Unfortunately there’s always someone who thinks they’re qualified to dictate how someone else enjoys their life. 

[WRUU653]

19 minutes ago, WSHH887 said:

Why can't the collection and use of gmrs radios be a hobby

Fair question. It must be okay because the FCC specifically mentions it.

“GMRS and the Family Radio Service (FRS), which share many of the GMRS channels, are intended for individuals such as family members and friends, scouting troops, emergency response groups, and hobbyists to communicate with each other over short distances, directly or through a repeater station.  Linking repeaters, via the internet or other networks, undermines the purpose and usefulness of the GMRS and FRS.”

[Jaay]

On 3/19/2025 at 1:58 PM, WRUQ758 said:

Because repeaters are not getting use after the FCC debacle with linked network. Users are allowed to use for "personal business", why not get more users on. The amateurs have a saying - use it or lose it.  They lost the 220 band due to lack of use. 

The 222 mhz. band is Alive and Well ! WE DID Not lose the 1.25 meter band, only a Small part from 220 to 222 mhz. was Allocated to United Parcel Service, then they decided Not to use it.

[Jaay]

2 hours ago, WSHH887 said:

Okay, here's a silly question.  Why can't the collection and use of gmrs radios be a hobby?  Folks will say they're for use as an adjunct to other "hobbies" such are hiking, off roading, fishing, hunting, etc.  But I'd bet more that a few folks here have considerably more radios than they actually need for these activities.  The whole programming thing seems to be an area that sounds hobbish.  Then you get into setting up and maintaining repeaters.  Other than for your personal use that sounds very much like a hobby.  GMRS clubs, well that's definitely in hobby territory.  

Personally, I'm looking at it as just another hobby for my retirement years.  Another new field to study and learn.  And actually for the most part cheaper than some of my other hobbies.

GMRS IS indeed a Hobby.

[TDM827]

8 hours ago, WSHH887 said:

Okay, here's a silly question.  Why can't the collection and use of gmrs radios be a hobby?  Folks will say they're for use as an adjunct to other "hobbies" such are hiking, off roading, fishing, hunting, etc.  But I'd bet more that a few folks here have considerably more radios than they actually need for these activities.  The whole programming thing seems to be an area that sounds hobbish.  Then you get into setting up and maintaining repeaters.  Other than for your personal use that sounds very much like a hobby.  GMRS clubs, well that's definitely in hobby territory.  

Personally, I'm looking at it as just another hobby for my retirement years.  Another new field to study and learn.  And actually for the most part cheaper than some of my other hobbies.

Not a silly question. As long as we follow FCC rules and licensing rules, GMRS users are pretty wide open to use the band as they see fit.

Whether it's communicating while doing activates, talking to immediate family members or treating it like a hobby and experimenting with equipment as the rules allow the FCC doesn't care how you use it. As long as they get their 35 bucks.     

Now, if you break the rules through experimentation, start advocating to turn GMRS into HAM or try to dictate how other licensees use GMRS, expect immediate and less than positive feedback.

And, rightfully so, will be directed to HAM radio where tons of people make it a hobby.   

Enjoy!

[WRYZ926]

7 hours ago, Jaay said:

The 222 mhz. band is Alive and Well ! WE DID Not lose the 1.25 meter band, only a Small part from 220 to 222 mhz. was Allocated to United Parcel Service, then they decided Not to use it.

The 1.25m/220 MHz band might be dead in some areas but it is alive and well in other areas. No one uses the band around me and there is only one 220 repeater in the entire state (that's listed) and it is linked full time to a 2m repeater.

And yes UPS did get a small portion of the band that they have never used. There is a company trying to get a portion of the 900 MHz band for GPS right now which will be on the same frequencies that the LORA/Meshtastic devices use.

I don't want to see any loss of frequencies on any of the amateur and GMRS bands. And I don't see GMRS being expanded since there are a lot of business and government use frequencies near the GMRS frequencies.

And I sure don't want to have family businesses using open GMRS repeaters based on prior experiences with commercial farms in my area. 

[WRTC928]

I'm of the opinion that if you feel the need to use a repeater for your business, you should install and maintain it yourself. My reasoning is that business use could create so much traffic that other people couldn't get use out of the repeater. Conversely, casual users could create enough traffic to make it difficult to conduct business. Of course, if the repeater owner is okay with business use, it's none of my business. I think of much of this stuff as being a matter of good manners. I would consider it rude to jam up a repeater with my business making it difficult for other people to use it. Not that it would necessarily happen. There's a GMRS repeater in Oklahoma City that someone obviously uses for business purposes during the weekdays, but it's still idle more than it's active. I don't know if the business owns the repeater, but obviously the owner doesn't mind. Nevertheless, if I were going to use a repeater for my business, I'd prefer to put up my own. Of course, that requires that you have access to a tower or something similar, so it's not exactly as easy as buying one and firing it up. 

[WRTC928]

On a related thought, is there any prohibition on tx/rx on different frequencies on simplex? Business users don't necessarily need 3-way communication. Most of it is between the dispatcher and the field units. If you put up a tall antenna and a base unit, you could communicate with your units even if they were out of simplex range of one another. As I read it, the 467 frequencies are specifically designated as repeater inputs. However, is there any prohibition on for example rx on 462.55000 and tx on 462.60000? Yes, it would create a lot of confusion on the airwaves, and I have no intention (or need) to do it, but I'm often curious about irrelevant technical matters.  In practice, it would be simpler to put up a base unit and if the field units were out of range of one another, base could relay a message or they could just call each other on the phone. Also, this is one of the cases where those radios that operate over cell towers would be a good option. That's probably the one I would go with if I owned a business -- pay $50 a year per radio and let someone else worry about the infrastructure.

[SteveShannon]

26 minutes ago, WRTC928 said:

However, is there any prohibition on for example rx on 462.55000 and tx on 462.60000?

No

[Davichko5650]

19 minutes ago, SteveShannon said:

No

I hear this near my work. Local metal processing Co. uses a lot of FRS radios, and in the morning, the lead foreman calls out channel assignments quite often;  "Main Office is on 14 today, Receiving on 12, Production is on 5, QA on 3." 

 

But if you're talking using 2 simplex channels to work "split", also legal AFAIK. But you will need a dual watch radio or two radios to accomplish that!

[Jaay]

34 minutes ago, Davichko5650 said:

I hear this near my work. Local metal processing Co. uses a lot of FRS radios, and in the morning, the lead foreman calls out channel assignments quite often;  "Main Office is on 14 today, Receiving on 12, Production is on 5, QA on 3." 

 

But if you're talking using 2 simplex channels to work "split", also legal AFAIK. But you will need a dual watch radio or two radios to accomplish that!

You can program One commercial quality radio to do this.