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First, your radio has 30 preprogrammed GMRS channels. The first 22 are simplex channels, meaning they receive and transmit on the same frequency. Then there are eight preprogrammed repeater channels. They may be numbered 23-30 or something with RP in the name. They receive on exactly the same frequencies as channels 15-22, but when you transmit using one of them they offset the frequency by 5 MHz. Channel 17 receives and transmits on 462.600. Channel 25 (or possibly 17RP or RP17) receives on 462.600and transmits on 467.600. Whatever it’s called, that’s the channel you want to use for the repeater you mentioned. If you tune your radio to that channel you should be able to hear the repeater if someone is talking. The input and output tones are relative to the repeater. Your transmission is the repeater input. In order for the repeater to pay attention to your transmissions, you will also need to program the transmitter on your radio with the repeater input tone frequency. That’s the 141.3 Hz number. Similarly, the repeater’s output is what you receive. If you leave the receive tone empty you will hear everything on that frequency. When you’re first getting started with programming a radio I suggest that you leave the receive tone cleared out. Then, when you’re confident that your transmissions are being heard (activating the repeater) you can try putting in the tone. Then, you’ll only hear transmissions that include the tone. Hope this helps!

What happened in New York appears to have been a cautious reaction to an unofficial warning. That did not establish any kind of legal precedent. The FCC has a website that clearly says “any other network” in a way that appears to conflict with the written rules. What people fail to understand is that only the written rules have legal status and even the written rules can be challenged. If the FCC attempted to cite someone based on their “any other network” website interpretation they would have to show that their interpretation is supported by the written rules. That would be expensive for all parties but stranger things have happened. With the recent SCOTUS decision regarding Chevron Deference it may be even easier to defend against the FCC interpretation, but until someone is cited and fights the citation we won’t have anything other than our opinions to argue about. An organization I serve joined another similar organization to sue ATF in federal court over their classification of rocket propellant as an explosive (it isn’t). We fought for nine years. We prevailed and ATF had to reimburse us for our legal costs. Our two organizations had less than 15,000 members at the time. ATF was relying on their claimed expertise but we were able to demonstrate that they were technically incorrect.

It's the General Mobile Radio Service... Not Family Radio Service, as determined by the frequencies and radio type. With the exception of some grandfathered businesses, anyone one with a license can conduct any personal or business related activities on the frequency as long as the person or business employees have their own license or the operator is covered under a family member's license. The idea that people are struggling with the intended purpose of the service is evident in posts like the ones I've quoted above. Just because the legal uses don't fall inside some box that you think it should, doesn't some how make it a rule violation or act of moral turpitude. I can't find a single action in the FCC database of a person being officially questioned, accused or charged with the act of solely having linked repeaters or solely using remote control over a network. I'm waiting for any proof of an official opinion from the FCC... any time in the last 10 years. Can you provide anything except for Randy's video and conjecture on the internet? Like, anything officially released from the FCC or US Congress?

I just don't understand why people keep saying this. It almost sounds like some people are jealous of successful clubs and networks, rather than interested the legality of the use and practical use cases. The rules about voice moving between systems over network-linked repeaters are vague in most cases, and flat-out contradict themselves in others. The FCC refuses to make an official statement or charge anyone. No operators "know" if its in scope of the rules or not.

@WSCW485, @Lman57, @AZCOP any and everyone else new to the forum recently that I might have missed welcome to mygmrs!

What we think we know happened is only hearsay as we have never directly heard from the repeater owner himself or the FCC on the subject. Exaggerating what the facts are doesn’t make an opinion fact. As long as there is no comment by the actual parties involved and I mean the FCC or the actual repeater owner, then this argument will go no where. I really can’t get all worked up over some private citizen shutting down his own repeaters if they are not saying anything on the subject. Nothing to see here. It’s like saying Alvin said Bob up the street won’t let his friends use his bathroom anymore because the city is going to fine him for using too much water. But you don’t know Alvin. You don’t know Bob. And Bob has never said anything to you. And the city hasn’t said anything to you. And who cares if Bob doesn’t want anyone in his bathroom. It sure isn’t conclusive that you or anyone else can’t share their bathroom. Even if it was on YouTube.

There was no FCC action. There was a friend in the FCC that gave a heads up to a friend as far as I can see. There was no legal action taken that I know of. The repeaters were taken down before anything could happen as a precaution from friendly advice from someone on the inside.

Yes... All of the Personal Radio Services (including license by rule) allow license sharing. Then there are service such as Amateur Radio, which allow anyone to operate with the station call sign of the licensee. Business class radio typically covers all employees and family members. That is just the few that I know off the top of my head.

Easiest way, IMO, is to hook up either an inexpensive digital voice recorder to an inexpensive HT radio like a UV5G with the appropriate cable, or plug the cable into the mic input of your computer and run Audacity in VOX mode.

Well for one it's suppose to be a family radio service and it not always being treated as that. If I had a choice of having large linked systems vs just single repeaters I'd probably chose just a single repeater. Mainly because the frequencies are very limited in the repeater system and having a large linked system means it's going to be busy when you really need it. Even one of the non linked repeaters I listen to have some really chatty people on it and they don't leave any space between keying each other so breaking in usually means you have to key over them which they'll say is rude but in reality it's not their airwaves to monopolize.

I have to agree with @marcspaz on this one. Its all varue and until the FCC actually changes rules it will be. The system in question regardless of what you think was a simulcast voted system. To me that 100% different than a linked repeater all over the US or state. Its the same input and output on each repeater. In the past there were multiple voted GMRS repeaters that REACT teams and others used. Back then it was 4W circuits on microwave. It worked and worked well. It really wastn't until GMRS turned into HAM lite that this linking crae started. I'm for one looking forward to see what the FCC comes back with but to be honest other than the folks on this forum 99% of the GMRS user base could care less. They push a button and talk.

GMRS n00b. Haven't used a call sign since 1976, so this is going to take some getting used to. But, I'll learn: That's why I'm here. Jay

In my 23 Wrangler IZARUBICON 2 Dr. I have a XTL5000 Remote high-powered, of course, I set the max RF output power at 50 watts, for three reasons. 1) to be legal for GMRS; 2) I really don't need the extra power; 3) I don't want to max out the Aux 1 circuit with the XTL5000 at max power draw, a CB Radio, Streamlight Flashlight Charger, and a Dometic Refrigerator. In my racecar, I use a XTS1500 portable radio with a remote PT-T on the steering with the radio connected to a non-ground plane Antenex Phantom antenna mounted to my rollcage in the rear.

using the wrong radios....for what? To talk on the repeater? Either of those will talk on it just fine... (well, the 5R after it's been unlocked but I pretty much just assume all of them are at this point)

Just trying to give a pep talk.

You’re really not good at reading comprehension are you?

you better get busy and sue the FCC... sounds like you got it under your sleeve. Don't roll em' up or you'll loose your tactics.. Stay tough, show em' 'you da man'

No

Oh, I should fit right in then! Hi, I'm Gary and I'm a recovering CBer!

Go to channel RPT5 for 462.600/467.600Mhz Press the blue button on the upper left, normally it will be on number 0 - bandwidth mode. Either type in 11 or use the up arrows to get to #11, Rx CTCSS Press the blue button again and the green caret should go down to the word OFF Use the up arrow to advance to 141.3Hz and press the blue button again. This sets BOTH the RX and TX CTCSS to 141.3Hz. You will only hear the repeater this way. If you only wish to activate the repeater and listen to all then you need to set the Rx CTCSS back to OFF Alternately if you only wish to set the tone to activate the repeater instead of going to #11, go to #13 and set the Tx CTCSS to 141.3Hz in the same manner as before. This way the Tx will be set and the Rx will be left OFF.

The TYT 9800 being sold now is the same as the TYT-9800 plus. I have no idea what the differences between these and the D model. There’s at least one video that demonstrates how to unlock the radio. From the website: Note: TYT TH-9800 is the same as TH-9800 Plus after 2018, all the stock from Radioddity is the latest version of TH-9800 with the latest firmware and cross-band function.

edit|preferences|recording|sound activated recording -> enable. Set the Level (dB) to something low enough that "full quieting" hiss is enough to keep it open when squelch is open. I haven't fired up my raspberry pi in awhile, but I bet you could even run Audacity under an older pi. I'm using Audacity 3.4.2 on an Ubuntu laptop.

We have a Broadcastify feed for our 2-meter repeater. I'm not the one who administers it, but I do have a paid account so I can listen to the archives and document jammers, malicious interference and other shenanigans. My dubious understanding of it is that you interface a receiver with their system via your computer and the internet. That said, check it out. It might work for you.

Because of a single anecdotal and unofficial conversation between 2 people? Not sure how you get there. Part 95 definitions of Remote Control, Operate and Network Connection: Remote control: Operation of a Personal Radio Services station from a location that is not in the immediate vicinity of the transmitter. Operation of a Personal Radio Services station from any location on the premises, vehicle or craft where the transmitter is located is not considered to be remote control. Operate: Control the functioning of a Personal Radio Service station; in particular, cause a Personal Radio Service station to begin, continue or cease transmitting. Network connection: Connection of a Personal Radio Services station to the public switched network, so that operators of other stations in that service are able to make (and optionally to receive) telephone calls through the connected station. What is allowed: § 95.1745 "...GMRS repeater, base and fixed stations may be operated by remote control.". § 95.1749 "GMRS repeater, base and fixed stations," "...may be connected to the public switched network or other networks for the sole purpose of operation by remote control". What is not allowed: § 95.1749 "Operation of a GMRS station with a telephone connection is prohibited".

Why? When we take the rules as a whole, its completely legal, as long as a GMRS user can't make or receive phone calls nor have data traverse the telephone network (which almost doesn't exist any longer).

In GMRS, there are 22 simplex channels. 462.600 corresponds with channel 17. In repeater terms, an input frequency is the frequency that a radio must transmit at to be received by the repeater. The output frequency is the frequency the radio must listen to, to hear the repeater's output transmission. Any transmission from a 2-way radio on the input frequency will be repeated back on the output frequency for other radios to hear, as long as the input uses the correct squelch tone. The GMRS repeater channels pair an input frequency 5MHz higher than the output frequency. This means that simplex channels 15-22 are the same as the eight output frequencies of GMRS repeaters. Those output channels in the 462.xxxx range get paired with input frequencies in the 467.xxxx range. So 462.7000 gets paired with 467.7000. And 462.6000 gets paired with 467.6000. Any GMRS type approved radio that can work with repeaters will automatically know the 5MHz pairing. You shouldn't have to set that part up manually. You pick RP17, or RP3 or 25R, whatever your radio calls the repeater at 462.6000. Your radio will now be listening on 462.6000, and transmitting on 467.6000. The correct name for the repeater channel at 462.6000 will be in the manual. That's the first half of the battle. Next, you need your radio to send a tone when it transmits to the repeater. This tone is how the repeater knows you are talking to it, and not to some other repeater that happens to be on the same frequency. You must be on the correct frequency, AND you must transmit the correct tone on that frequency. The tone is inaudible to people, but is heard by the repeater. The repeater recognizes the tone, and opens squelch, meaning starts listening. Whatever a repeater listens to, it retransmits 5MHz lower. So in your radio you need to program tone 141.3 as a Tx (transmit) tone. If you don't program this tone, the repeater won't wake up. It's that simple. As for how to program the transmit tone in a TD-H3, I won't deprive you the opportunity to look it up in the manual the method of programming 141.3 as a transmit tone. You'll find it there, and now that you know what it is for, you may be more successful in setting it. Now you should be able to key up the radio, and state "This is WSDK548 doing a radio check. I'm looking for a signal report if anyone is monitoring." When you release the key, you'll hear a pffffft-click, which people call a "kerchunk". If you hear this, it means the radio opened squelch while you were transmitting, which means you have the correct repeater frequency and tone. If you get a response back from a person, even better. At this point you may also notice kids playing on FRS radios on channel 17, or road crews, or whatever. That's because you only set a TX tone. You are transmitting the tone needed for the repeater to listen to you, but you are not filtering out transmissions coming back to you. You are listening "open." You may not like hearing kiddies pressing the call button and road crews letting ten more cars through the work zone. So now you need to program 141.3 as an RX tone, or an input tone. Once you've done this, things will get much quieter. You will only hear someone transmitting on 462.600 with tone 141.3. There won't be many people who just stumble into this combination, so you won't be hearing much (or any) unwanted traffic. But the repeater, when it transmits back to you or your friends, transmits that 141.3 tone. By setting that as an RX tone in your radio, your radio's squelch will open when it hears that tone, and you'll hear the repeater. ... if you're in range, if you programmed it right, if someone is hitting the repeater that you're listening to correctly. To transmit to the repeater you need the right frequency and the right tone. If you set the wrong frequency or the wrong tone, the repeater won't listen to you. To listen to the repeater you need the right frequency and NO tone, OR the right frequency and the right tone. If you set the wrong tone, your radio won't open squelch and you won't hear the repeater.

I have both the uv21 (pro v2) and gm21 - I like the feel of them - The uv21 offers 1.25 meters, something I've never had access to before. The gm21 can listen there but can't xmit. It is gmrs after all. The xmit audio is good and rcv audio is good too. No complaints so far but I really have no use for 999 memory channels.

It’s a completely different experience. Programming commercial radios is a lot different. The function reference is a good addition to the software’s help file. The modifications manual is for adding accessories to the radio and the connections for the various ports. TK-2180_3180_7180_8180 MPT Function Reference V2.00.pdf TK2180_3180_7180_8180 Modification Info V1.13.pdf

Thank youfor the welcome.

Welcome @Lman57.

Howdy I joined a few days ago I picked up a two pack of GMRS TidRadios TD-H3 I'm looking forward to learning the in's and out's.

An update on the Green Forest 550 machine that I heard just now on the Harrison 600 machine is that the antenna came down in a storm a few days ago, so I guess I now know what is going on with it. Hope they get it back up soon and maybe even better than it was, if that's possible considering the coverage it had. No I haven't. I usually just listen to the repeater in Green Forest AR and sometimes talk to some on it but I am not in any of their clubs or anything. The group it was part of is Arkradio.net and I have been watching the web page but I haven't seen any news yet about it. Maybe I will shoot an email to them and see but I kind of feel out of place since I am in MO and not really part of the group that is usually on the system. But I do like to listen and maybe jump in from time to time and chat. Here in MO we don't have much of a GMRS system except for a couple of local repeaters with one of those a new one that just started in Branson so not much traffic on it yet and another one that is permission only supposedly but they list the code on Mygmrs.com so I don't know about it and I can't hear it from where I am anyway.

I politely ask them to repeat the call so I can put it on paper for myself. If they seem cranky about repeating the call you know you don’t need to speak with them in the future. At least that’s how I handle it. Good luck and enjoy.

You don't need to make excuses for or rationalize recording call signs you hear to anyone on these forums.

The quote above yours is from my post on the first page of this thread, back in February. As you can see, we understand which part is meant. But the thing is that the actual regulations are what matter, not an interpretation of them on another FCC page.

That has been mentioned more than a few times on myGMRS , but the regulations don’t say the same thing. The difference is why lawyers and judges are well paid.

Just joined up to the forums but have had the license for short while. Some might know me under my ham call of KE4ZNR out of North Carolina but good to be licensed under GMRS as well! Strong Signals to all!

I think I found that for you. I wanted a copy for my records. I keep a collection of Kenwood radio programming software, even for radio models I don't have. Yup! I had a used TK-3180 once that showed up with the SJ-180 firmware. Lucky for me the firmware update feature was enabled so all I did was load the new firmware in the radio and used KPG-89D to program it. TK2180K_TK3180_7180_8180_V122_035C_Firmware.zip

There were two repeaters I occasionally use in my area that didn't start out being link but ended up that way. I don't keep up with that stuff so the way I found out was I had both repeaters up on my 935G as I came down off the mountain. I was going to meet a friend in the valley. I called out on one of the repeaters we had agreed on and lo and behold I heard the transmission on both repeaters. One of those repeaters is now offline. So, as wayoverthere stated, you can definitely be hearing yourself on a repeater that is linked using a different channel/frequency.

There are some problems with your logic. First.. Amateur radio rules have exactly zero to do with GMRS rules. Don't waste time comparing them. Second, we (members of this forum and the GMRS community) have been debating on the rules and requested verification from the FCC if linking repeaters over public internet for the use of simulcast is within the scope of rules or a violation. There are several contradictions and vagueness in the rules about network connections that the user community just can't say for sure and the FCC is refusing to comment. (plenty of posts here about that) Last... this wasn't an FCC action. It was reportedly two people (FCC employee and a GMRS repeater owner) who are either friends, acquaintances or have some type of professional association, and the FCC employee started some unofficial communications with the GMRS repeater owner. It's unclear if it was a warning or a courtesy from an acquaintances/friend, or if an agent was subverting processes due to some pre-existing work relationship. In either case, there will not be any official documentation in the FCC database. Also, I personally am aware of several people in the professional comms world who are aware of this situation and asked their FCC POCs about this specific situation, as well as GMRS simulcast over public internet, in general terms. Those FCC POCs are refusing to comment on anything. Until formal action is taken and it ends up in court, everyone is just guessing at the regulation.

The 8180 is the 30 watt version and the 8180H is the 45 watt version as previously mentioned. The 8180 30 watt version does have a low power setting of 1 watt and the low power setting for the 8180H is 10 watts but unfortunately the 10 watts is not legal for GMRS channels 1-7. Get the TK 8180. The difference between the two radios you will never know the difference between 15 watts in performance. It's only about a dB and a half less. In a group of other wheelers on the trail, more than likely the other wheelers are using either CCR POS junk or Walmart special bubblepack radios, in that case the TK 8180 30 watt version will be more than sufficient. Also, you can't go wrong with the cables built by Blue Max 49ers.

One more thing. Sometimes these radios are loaded with the "Passport" firmware in place of the regular LTR one. In that case when you try to program the radio using the KPG software the radio display show "USE SJ-180". That's the special "Passport" version. You can fix it by writing the normal LTR firmware to the radio. However the firmware write feature has to be enabled. If not then you need the SJ-180 radio programming software and enable the firmware write feature. I've attached a copy of that too. Unfortunately I don't have a copy of the mobile radios LTR firmware file, just the portables. SJ-180 v2.2.0.6 for TK-7180-7180H-7182-7182H-8180-8180H 2.zip

Sounds like the new Rocky Talkie 5w would be ideal for you. As for the debate on “cheap Chinese radios” - I think they work great for some folks and it’s how I started in GMRS. Lots of features and they get the job done for relatively little money. Being someone who likes the feel of quality gear, I moved to Icom for my mobile & HT, while my son got the Midland stuff.

They've had free reign over us for 40 years because of that bad decision in '84. I think even though the decision was unconstitutional it would have been best for the people who knew better to make the decisions instead of a court that really didn't have the knowledge/experience to make those decisions. Unfortunately we are talking about bureaucrats who love power and would do anything to have more and more. And herein lies the problem with giving agencies power like that which they aren't authorized to have. They make decisions that give them more power and continue to do so and then make rules/regulations with the power of law behind them without any congressional oversight or even input. The courts got lazy and either didn't want to do their jobs or outright refused to do the job and deferred all authority to power hungry bureaucrats that only had their own interests in hand. This took way too long to get rid of. But at least now we are on our way to slowing new things way down because of overloaded courts. And we won't have bureaucrats making decisions that give them power over the people to expand the govt to give themselves more power. Yes, I'm one of those.

Maybe not, but its still a better and additional hurdle for them to have to get through, than to just make up a "law" on their own and toss it out to us pheasants.

This will change given the SCOTUS ruling Friday re Chevron deference. Agencies will no longer be able to fill in the blanks on ambiguous laws. It's now back to the courts.

Well until they figure out that much power won't get them much beyond the radio horizon. No "channel 6 super bowl" on GMRS. Also UHF amps that can do 250 watts won't be cheap either, if you can find them.

Let's be real here. You're coming to a forum full of GMRS users and asking if you really need GMRS for your situation. What kinds of answers did you honestly think you'd get? If you don't think you need it, then don't get a radio or a license. If/when you think it would benefit you, get a couple of radios and a license. It's $3.50 per year for a license. Overlanding doesn't tend to be an inexpensive hobby, so surely the entry fee for GMRS won't put you in a financial bind.

Ham testing will NOT go away until the rest of the world agrees to it. The ITU (International Telecommunications Union) set the rules for all countries to follow with regards to radio communications. One of the biggest things that allow's GMRS to exist with no real verification of knowledge is the fact it's UHF and low power. Other than Canada and Mexico, no other countries are going to be in the communications range of any US station (other than MAYBE Russia and users in Alaska, but even that's a big IF. Lower frequencies especially HF stuff will carry for extremely long distances when the conditions are right and that happens much more often than band openings in the UHF region. So it's really not as easy as the FCC just handing out ham licenses. The ITU was the reason that the Morse Code requirement hung in so long. And it was the maritime industry and regulations for ship to shore communications that was the driving force. A bit of history. Just prior to the ITU lifting the International code requirement, ships over a certain size were required to have a licensed radio operator on board that knew Morse Code for emergency communications. That requirement was lifted a year or two before the ITU met and recended the Morse Code requirement for ham licenses. The whole idea was that a ham operator would be able to receive and handle emergency traffic from a ship at sea that was having problems. With the full implementation of the EPURB satellite system and a new requirement that all ships were required to have on board emergency radios that would automatically give location information via GPS to the monitoring stations for the system, there was no longer a need or requirement for Morse Code. So ham radio requirements were lifted for the first level of ham license (No Code Technician) and the flood gates opened. The higher class licenses still at that time had a code requirement, mostly due to the older hams raising hell claiming that it would be the end of ham radio,,,, of course that didn't happen and the requirements for code were lifted for all ham license classes. I actually started as a No Code Tech, and held that license for over 10 years. I did finally upgrade to general, but I am yet to get my Extra class license. I may do it at some point, but I really don't know that I care enough to bother. Regardless, I will maintain my current call sign as I have had it now for almost 30 years (originally licensed in 1994). Point is there is a reason that hams have to test. And those are the reasons. With GMRS on UHF we don't really have much ability to interfere with other services in other countries. With Ham radio on HF or even 50 Mhz (6 meters) there is that possibility and operators need to know where they can operate and where they can't. And remember, GMRS radios are NOT suppose to have VFO's, or be programmable one any frequency outside the bounds of the 30 frequencies we are allocated. Ham radios are not that way. Granted, they do have transmit blocks in the newer radios. But the old tube gear was smile and dial so to speak.

We have seen that the Google, Bing, Ask and other search engine spybots are camped out here reading new posts. Just a word to the wise... use your discretion in posting personal or sensative information that could possibly compromise your personal safety, security, lead to identity theft, or give non-licensed individuals a way to access your radio systems.