sifert
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Posts posted by sifert
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21 hours ago, MichaelLAX said:
It all depends upon whose ox is being gored:
The FCC delayed the implementation of the $35 reduced GMRS fee to coincide with the implementation of charging Hams fees for services that were previously FREE!
Touché
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On 7/25/2021 at 7:52 AM, mbrun said:
I am just learning that the FCC has given serious consideration to allowing location positioning information to be included in GMRS communications on all channels, and allowing FM modulation on existing CB channels.
Here is a fresh-off-the-press YouTube video that provides an overview:
741 Channel -
And here is the FCC rules amendment that that covers the proposed changes:
Looks like Motorola is is behind the petition for location positioning capability and Cobra is behind the petition for FM on CB frequencies.
The FCC document should be a good read. I have not read the whole thing yet. I hope to find something in there too that officially legalizes part 90 radios for GMRS.
Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM
Well it's now official and the rules take effect Oct. 28, 2021
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I see what you guys mean, sorry to sound like a troll. @berkinet, I just discovered what Q-codes are, and there's a reason why nobody knows the definition of QRP... because there isn't one. I had to go find on the Wikipedia page this info:
"Q" has no official meaning, but it is sometimes assigned with a word with mnemonic value, such as "Queen's" (e.g. QFE = Queen's Field Elevation), "Query", "Question", or "reQuest".
I now realize that this topic is beyond the scope of this forum, but for the record the definition of QRP is:
"Q-code: Reduce Power"
Lastly, @marcspaz what do you mean by a snooty entitlement attitude?
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(Regarding above post Lots of answers available if you google "qrp radios")
This is exactly my point when I said that "the community is very inviting in a go-figure-it-out-yourself way."
I first Googled the exact text Marcspaz mentioned: 7 MHz (40 meter) HF QRP radio.
Lots of results, but no definition of QRP that spells out the acronym.
Then I Googled "qrp radios" like you say.
Lots of results, but no definition of QRP that spells out the acronym.
I went to the first ARRL result, this page. This page talks all about QRP, but never actually says what QRP actually is. The entire article assumes the reader knows what "QRP" stands for.
Not only is this really bad for newbies... but it's also bad for the entire myGMRS.com domain. Why, you ask? Because guess who else is a total newbie?
...Googlebot!
Thus, if myGMRS.com wants to be useful, helpful, and the go-to source for all things GMRS and all of its subtopics such as discussions about "QRP," then it behooves the entire myGMRS.com community to stop assuming. While Google is listening, understand that Googlebot is a search robot with an unprecedented memory, but less intelligence than a kindergartener. It only knows what we tell it. And it looks like no one ever told it what "QRP" stands for... and I bet if someone here on myGMRS.com took the time to spell it out and define what QRP stands for and what it means, then within a few days that post on myGMRS.com will rank #1 for most users in the world who are searching for "qrp radios" or even "what does qrp stand for."
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Get your Ham license and buy a 7 MHz (40 meter) HF QRP radio, a small 35 ah battery, a folding or rollable solar charger (optional) make a wire antenna you can toss up in the trees. Call Mayday.
No one local will hear you, but many people throughout the nation will and you can ask for help. I have had someone give e me grief about this in the past, saying it doesn't do any good to talk to someone on the radio who is 3 states away and my response is always the same.... if I'm stranded in the mountains of Virginia, someone in Georgia, Maine or California can call 911 just as easily as someone in a nearby town.
This is awesome. I had no idea this was possible! Since this is the first time I've heard about this, I have some questions:
- What does QRP mean? (When I talk to newbies in my profession, I s-p-e-l-l o-u-t all acronyms when talking or writing so we don't waste time with the back-and-forth questions).
- What are some examples of these radios?
- I mentioned n9taxlabs.com's roll-up slim jim antenna, but is that an example of the toss-in-a-tree antenna you speak of if I get one for the 7 Megahertz (Mhz) frequency?
- What is an example of a small 35 amp-hour (AH) battery?
Like I alluded in original post, you speak as if we already know all the esoteric details you take for granted. No one is requiring you to respond and this is just a forum. But at the end of the day, I bet I'm not the only person who will take action based on this information, and I bet this information here will save someone's life someday. That in itself potentially puts you in the position of the reluctant hero. :-)
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Agreed. Mine is fiberglass and is guyed with some UV and weather resistant paracord to help reduce lightning risk.
Marc, what part of the antenna is fiberglass and why does paracord reduce lightning risk? I thought antennas must be metal?
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@berkinet @marcspaz @boxcar this is all very good info. Thank you for your responses. It helps clarify to me that the answer isn't necessarily to lead or follow as I posited, but to become a better facilitator of structuring information in a way that benefits each person in their own journey who may not even know what to ask or are too timid to ask.
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I currently have a couple of BTech GMRS-V1s. I bought them for emergencies but sometimes use them on trips and outings. I'd like to increase the reception and range a little so I'm guessing a better antenna will help somewhat. BaoFeng recomends the Nagoya NA-701C for the GMRS-V1, but I would think the Nagoya NA-771 would be better overall because it's almost twice as long. The specs for each are almost the same, but I'm not really a tech guy, so comparing the numbers doesn't help me. Any thoughts? Any other antennas I should look at? Thanks.
See my post here because I had the same issue not knowing which antenna is best. I have no hard data on the results, but I got a 5/8 wave and a 1/4 wave antenna (I don't even know what that really means) from SmileyAntenna and they put every other antenna I've tried to shame in every terrain I've used them in.
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The conceptual idea is sound in that professionals do have the knowledge to design a system for a user or even a class of user however, we all know there are no real "cookie cutter" solutions. While it would be possible to specify some equipment from a single brand that would fit the three (or is it four) classes of user; mobile, base, repeater and possibly the fourth being handheld not every manufacturer of these radios build all the parts needed for a complete installation with the exception of handhelds. Lets look at a typical home or base station setup. First you need the transceiver and a DC power supply with it as very few are AC powered. Next you would need the coaxial cable feed to the antenna and its mount with the antenna being the final piece. Here is where the most customization takes place. You need to know the distance for you coax run and how you will mount your antenna. There is some help on the mounting of an external antenna as the FCC has ruled that building owners and associations cannot deny you the right to install your antenna however they may make and enforce rules about how it is placed.
The biggest issues any combo or kit recommender runs into are meeting customer expectations. While some expectations can be mitigated through different mixes of equipment, the biggest hurdle for the consumer will be the price of the kit and the performance of the equipment. Better equipment means a higher end price to the purchaser. That's why the homebrew solutions often work best. Being able to mix and match pieces provides the best path for any user. As different equipment becomes available the user can upgrade different parts of the install. A better transceiver may be able to use the DC power supply from the older unit along with the coax and antenna. The coax could be replaced with one having lower loss for the same distance or the antenna changed, each providing some improvements. There are just too many variables for a system designer to overcome.
Thank you! This is a huge step. You're actually outlining the whole shell of what's possible, defining the segments, and getting us started on the basics all in one place.
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I think the biggest problem is, there are too many opinions AND most new users don't even know "what" they want to do. For the most part, many new radio users don't know what tech is the correct tech for any intended purpose. Until they get in and find out something they like and figure out how it will suit their needs, we wouldn't even know what advice to give.
I have tried to help, though. I actually have a published article I wrote about the pros and cons of each common service, what they could potentially used for, and just a really brief overview of the science behind it. It was focused around off-road communications, but applies to everything. I can always share it here, but I haven't due to potential bickering.
I'd rather have your expertise and there's no need for bickering. If someone knows what is best for each application, stand up and say it. The rest of us need to know when to lead, and know when to follow.
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Aaaaaand speak of the devil...
Sunday's Wall Street Journal article, which affirms everything I'm saying!
‘Ready for Lunch? Over.’ Walkie-Talkies Make Comeback With Folks Stuck at Home. Coronavirus lockdowns give the World War II-era device new life -
Little harsh... relax and be nice.
I re-read what I wrote, and I agree with you; it sounds really rude! I'm sorry @jonny, et al.
Here's what I meant so I should have said this:
I'm new to RF and trying to learn, and you guys clearly have vast knowledge on all this. Would you mind educating me without using esoteric terms as to what this is, what it is for, why one would need it, and what it looks like?
In holding my feet to the fire, this prompted me to put my money where my mouth is.
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The more I learn about the FCC's General Mobile Radio Service (GMRS), the more I am fascinated by RF in general. It touches everyone's lives every second of every day, yet few people pay much attention. How cool is it that after 42 years and 14 billion miles away, the 22-Watt radio on Voyager 1 is still sending data back to earth every day (how important is that antenna?). So why aren't more people interested in GMRS or RF in general? There's no test to get a license like amateur (ham) radio. It's $70 for a 10-year license, and is really easy to get started. So here are some theories.
People don't know:
- GMRS exists
- Why GMRS exists
- Why they'd want to use GMRS
- How to envision themselves participating in GMRS
- What it takes to get started with GMRS
- What it takes to continue and improve with GMRS
- Technical information they should know about GMRS
- Etiquette when transmitting (TX) on GMRS
- What a GMRS "Net" is and why
Most people within the GMRS community are helpful once you're in, but the community is very inviting in a go-figure-it-out-yourself way, and no one has assembled everything you need to know about GMRS all in one place.
We GMRS people are putting the onus on outsiders to sift through thousands of painfully esoteric webpages with a winnowing fork, separating useful info from useless, poorly written, or incomplete info.
When I first heard about GMRS on a 4x4 trip, I arrived home and Googled around and settled on a Midland MXT-275 because it seemed perfect for mounting on my truck dashboard. At the time, I had no idea that Midland
doesn't manufacture a GMRS radio capable of operating on split-tone repeaters (Dear Midland, I know you're reading this: why do you squander so much potential?). Edit 6/28/2021: Midland heard our cry! They just updated the MXT-275 to include split-tone programming on repeater channels. So for example, now this radio is able to reach a repeater that receives (RX) incoming transmissions on 467.550 with a PL tone of 103.5 and repeats the transmission (TX) at 462.550 with a PL tone of 88.5.I didn't even know what "split tone" was or even what "tone" meant, or carrier or squelch or hundreds of other little things you all take for granted. Since then, I realized that if the big, bad manufacturers like Midland, Kenwood, Motorola, and iCom can't even invite the public to learn more and provide useful content for each stage of the customer journey—Awareness, Consideration, Purchase, and Loyalty—the 2-way radio industry has much deeper problems and aren't there to help guys like me.
As we get involved deeper into GMRS, there's little-to-no hand-holding going on at each level of knowledge. I ending up relying on the Ham community here and there and a guy who is basically a saint at a little radio shop in Phoenix, Arizona (hope Tim over at Procomm and the others at the nonprofit AZGMRS.org don't mind me giving them a shout-out).
Edit 4/14/2020: By the way, AZGMRS made this awesome list of FCC-approved GMRS radios that they recommend. If you live anywhere near Arizona and are reading this, now would be a great time to become a member. Their repeater network covers some 100 miles around Phoenix with more and more repeaters joining the network (check out their sweet coverage map).
But it's still frustrating.
I wish a GMRS expert—presumably a manufacturer—would just come out and say exactly what a total newbie needs at each stage of their involvement or level of need. Two-way radio manufacturers should stop wasting time trying to sell, and start marketing and branding, which means educating the public about the 5 W's (Who, What, Where, When, Why [+how, +how much]) without trying to sell to them.
Most new users don't know what they need because they don't know what's possible. For example, I wish I knew that manufacturers don't typically include the best antenna on their radios right out of the box. It took me over a year to realize that the best bang for the buck for a portable base antenna to include in my go bag is N9TAX's Slimjim and that Smiley Antenna makes the best bang for the buck antennas for hand-held radios (which by the way, everyone just assumes newbies are supposed to know that hand-held walkie-talkie radios are called "HT" for "Handy-talkie" and what a "QSO" is).
How would a newbie know that the cheap Nagoya 771 "upgrade" antenna for Baofengs that everyone talks about actually isn't the best bang for the buck for the GMRS frequency band of 462–467? How would a newbie know that antennas work best when tuned exactly to what they call a "center" frequency that accommodates 5 Megahertz in each direction (+5 and -5 Megahertz) at the expense of hearing other frequencies?
I learned the hard way that in order to properly install an NMO antenna mount on the roof of my truck, I would need a drill bit specifically made for drilling NMO antenna mount holes, and that yes, it is worth the money to do it right the first time.
I'm still in the middle of learning how a "quarter-wave" or "5/8 wave" antenna works, the difference between dB gain vs. dBi gain, mic gain, antenna gain, because again, everyone seems to just assume I already know what all this means. I still don't understand what antenna "tuning" means and why you have to "cut" an antenna to "tune" it. Can I make my own antenna right now in a pinch with a copper wire in my garage? Ok, show me! How do I measure it or test it? What is SWR? Can I measure it myself? What do I need in order to measure it? Is one SWR meter better than another for my level as a newbie? Is there something I should learn to make it worth buying the better meter that opens up a whole new world of capability? Is it worth learning all that?
This graphic did a great job beginning to explain what dBd gain means for those of us who know next to nothing about it, but now I need to go find out on my own and sift through a thousand webpages to find out if dBd is something new I need to know. Speaking of dB, I know that "dB" is a decibel, but is it the same as my stereo volume? Why do I see manufacturers saying that the microphone and cable have a dB rating? What is going on here? This is madness! We can Google things all day, but which info is true and correct and the most helpful?
I think that the entire industry is sitting on a Gold Mine of consumers sitting at home for weeks on end who would love to buy GMRS equipment and communicate via GMRS to friends, family, neighbors, and other GMRS users. Whoever provides the most useful, relevant, and engaging content that stops making assumptions about what people know or don't know will win.
STOP ASSUMING. START EDUCATING.
- wayoverthere, Jones, kipandlee and 13 others
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For those of us who have absolutely no idea of what you're talking about, would you mind explaining in English what that means and maybe some photos?
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Thank you for all the advice.
Are there antennas particularly good for whipping out / setting up as the need arises?
I'm not looking to permanently affix an antenna to my house.
I'd love the ability to set something up on the fly when and where I need it
I just got this Slim Jim antenna for my go bag, and the clarity it delivers even to a Btech UV-82C is so astonishing, that it could easily be used as a permanent for a decent base radio. I ordered it with the 16' cable so I could tie paracord to it and throw it over a high tree branch. If someone else has a better idea for an on-the-fly antenna, I'm all ears!
- Extreme and Elkhunter521
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Thanks for all the recommendations on different radios, I do appreciate it. I've been kinda wondering which are better than others and which may have some features that mine just isn't capable of. I may eventually replace the radio, but I'm in no rush - for my specific case of wanting something small in the jeep with limited space, I like the idea of the controls on the mic... the lack of "no PL on RX" is an issue, but not too big of an issue just yet. Since I don't [yet] have access to any local repeaters it's not a big issue... hopefully one day I can find some repeaters, then I could see it being an issue, and then may swap out the radio. So I'll take my time and research the radios now, so if/when the time comes I'll have a better idea of what I'm looking for. For a long time I was thinking to move away from CB to GMRS or HAM, but didn't really compare different radios - and didn't know enough about them or the technology. Going with the Midland micromobile was somewhat of a hastly decision I made, but while I am learning more and more of what it's missing, so far I don't entirely regret it.I'll keep an eye on that other thread as well... thanks again to everyone for all the advice!As for my original topic of antenna performance, for now i'm happy with the no-ground plane antenna that I have. Eventually (time-permitting) I'll add another NMO mount to the top of the tire carrier, and will compare the performance and post the results.
Did the research and settled on a Maxon 8402A with help from a friend. I really wish the controls were in the mic like the MXT-275. Being an SEO guy and social sentiment monitor in my profession, I know both Maxon and Midland will be reading this. And to them both, I say: Don't ignore the 1-9-90 rule! Whoever manufactures a 15-, 25-, 40-, or 50-watt GMRS radio with controls in the mic that can run split tones as @mcallahan says, will mow down the rest of the industry.
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Not meant to add to the confusion.
If, for example, your MXT400 is set to 15 rp and connected to the repeater, and the GXT1000 is set to 15 with the same CTCSS as the repeater, they can talk to each other provided they are in simplex range.
What happens is that the MXT400 will transmit on a frequency to the repeater. The repeated signal will come back on 15, which both the MXT400 and GXT1000 can hear.
When transmitting from the GXT1000, it will bypass the repeater and go straight to channel 15, simplex, which the MXT400 can hear on 15 rp.
So, if you are out and about, it is possible to listen to repeater traffic on a simple bubble pack HT like the GXT1000. You would also be able to talk to others within HT range provided you have the same CTCSS/DCS tone.
This overlap can be convenient in some circumstances.
Personally, I have the GXT1000, MXT275, and MXT115. I use the HT to monitor the repeater. If there is repeater traffic, I can go to the kitchen or one of the cars to reply.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Maybe I don't know any better, but I have the MXT275 as well and have to put it in monitor mode every I time I want to hear someone respond to me via the repeater. The offset or whatever it's called is not automatic. I'm so annoyed with Midland. If anyone else starts manufacturing a truly repeater-capable mobile GMRS radio with the controls in the mic like the MXT275, it will beat everyone else since there's no reason to put controls anywhere else for vehicle applications.
Some Unfortunate News RE: CHIRP Integration
in myGMRS.com
Posted
Simple solution: raise the price of advertising to cover whatever costs you incur. The Grateful Dead didn't get rich by nickel-and-diming people with tapes/records/CDs—they sold concert tickets exceeding $300 apiece because their free music became infinitely more ubiquitous than if they restricted it to just record buyers.
The lower the barrier to grow your GMRS community, the higher price you command for advertisers who want a piece of your community. If you make it indispensably valuable to us, we become indispensably valuable to you.