gman1971

Where do you find that explicitly stated in the FCC regs? What specific paragraph?
 
Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM
 
 
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

The 5.5 dB claim is, simply put, not true. (also, if you don't see dBd or dBi its probably fake as well) That TRAM1173 (or MXT26) antenna probably has less gain than a simple 1/4 wave NMO, given the cheap coils used, and being only 2 elements, with insufficient phasing element separation between them (gain in collinear antennas is achieved by increasing the distance between the phased elements) not a chance in he11 it has 5.5 dBd... well, unless decibels dBs overseas are measured differently than in the rest of the world... that is.
 
For comparison, a real world 5.5dBd gain is what a 4-bay folded dipole has, which is a massive antenna, and coincidentally, it costs a lot of $$$$$...  too.
 
IMO, and in my experience, for a car install, a simple 6" inch NMO antenna cut to GMRS frequency will work absolutely great, as measured.
 
G.

Its pointless arguing with this kind of posts, b/c they lack any basis on reality, and they are usually posted by the likes of ... trolls, looking to sow doubt, and stir trouble...
 
But I'll bite...
 
First off, Motorola high end radios are not "Made in China", it seems as if you've never owned one, and it figures... they are "Made in Malaysia."
 
Also, by the same argument of where things are made, and just to pick an example: iPhones are made in China, but so are a lot of other pieces of crap no-brand phones too...  and even though iPhones aren't my thing, I would still pick an iPhone over the no-brand POS phone... if the iPhone was too expensive new, and iPhones where, again, my thing, then I would simply buy a used iPhone... which is still leaps and bounds better than the cheap garbage phone... well, the same thing applies to radios. Most people like to walk around with a fancy S20s, or whatever the latest fancy phone happens to be... but then we purchase these pieces of garbage radios?
 
Using the word "supposed" means its your opinion, and everyone has one. With that said, after measuring many of these radios with an ISO-tee, an industry standard test to diagnose receiver problems, the observed average desense in all those CCR radios was found to be around 15 dBm when compared to high end commercial grade radios, like the XPR5550e... A 15dBm difference is the equivalent of running, roughly, x16 times more power on the transmitter... but it is safe to assume that you have no idea what I am talking about, b/c you just called me a "naysayer" for sharing the results from my ISO-tee tests, and made claims devoid of any basis except for the sake of just discrediting others by sowing doubts. Not sure what to make out of that...
 
If you need moving your HT 6" around chances are you have a piece of garbage. I don't need to move any of my many XPR7550e radios to listen to base, b/c they just receive, they work, all the time... I don't like having my radios cut in and out when I am working either... but I guess that is par for the course with those CCRs... and trust me, I remember well... I still own a lot of them...
 
The legal argument to scare beginners into buying garbage radios, or the "beware of overpaying" for used commercial gear scare tactic, also geared towards scaring beginners into buying garbage radios, both are just misleading at best, won't go into what worst could be... which begs the question, are you getting paid by those companies to advertise their junk here? Using Part 90 radios on GMRS has never been a problem, it isn't a problem and it will never be a problem, b/c there isn't a shred of evidence the FCC has ever fined or taken any action based solely on the Part 90 radios, however, using pieces of garbage Part 15 CCRs, a scanner, with a PTT, actions have been taken, see Rugged Radios FCC letter... Part 90 equipment is certified to a stricter standard than the Part 95 toys you so much claim to be comparable to used commercial gear. Now, If you think you're overpaying, or getting ripped off, then you can always ask around, I did, and others have asked me, people can give you a good estimate on how much something is worth, but there is also the "completed items" option on eBay, which gives you an idea of how much something is going for... etc.
 
Also, based on how much the OP's paid, it seems that he got ripped off for a 199 CCR.So, as you can see, you can get ripped off no matter what, buying new or used, CCR or used commercial gear. I've even seen BF-888s being sold for 199 bucks a unit... 
 
G.
 

I have mentioned it before, but it still surprised me when my wife and I did some testing a few years ago. I have a GP-9 on a 40 ft tower at our ridge farm which is 1240 ASL and I drove my vehicle way down to the nearby Sidie Hollow, which is less than 900 ASL. These are deeply notched valleys (called coulees) in the Driftless Area of Wisconsin. Distance back to the farm was around 3 miles. With a cheap dual band 2 mtr/440 ham antenna retuned for GMRS, we could barely communicate. Switching to the tiny Midland mag mount 6 inch quarter wave, the signals became quite readable and one bar on the Midland MXT400's which we had on each end, running low power. Switching to the Midland mag mount with the "3 db" gain Midland 5/8 wave antenna increased it to another bar. Switching to the "6 db" gain Midland 5/8 over 5/8 wave increased it to another bar. I think we compared power levels from the lowest power setting to medium and that helped as well. I really did not expect to see that much of a difference. Especially when you consider that the gain antennas tend to put more signal closer to the horizon. It may be that the RF was bouncing around the hills and sort of filling in from different directions. I have no way of measuring the difference in db's for each bar. It would be helpful to have a ballpark number.

Given your physical location and your apparent need, general contact with other users and no immediate personal communications needs, you should seriously consider concentrating on ham radio.  There are a universe of options available to you and several are likely to work well.  You might even find there are ham repeaters near you.  Just search online for ham repeater listings.
 
Here is one such list https://www.repeaterbook.com/repeaters/Display_SS.php?state_id=78&loc=%&call=%&use=%

The 5.5 dB claim is, simply put, not true. (also, if you don't see dBd or dBi its probably fake as well) That TRAM1173 (or MXT26) antenna probably has less gain than a simple 1/4 wave NMO, given the cheap coils used, and being only 2 elements, with insufficient phasing element separation between them (gain in collinear antennas is achieved by increasing the distance between the phased elements) not a chance in he11 it has 5.5 dBd... well, unless decibels dBs overseas are measured differently than in the rest of the world... that is.
 
For comparison, a real world 5.5dBd gain is what a 4-bay folded dipole has, which is a massive antenna, and coincidentally, it costs a lot of $$$$$...  too.
 
IMO, and in my experience, for a car install, a simple 6" inch NMO antenna cut to GMRS frequency will work absolutely great, as measured.
 
G.

Yes, absolutely, Michael... hopefully I didn't convey it cannot be done, just the fact that placing two antennas on top of each other is not as simple as just placing one atop the other and letting it rip... 
 
Your comment about how commercial antennas are installed is spot on... but doing things like commercial installations means $$$$ and time...  and then you need a lot of height, a good fiberglass mast, good feedline, using lateral extension to avoid feedline from messing with pattern... etc.
 
I think the OP is better served by a dual band with a diplexer than going through all the hassles of a two antenna installation.
 
Eager to hear about your results in your GMRS installation... what antenna do you have in mind?
 
G.
 

Messaged you about the Kenwood TH-F6a

Nice!! Motorolian motherships...  
 
G.
 

Up for your consideration...
 
Pictures upon request... Prices are all negotiable, you can PM me for programming for the Motorola/Vertex radios.
 
Please, ask if you don't see something listed on the descriptions. If you feel something should've been included, or its missing then PM me, please.
 
Also, radios are listed locally and other internet sites as well, but I'll try my best to keep this list updated.
 
Two options:
->Local pickup, cash only. I live in the Madison, WI area.
->Shipping to CONUS only, PayPal gift.
 
Inventory for sale.
x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, VHF only (136-174)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery, antenna and M charger.  $195 local pickup. $205 shipped.
x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, VHF only (136-174)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery, antenna and VS charger.  $185 local pickup. $195 shipped.
x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, VHF only (136-174)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery, antenna and VS charger.  $185 local pickup. $195 shipped.
 
x1 - Anytone AT-578U/V mobile, tri-band: 140-220-440, DMR/FM (GPS), upgraded with trimetal N connector. Excellent condition. Microphone, GPS antenna, mounting bracket. $350 local pickup, $360 shipped. AES encryption capable.
 
x1 - TYT UV-8000E portable, UV, FM w/crossband repeat. Excellent condition. Same as new items included. Box, charger, cable, antenna, etc. $50 local pickup,  $55 shipped 
 
x1 - Alinco DJ-MD5TGP portable, UV, DMR/FM (GPS), Excellent condition. Comes with everything as new. PLUS a shoulder microphone. $140 local. pickup, $150 shipped. 
 
x1 - Alinco DJ-MD5TGP portable, UV, DMR/FM (GPS), Excellent condition. Comes everything as new PLUS a spare battery and a shoulder microphone. $170 local. pickup, $180 shipped. 
 
SOLD  x1 - Vertex Standard EVX-531 portable, V only, DMR/FM no display. Excellent condition. $80 local pickup, $85 shipped. AES encryption capable
SOLD x1 - Kenwood TH-F6a portable. all band all mode w/SSB receive, 144-220-440 transmit. Mars-cap enabled, in Good condition, missing the PTT paddle and the microphone rubber cover, clean screen. Comes w/antenna and battery.  $150 local pickup, $160 shipped.
SOLD x2 - Radioditty GD77 portable, UV, DMR/FM. $80 local pickup, $85 shipped. Excellent condition. Chargers, UHF Vertex Standard antenna, 1 programming cable.
SOLD x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, UHF only (400-470)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery and antenna only. $130 local pickup. $140 shipped.
SOLD x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, UHF only (450-512)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery and antenna only. $130 local pickup. $140 shipped.
 
G.

That is correct, mbrun... thank you.
 
Not giving up on GMRS.... why would I?  I am selling a lot of my radios b/c I want to consolidate, so all the XPR7550e and SL7550 radios that I've recently acquired... those stay, aka the new Motorolian Imperial Fleet. Also, a lot of the radios I am selling aren't really the lowest of the barrel I own either. For example, the EVX-539 is not a CCR by any stretch of the imagination, but the XPR7550e won the contest, for several reasons other than just better performance. For example, I can't deal with having 10 different codeplugs anymore, nor 10 different CPS, 10 different battery chargers, 10 different prog cables... etc. So everything non Motorola XPR gen2 will have to go at some point or another. I debated whether to keep the XPR6550s Gen1 radios, but I figured I might just sell them as well... maybe these can help others see the light the way they helped me see the light... 
 
Oh, and there is also two more Alinco MD5 DMR/FM radios up for grabs as well. I just forgot to put them on the "yard sale" post...  
 
G.
 

Another option I've found to be a good compromise is to remove the sharkfin/oem antenna on the roof and install the NMO mount there. I've relocated the sharkfin internal components to the spoiler or to the third tail light on my cars. Saves the hole drilling dilemma, its easily reversible and no more scratching paint magmount shenanigans, or any other magmount issues. Works sufficiently well, although its a little less optimal than drilling the hole in the dead center of the roof... but my cars/vans have large panoramic sunroofs so makes it quite impossible to drill holes on a glass roof... so, the only place left is the OEM sharkfin location. UHF is not as bad as VHF, a 6 inch antenna is not even noticeable on a minivan.
 
G.

+1 to mbrun.
 
Also, remember that radio is a SNR game, or a Signal to Noise Ratio game.... sometimes the Signal might still be there, faint, but masked by the overwhelming Noise... much like light pollution under the night skies hides the fainter nebulae, stars, etc... you throw an H-Alpha filter, and all of the sudden the faint wonders of the night appear much clearer...  same with radio.
 
A few feet higher might not make the range noticeable better, but it seems to make the current link quality a bit better... and sometimes every bit counts.
 
Also, remember that not all antennas radiate perfectly towards the horizon, there are nulls on the radiation pattern, both vertical and horizontal... and problems with grounding, problems with feedline, etc... they all introduce nulls on the pattern. So if a subscriber is in one of the antenna nulls will have the same effect as being behind difficult terrain.
 
Wish I lived in a place with no obstructions... with no angry RF firebreathing broadcast 1400 foot towers... 
 
G.

This morning I received an e-mail from Mods.dk about a hacker who gained access to information on their website. I know there are some users of that site here so I figured I would post the announcement here just in case anyone missed the e-mail:
 
I’m very sorry to inform you that a hacker for about 2 days ago have had success to upload  a script to mods.dk, and run the script. Which information the hacker has stolen is not possible to see at the moment, but the most sensitive information that you have placed on mods.dk is your email address, and password that you are using to access mods.dk. If you have made money donation all information about your credit card/payment method, has been handle by PayPal, and this information is never been transferred to mods.dk. Your password is encrypted in the database, so the hacker cannot read your password direct, but the hacker can try to compare the encrypted password with a password they try, and with a computer they can compare many password in a sort time. So I will recommend you to change your password on mods.dk and if you are using the same password other places also change the password there. Use always different password every places. The hacker have upload a picture and then they have execute the picture and it has create a script they could execute. So by an consequence of this, upload of pictures and files is only allowed when you have been approved. I will approved all existing users that already have uploaded pictures and files, but in case you don’t have permission, then just contact mods.dk. I’m sorry for this trouble but I hope you still want to support my site, this site is only a hobby project just like my amateur radio, and my resourced are limited. If you want all your data deleted form mods.dk you can go to “my account” and said that you want to be deleted.  Best regardsErik Hansenhttps://www.mods.dkNote this message in send from a non-monitored mailbox and replies will never been read, so if want in contact then you must go to the homepage. 

About darn time. I didn't believe what I read on another site, but these radios seem to be branded as portable scanners too...  who knew.
 
G.

Up for your consideration...
 
Pictures upon request... Prices are all negotiable, you can PM me for programming for the Motorola/Vertex radios.
 
Please, ask if you don't see something listed on the descriptions. If you feel something should've been included, or its missing then PM me, please.
 
Also, radios are listed locally and other internet sites as well, but I'll try my best to keep this list updated.
 
Two options:
->Local pickup, cash only. I live in the Madison, WI area.
->Shipping to CONUS only, PayPal gift.
 
Inventory for sale.
x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, VHF only (136-174)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery, antenna and M charger.  $195 local pickup. $205 shipped.
x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, VHF only (136-174)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery, antenna and VS charger.  $185 local pickup. $195 shipped.
x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, VHF only (136-174)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery, antenna and VS charger.  $185 local pickup. $195 shipped.
 
x1 - Anytone AT-578U/V mobile, tri-band: 140-220-440, DMR/FM (GPS), upgraded with trimetal N connector. Excellent condition. Microphone, GPS antenna, mounting bracket. $350 local pickup, $360 shipped. AES encryption capable.
 
x1 - TYT UV-8000E portable, UV, FM w/crossband repeat. Excellent condition. Same as new items included. Box, charger, cable, antenna, etc. $50 local pickup,  $55 shipped 
 
x1 - Alinco DJ-MD5TGP portable, UV, DMR/FM (GPS), Excellent condition. Comes with everything as new. PLUS a shoulder microphone. $140 local. pickup, $150 shipped. 
 
x1 - Alinco DJ-MD5TGP portable, UV, DMR/FM (GPS), Excellent condition. Comes everything as new PLUS a spare battery and a shoulder microphone. $170 local. pickup, $180 shipped. 
 
SOLD  x1 - Vertex Standard EVX-531 portable, V only, DMR/FM no display. Excellent condition. $80 local pickup, $85 shipped. AES encryption capable
SOLD x1 - Kenwood TH-F6a portable. all band all mode w/SSB receive, 144-220-440 transmit. Mars-cap enabled, in Good condition, missing the PTT paddle and the microphone rubber cover, clean screen. Comes w/antenna and battery.  $150 local pickup, $160 shipped.
SOLD x2 - Radioditty GD77 portable, UV, DMR/FM. $80 local pickup, $85 shipped. Excellent condition. Chargers, UHF Vertex Standard antenna, 1 programming cable.
SOLD x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, UHF only (400-470)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery and antenna only. $130 local pickup. $140 shipped.
SOLD x1 - Motorola XPR6550 portable, UHF only (450-512)(GPS) Excellent condition. Battery and antenna only. $130 local pickup. $140 shipped.
 
G.

Hope everyone had a good Thanksgiving! Or, if you don't celebrate it, a nice day off at least.

When the radios were physically limited and you had to take them apart and physically remove a blocking diode it was clear that the manufacturer had actually manufactured the radio in compliance.  Compliant firmware is a major shortcut and shortcoming.

Retevis is well known for manufacturing and selling some of the most inexpensive radios around. I have no experience them. I have seen some of there products talked about periodically on some YouTube channels.
 
If considering a product of theirs, perhaps consider an equivalent product from Midland, at least if you purchase it from them there is some chance you will be able to obtain product support should it ever be needed.
 
Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM
 
 
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Yes Happy Thanksgiving to all!!!!!

From the grumpo-gMan1971, the Motosnob...  
 
Anyhow... happy Thanksgiving to all... God Bless and GodSpeed!!
 
g.
 
 

Much better way to put it than the typical gMan1971 this radio sucks...
 
Your last statement is pretty much defines what makes a radio work well. Superhets alone suffer from out of band interference, mainly due to intermodulation caused with the IF stages frequencies... at least without the presence of a decent front end. So, don't let the superhet buzzword get you...
 
G.
 
 

From the grumpo-gMan1971, the Motosnob...  
 
Anyhow... happy Thanksgiving to all... God Bless and GodSpeed!!
 
g.
 
 

Yup you would doing well to wait awhile for two reasons.
 
You don't want to be "Beta Testing" a version 1.0 radio. Let somebody else spend their money and deal with the problems. While that is going on just occasionally do a search for reviews and see how people are liking, or not, the radio before you spend your money.
 
The second is new radio designs typically sell at the top end of the range the model is targeted for. After 6 months to a year once the novelty wears off, competitors come out with similar models, the price will slowly drop. After some time the manufacture may try to drive sales by offing "manufacturer's discounts" on many of the more well know radio equipment vendor sites. Keep checking to see who is offering the best deal, no sale tax and maybe free shipping.
 
With the holiday season arrival you may find those vendors offering holiday specials. Pays to keep looking around.
 
I was given a free Wouxon KG-UVD1P at a local Ham radio swap. It looked new in the box but no charger. Cost me $17 to get one off of eBay. One of the things I do is look for PDF versions of the manuals, FCC grants and a service manual. Turns out this radio really had a service manual complete with a schematic. That proved interesting. If you are familiar with electronics the schematic can tell you a few things the radio spec's likely won't. 
 
In this case the radio was in fact a dual superheterodyne design. First IF was at 29.250MHz using 2 cascaded resonators and the second IF was the usual 455KHz.  However the bandwidth on the filters is not delectable so it will be fine on wide-band FM but too wide on narrow band, at least from the stand point of using closer spaced channels. Manufactures do this to save cost. To get narrow band operation the frequency deviation is reduced from 5KHz to 2.5KHz and the audio gain is doubled on receive.
 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superheterodyne_receiver
 
 
By contrast the commercial radios I have use two sets of filters, one wide band and the other narrow band. One even has a "tracking filter" on the input to pre-filter out any potential interfering signals before they get to the IF stages.  These radios are designed to work in a very severe and crowded RF environment.  You likely won't find this in consumer grade or even Ham Radio grade radios.

Another option I've found to be a good compromise is to remove the sharkfin/oem antenna on the roof and install the NMO mount there. I've relocated the sharkfin internal components to the spoiler or to the third tail light on my cars. Saves the hole drilling dilemma, its easily reversible and no more scratching paint magmount shenanigans, or any other magmount issues. Works sufficiently well, although its a little less optimal than drilling the hole in the dead center of the roof... but my cars/vans have large panoramic sunroofs so makes it quite impossible to drill holes on a glass roof... so, the only place left is the OEM sharkfin location. UHF is not as bad as VHF, a 6 inch antenna is not even noticeable on a minivan.
 
G.