mbrun

Even experienced engineers forget at times test equipment can lie, and very convincingly too. The best test gear you own is your head, use experience and common sense.

To my knowledge, they are the only group lobbying on behalf of amateur radio. Without amateur backing, we could loose the only voice we have Washington and could find ourselves without spectrum for our craft.

They publish a couple of good magazines that are free to members and publish educational books that are useful to us all. In addition, they keep us informed of legislation that affects us.

I have heard opinions that perhaps at times they have not lobbied hard enough and that we have lost spectrum as a result Perhaps that is because there was not enough funding to wage the necessary defense, I do not know.

I find membership an appropriate support of their mission to serve and protect amateur radio. Such efforts are not free.

Just one man’s opinion.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Who will be the national voice for our Service, other than the ARRL? Without their efforts, it's likely we'll lose all our spectrum to commercial interests. As Lscott pointed out, business interests have been sharpening their knives for years, waiting to carve it up.
The cost of an ARRL Membership is cheap, considering what you get in just the magazine alone. Ads? Most pubs carry ads as the primary way to support their efforts. Ads can cover up to 90% or more of magazine revenue. Would you rather pay nine times more for a magazine with no ads?
Suppoting local efforts are vital as well. Do whatever you can from where you are, but recognize the bigger picture. But it's not an either/or choice between supporting local or national efforts that benefit our Service (ask any ARES Member, it's not a "hobby," it's a Service). 
A group of passengers were stranded in a life boat. The lifeboat sprung a leak. Everyone joined in baling the water except for one guy. When asked why he wasn't helping save the boat, he replied, "Why bother? It's not my boat."

Good to know!

The reseting of the codes is typically related to user action. TX CTCSS and DCS codes are mutually exclusive as are RX CTCSS and DCS codes. So, for example, if you set a TX CTCSS code and store it and then go to the TX DCS menu to view its value you will see it is Off already, even if it had previously assigned a value to it. If you hit ‘Menu’ again while viewing the current DCS code you will actually clear the CTCSS code, and vice versa. This is a nuance of every Wouxun radio I have ever used.

Setting a TX code on one, automatically disables the other. RX codes work the same.

Get in the habit of never hitting the menu button again while viewing any CTCSS or DCS code if you do no intend to change the value. Hit the Exit button instead.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

To my knowledge, they are the only group lobbying on behalf of amateur radio. Without amateur backing, we could loose the only voice we have Washington and could find ourselves without spectrum for our craft.

They publish a couple of good magazines that are free to members and publish educational books that are useful to us all. In addition, they keep us informed of legislation that affects us.

I have heard opinions that perhaps at times they have not lobbied hard enough and that we have lost spectrum as a result Perhaps that is because there was not enough funding to wage the necessary defense, I do not know.

I find membership an appropriate support of their mission to serve and protect amateur radio. Such efforts are not free.

Just one man’s opinion.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

To my knowledge, they are the only group lobbying on behalf of amateur radio. Without amateur backing, we could loose the only voice we have Washington and could find ourselves without spectrum for our craft.

They publish a couple of good magazines that are free to members and publish educational books that are useful to us all. In addition, they keep us informed of legislation that affects us.

I have heard opinions that perhaps at times they have not lobbied hard enough and that we have lost spectrum as a result Perhaps that is because there was not enough funding to wage the necessary defense, I do not know.

I find membership an appropriate support of their mission to serve and protect amateur radio. Such efforts are not free.

Just one man’s opinion.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

To my knowledge, they are the only group lobbying on behalf of amateur radio. Without amateur backing, we could loose the only voice we have Washington and could find ourselves without spectrum for our craft.

They publish a couple of good magazines that are free to members and publish educational books that are useful to us all. In addition, they keep us informed of legislation that affects us.

I have heard opinions that perhaps at times they have not lobbied hard enough and that we have lost spectrum as a result Perhaps that is because there was not enough funding to wage the necessary defense, I do not know.

I find membership an appropriate support of their mission to serve and protect amateur radio. Such efforts are not free.

Just one man’s opinion.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

To my knowledge, they are the only group lobbying on behalf of amateur radio. Without amateur backing, we could loose the only voice we have Washington and could find ourselves without spectrum for our craft.

They publish a couple of good magazines that are free to members and publish educational books that are useful to us all. In addition, they keep us informed of legislation that affects us.

I have heard opinions that perhaps at times they have not lobbied hard enough and that we have lost spectrum as a result Perhaps that is because there was not enough funding to wage the necessary defense, I do not know.

I find membership an appropriate support of their mission to serve and protect amateur radio. Such efforts are not free.

Just one man’s opinion.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

To my knowledge, they are the only group lobbying on behalf of amateur radio. Without amateur backing, we could loose the only voice we have Washington and could find ourselves without spectrum for our craft.

They publish a couple of good magazines that are free to members and publish educational books that are useful to us all. In addition, they keep us informed of legislation that affects us.

I have heard opinions that perhaps at times they have not lobbied hard enough and that we have lost spectrum as a result Perhaps that is because there was not enough funding to wage the necessary defense, I do not know.

I find membership an appropriate support of their mission to serve and protect amateur radio. Such efforts are not free.

Just one man’s opinion.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

To my knowledge, they are the only group lobbying on behalf of amateur radio. Without amateur backing, we could loose the only voice we have Washington and could find ourselves without spectrum for our craft.

They publish a couple of good magazines that are free to members and publish educational books that are useful to us all. In addition, they keep us informed of legislation that affects us.

I have heard opinions that perhaps at times they have not lobbied hard enough and that we have lost spectrum as a result Perhaps that is because there was not enough funding to wage the necessary defense, I do not know.

I find membership an appropriate support of their mission to serve and protect amateur radio. Such efforts are not free.

Just one man’s opinion.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

To my knowledge, they are the only group lobbying on behalf of amateur radio. Without amateur backing, we could loose the only voice we have Washington and could find ourselves without spectrum for our craft.

They publish a couple of good magazines that are free to members and publish educational books that are useful to us all. In addition, they keep us informed of legislation that affects us.

I have heard opinions that perhaps at times they have not lobbied hard enough and that we have lost spectrum as a result Perhaps that is because there was not enough funding to wage the necessary defense, I do not know.

I find membership an appropriate support of their mission to serve and protect amateur radio. Such efforts are not free.

Just one man’s opinion.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Okay… here are the numbers.  I will list what the Midland test numbers are and what I got for results.
 
My results –
Max Output:  47.9w @ 462.550 MHz
12 dB SINAD Sensitivity:  -122 dBm / 0.177mv
 
Midland results –
Max Output:  48.3w @ 462.550 MHz
12 dB SINAD Sensitivity:  -124 dBm / 0.141mv
 
Overall, I am very happy.  My numbers are close enough to their numbers that I am questioning the accuracy of my TEK or coupler more than their results… probably needs a calibration since it’s been almost a decade.

@Over2U it sure sounds like you are experiencing differences between the two. I do own the 905 but not the UV3D and do find the 905 to be on par with the other Wouxun models in my possession. Yeh, the vary some but not by a lot. Most break squelch between -124dBm and -118dBm.

@gman1971 I acquired a HP-339A.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Assuming the meter is working correctly, and installed in circuit correctly then there is a problem with your antenna system (feed-line, adapters and antenna). Now begins the process of elimination. You may wish to try your measurements again using the shortest possible cable length and different adapters as you have them available to see if results change.

I am not a fan of cut-by-chart trimming of antennas. When an antenna is known to be long for its intended purpose, I prefer to trim a little and measure, then repeat as necessary so as to sneak up on the target value. Doing so helps you know where you are getting close (because SWR gets better with each snip) but also when you have gone too far (because SWR starts to rise). Be aware that at high frequencies, minute length changes can cause big changes.

It is possible that you may already snipped it too much, but also that you have not snipped it enough. Further, If you are testing using repeater input frequencies (467 MHz range) and the antenna is actually tuned for 462 MHz range, then the 467 numbers will appear higher than the 462 numbers.

Snipping of course should only be done on a basic antenna, or one that is, by design, intended for sniping and/or you have advanced knowledge antenna designs. I don’t own your specific antenna, so I cannot cannot from experience comment if it is designed for cutting or not.

For what is is worth, there no such thing as an SWR of less than 1. The first number is always 1 or greater, and the second number is always 1. Collectively they would appear as follows: 1.5:1, 1:1, 1.15:1, 4.7:1, etc. So .8:1, 0.5:1, 1.25:2 are all examples of invalid SWR values.

Hope there is a little nugget of assistance in there.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

As to legal power, I understand the rules to mean 50 watts (MAX) at the antenna port of the transmitter, as opposed to ERP (Effective Radiated Power/what the radiated signal is).

That said...

No matter what you do, there is going to be loss between the TX/RX and the antenna.  I don't know about 4dB 'in the box' but... 

The average (decent) duplexer has (or should have) 1.5dB or less insertion loss (each respective side, TX and RX), so there goes a 'watts' or so.  If you really like your TX, a circulator in the TX side is nice, but rarely done and, would likely add about, or just under, another dB of loss, so there goes another watt or so. 

It's fair to say that even if your TX is putting out 50W from the PA, by the time you connect to the antenna system, that 50W is going to be 30-40W (if you're lucky). 

That is, again, typical.  I'd add that the losses go both directions so your RX sensitivity just got a little worse as well (but not earth shattering).

This is why antenna system design is a make or break scenario.  The gain of the antenna ideally makes up for some of the line and perhaps even the duplexer loss and, if it has some gain, maybe focuses what energy it does radiate and receives where you want it.

As for tweaking the PA for more power, it doesn't really help, because once again, there is loss on the receiver side too, so upping the power is only going to make your repeater talk where it can't hear the people trying to talk into it.  As noted by another poster, it also risks cooking the PA itself and/or the power supply feeding it.

Now I know in the 'hobby' it isn't practical, but the ultimate goal of a repeater design/system is to be able to have the talk-in balanced with the talk-out for a given user radio and antenna combination.

You really can't do that thinking in watts, which is why the practice (for people who do all of the above) is to work in dB (decibels).  Why? Because losses and gains can be added up and subtracted to find out what you actually are dealing with.  Watts equates to a level of dB as does cable and other losses, antenna gain (or loss) and, the sensitivity of the receiver. 

Indeed, for all the hoopla about tweaking a PA and squeaking out a couple more watts, if you look at power output in dB as apposed to watts, you find even doubling the watts isn't really a whole lot of gain in the bigger picture.

FWIW...

It just got to wondering how many KG-1000G owners are actually familiar with and use the Priority Channel feature on this radio. So this post is for you.

If you a KG-1000G owner, are you aware that you can set a priority channel? Are you aware that, unlike many other radios, even when you are tuned to different channel, and even when both of your receivers are tuned to different channels, that transmissions from your designated priority channel will still come through? Did you realize it will do this when you are not scanning?

It is a very cool and useful feature. Yes, it requires the software to preset the channel, but once the channel has been set you can enable and disable the feature from the radio. It makes it sort of like a poor mans “Three-Watch” (as contrasted with Dual-Watch) radio. Of course, poor is relative.

When the feature is enabled (function menu 23), the radio checks the priority channel in the background every few seconds. If a transmission is detected, the priority channel breaks through, no matter what channel(s) you may currently be tuned to.

Admittedly it has some weaknesses. Recently I submitted recommendations for improvement to make it more useful and convenient to set up.

Since this a tips and tricks thread, I thought I would pass this on.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

@KG5UV , I agree with Sshannon. Amateur Radio and GMRS are separate services. Each service requires its own license. While clubs can be issued callsigns by the FCC in the amateur service, new GMRS license can only be issued to an individual. There is nothing to say that the club cannot purchase and put up the repeater, but it would need to be operated under the authority of one individual’s licensee. That could be the club’s trustee or another board member; perhaps another member that has full access to the repeater site. If at any point the GMRS licensee dies or decides they no longer want the liability, another person would need to step up, volunteer their callsign, and assume the liability. Callsigns are not transferrable.

BTW, LCARA has a series of YouTube videos regarding putting up a GMRS repeater at their club tower site. Perhaps you could reach out to them to see how they have decided to handle it.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

@KG5UV , I agree with Sshannon. Amateur Radio and GMRS are separate services. Each service requires its own license. While clubs can be issued callsigns by the FCC in the amateur service, new GMRS license can only be issued to an individual. There is nothing to say that the club cannot purchase and put up the repeater, but it would need to be operated under the authority of one individual’s licensee. That could be the club’s trustee or another board member; perhaps another member that has full access to the repeater site. If at any point the GMRS licensee dies or decides they no longer want the liability, another person would need to step up, volunteer their callsign, and assume the liability. Callsigns are not transferrable.

BTW, LCARA has a series of YouTube videos regarding putting up a GMRS repeater at their club tower site. Perhaps you could reach out to them to see how they have decided to handle it.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

@KG5UV , I agree with Sshannon. Amateur Radio and GMRS are separate services. Each service requires its own license. While clubs can be issued callsigns by the FCC in the amateur service, new GMRS license can only be issued to an individual. There is nothing to say that the club cannot purchase and put up the repeater, but it would need to be operated under the authority of one individual’s licensee. That could be the club’s trustee or another board member; perhaps another member that has full access to the repeater site. If at any point the GMRS licensee dies or decides they no longer want the liability, another person would need to step up, volunteer their callsign, and assume the liability. Callsigns are not transferrable.

BTW, LCARA has a series of YouTube videos regarding putting up a GMRS repeater at their club tower site. Perhaps you could reach out to them to see how they have decided to handle it.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

A GMRS repeater may only be operated under a GMRS license.  A ham club certainly could collocate a GMRS repeater at their repeater site, but it would have to have a GMRS call sign reflecting its operator’s GMRS license.

Agreed. However, I don’t view it as a downside at all. The light’s presence and behavior means I need to use the monitor button far less frequently which improves the overall user experience. If checking the monitor function every single time I wanted to Tx, it would incredibly annoying.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

So, one of the things to look for in a radio, is one that has a LED/Light that illuminates when the frequency is being used, regardless of whether the party transmitting is using a squelch code and regardless if your radio requires a code to un-squelch.

Of all the radios I own, only the cheap Midland radios do not have the frequency-in-use light. That light prevents the need to manually open squelch to check to see if the frequency is in use. The light tells you it is busy.

Good job Marc.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

So, one of the things to look for in a radio, is one that has a LED/Light that illuminates when the frequency is being used, regardless of whether the party transmitting is using a squelch code and regardless if your radio requires a code to un-squelch.

Of all the radios I own, only the cheap Midland radios do not have the frequency-in-use light. That light prevents the need to manually open squelch to check to see if the frequency is in use. The light tells you it is busy.

Good job Marc.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Hey folks.  I have had a small group of people ask me about tones and GMRS/FRS basics in the past week.  I figured I would take one of the conversations here and share it for people new to the service.  Hopefully it will help you understand Private Lines, Privacy Tones, sub-channels, tones and squelching methods, in general.  I am only covering the two most popular in GMRS and FRS, but there are many others available as you move into different radio services and technology. 
 
Before we get into what all that stuff is, lets talk about why it exists.  Per NOAA and the US Census Bureau, the lower 48 states is approximately 3.1 million square miles.  Also, 83% of Americans live on 10% of the total available square miles and 40% of all US citizens live on the east and west coast in counties touching oceans.
 
Following this logic, about 500,000+ licensed and unlicensed operators (estimated by me) are sharing FRS and GMRS radio space, in roughly 310,000 square miles.  So, how does 500,000 people in close proximity, sharing 22 channels, all use their radios at the same time without interfering with each other?  Motorola brings you PL tones!
 
Lets get this out of the way...  regardless of what the manufacturers may tell you or how they label their products, there is no privacy.  Period.  Private Lines (PL), Privacy Tones, Sub-channels and any other name for the same service, does not stop people from hearing you, it stops you from hearing them.  I know... seems like a day in Opposite World, but that's how it works. 
 
I suppose the first thing to do is explain what the PL tones really are, what the more common types are and what each of them do.  A traditional squelch is a signal level squelch.  Meaning, no audio will come out of the speaker until a strong enough signal is received.  Then there are also user squelch types.  With analog radios, the most common type of user squelch uses encoding called Continuous Tone-Coded Squelch System or CTCSS.  This feature is defined as being used to reduce the annoyance of listening to other users on a shared two-way radio channel.  So, as mentioned above, its not that you as a person speaking have any type of privacy, but rather you don't have to listen to everyone on the same frequency.  Hopefully the third time is a charm.
 
Many GMRS and FRS radios only have simple CTCSS functions called Tone Squelch, often displayed as TSQL on the screen when enabled.  This means two things.  One is, regardless of what you do with your squelch knob or set your RF squelch to, no audio will come out of the speaker unless the tone you selected is embedded in the signal you are receiving.  The other thing it does is, when you transmit, what ever tone frequency you have programed gets transmitted with/in your signal to unlock or open the squelch of other radios configured the same way.
 
There is another method of CTCSS called "split tone".  This means that you can use one tone when you transmit and another for your receive.  This comes in handy when repeater owners are trying to limit who can access the repeater, as higher cost radios typically have split tone capability, compared to poorly built and inexpensive radios that would be problematic on a repeater do not.  Also, this makes it a bit more difficult to "discover" the input tone by using scanning tools.
 
Another function of split tone CTCSS is that you can also set your radio to transmit a tone to unlock a repeater or other radio, but leave your receive tone set to null (nothing).  When this mode is enabled, there is typically a display on the radio that either reads TN or TONE.  That means you can bring up a repeater or unlock a radio squelch, but also hear everyone else regardless of what tones they are running, if any at all.  This is actually a great feature for GMRS radios since Repeater Channels share FRS frequencies and GMRS simplex frequencies.  So you can tell if the frequency is in use as well as being able to talk to others who many not be using the repeater.
 
CTCSS is an analog squelching system.  There is also a digital squelching system called Digital-Code Squelch or DCS.  It has similar use cases as CTCSS, but it is sending digitally embedded numeric codes instead of a sub-audible tone.
 
I apologize in advance, but this next portion may get a little confusing.  If you have questions, just ask and myself or one of the other knowledgeable members will be able to help.  All of the numbers below are simply random samples I selected for example.  Last I checked, there are 38 standard tones and an additional 13 expanded tones (not available on every radio) for a total possible 51 tones and 83 DCS codes.
 
Along with the use examples above, you can get creative with DCS, because we are dealing with binary numbers instead of a tone.  You can have the numbers used in a bunch of different combinations.  For example, the number 411 in binary is 00110100 00110001 00110001.  The reverse of this would be 11001011 11001011 11001110.  So we are swapping the meaning of a 1 and a 0.  So the combinations could be as follows:
Normal-Normal = Transmit sends 411 and your radio squelch only opens when it receives 411 in the standard format 00110100 00110001 00110001.
Reverse-Reverse = Transmit sends 411 reversed (or bit swapped) and your radio squelch only opens when it receives 411 reversed, meaning 11001011 11001011 11001110.
Normal-Reverse = Transmit sends 411 standard binary format and your radio squelch only opens when it receives 411 in a reversed binary format.
Reverse-Normal = Transmit sends 411 in a reversed binary format and your radio squelch only opens when it receives 411 in a standard format.
Unfortunately, I am unaware of any radio's that have a DCS option to leave your user squelch open while transmitting a DCS code.  If DCS is enabled, you cannot hear anyone else unless they are using the same DCS number and binary combination.
 
CTCSS tones can also be "reversed".  CTCSS tones, since its analog, we have a phase reversal, often called "reverse burst" when it is only reversed at the end of the transmission.  (Something to Google in your spare time.)
 
On some high-end radios, squelching can get really exotic.  You may be able to create your own custom tone instead of using one of the standard tones.  You may also be able to combine CTCSS tones and DCS codes.  For example:
User-CTCSS = Transmit 2600Hz tone, squelch opens with 2600Hz tone. (random number example)
T-DCS = Transmit 141.3 tone, squelch opens with 411 code.
DCS-T = Transmit 411 code, squelch opens with 141.3 tone.
T-rDCS = Transmit 141.3 tone, squelch opens with 411 bit swapped code.
rDCS-T = Transmit 411 bit swapped code, squelch opens with 141.3 tone.
 
Now, here is the kind of disappointing part.  Some manufactures try to make their equipment sound like something its not.  They will use things like there own custom number code to identify a traditional CTCSS code.  For example, Midland uses code number 22 (also known as a sub-channel) to indicate the tone 141.3.  This makes coordination on tone selection a bit cumbersome between some brands.  It also means that if your radio doesn't display the actual CTCSS tone or DCS code, you need to keep your owner's manual handy for reference. 
 
So... I don't know if that explanation made things better or worse.  LOL  Anyway, some companies use verbiage like "Privacy Tones" which adds to the confusion for some people.  If you are using a true full CTCSS, it just means you are limited to whom you can hear, but everyone can still hear you.
 
The examples I provided above for DCS are not what actually gets transmitted, but rather a conceptual process to help understand at a very basic level of what occurs, simply to understand the difference.  DCS adds a 134.4 bps bitstream to the transmitted audio. To move past concept to the weeds, this video does a great job.