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Morse Code Identifiers


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#1 Citizen

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Posted 11 October 2020 - 04:11 PM

Is there any way to ask repeater owners to slow down the Morse code identifiers that repeaters send out?

 

I've tried and tried to listen for the codes, but they're all too fast for me to write down and decode.  Code sent too fast for me to read and write down is basically useless, unless you have an 'audiographic' memory (made up word, sort of like photographic, but applies to sound rather than vision).  I'm just not that gifted.

 

I suppose, that the identifiers are not meant to be read by humans.  Maybe there are computers hooked up that can read them, I dunno....  Or maybe it's just an FCC requirement, and no one really cares what the code is being sent, just that it IS being sent.  Maybe someone can better explain all this to me.

 

Thanks!

 

...



#2 AdmiralCochrane

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Posted 11 October 2020 - 05:00 PM

Just FCC requirement.  There are many old hams and ex military that can read it that fast.   Its also legal for you to use prerecorded/digital Morse Code as your station ID.



#3 nzw99

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Posted 11 October 2020 - 05:31 PM

I have also had some trouble catching the Morse code identifiers that are used. i did find a couple Morse code decoders that i got from the app store on my phone. They are not exactly accurate but tend to catch better then me trying to wright it down. there is a official standard for Morse code speed but i have found that its often sent out much faster or maybe it does not apply for this use. the real trick is to have your phone open and ready to catch the broadcast.


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#4 n4gix

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Posted 12 October 2020 - 04:02 PM

Speaking of morse code, when my late father went to take his General Class ham exam, he utterly failed 13 word per minute (WPM) required. This by the way after having informed the FCC examiner that he'd spent his naval enlistment prior to and during WWII as a radio operator.

 

The examiner asked him "How the hell did you fail to get clear copy?" My dad replied, "your machine is sending far too slow for me to copy. I don't hear letters, I hear words. Can you turn up the speed?" The examiner replied that their machine could only send a maximum of about 40 WPM. "I'm not really supposed to do this, but since you had to drive from Ft. Myers down here to the Miami Field Office to take the test, I am going to make an exception.

 

My dad smiled and replied "Thank you very much. That's still only about half my usual speed, but I can probably copy that well enough to pass. Fortunately for my dad's already bruised ego, he passed with 100% clear copy.


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#5 kb2ztx

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Posted 13 October 2020 - 06:08 AM

Most repeaters are hard coded for speed. Only option is what the ID is going to be and on or off. 



#6 Citizen

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Posted 13 October 2020 - 05:38 PM

Most repeaters are hard coded for speed. Only option is what the ID is going to be and on or off. 

 

All good information, thanks to everyone that replied. 

 

That said, so then how is one to figure out what the identifiers are (for those of us who don't have tools to decode for us)?

 

...



#7 AdmiralCochrane

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Posted 13 October 2020 - 06:56 PM

If you have a cell phone, you have a decoder



#8 n4gix

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Posted 14 October 2020 - 10:08 PM

...with the right App of course.

 

On the other hand, it will be the call sign of the owner!  ;)


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#9 Jones

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Posted 17 October 2020 - 10:02 AM

The standard Morse speed for commercial (Part-90) repeater controllers is 25 WPM. The maximum speed for amateur radio repeaters is 20 WPM, but amateur stations using commercial repeaters often use the 25 WPM setting, and I don't think anyone has ever been cited for it. The older Bridgecom repeaters can be set for 10, 20, or 25 WPM. I'm not sure about the newer Bridgecoms, but I would assume they are similar.

 

I have heard faster Morse sent on some machines. There are some that I can't copy, and I can copy 20 WPM by ear. I had to record one ID, and open it up in audio editing software so I could slow it down to the point of readability.  I calculated it at 60 WPM.  It was as ID that would play every time a phone patch was dropped.  I knew there weren't supposed to be phone patches on GMRS, but when I ran the ID, it turned out that it is an old business licensed repeater on a GMRS frequency pair that has been grandfathered in.  That brings up a topic for another thread: Even though grandfathered, it is still a GMRS license, not Part-90... so should they be allowed to use a phone patch?


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#10 berkinet

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Posted 17 October 2020 - 01:22 PM

... so should they be allowed to use a phone patch?

Or, in an age of cheap mobile phones with unlimited calling plans, why would anybody even want a phone patch? (sure, for some isolated corner of the northern plains where even the buffalos don’t want to roam anymore.)

Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth.

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#11 Radioguy7268

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Posted 18 October 2020 - 04:53 AM

I've sold at least 3 phone patch enabled repeaters within the past 4 years, and I'm 30 minutes away from Route 95 in the busy Northeast Metro corridor.

 

In-building coverage is usually the issue, as well as the cost to equip 5-10 people with 'casual' but important phone service that might require less than 4 or 5 calls in a month. Compare the ongoing cost of 10 phones at a bare-bones $35 per month + a BDA system to provide in-building coverage, and suddenly 10-15k for a simple phone patch repeater makes all the sense in the world.



#12 berkinet

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Posted 18 October 2020 - 05:09 AM

... Compare the ongoing cost of 10 phones at a bare-bones $35 per month + a BDA system to provide in-building coverage, ....

Well, clearly there is a market. But, I still find it hard to understand. In-building there are other solutions using DECT, Wi-Fi,etc. And, for mobile applications, $8 to $15 per month voice+text only. https://www.mymoneyb...10-a-month.html Or, just subsidize the employee’s existing phone.

Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth.

-- Marcus Aurelius


#13 JB007Rules

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Posted 23 October 2020 - 03:35 PM

I left my CW ID on my repeater as the default which is as follows sending out my call sign:

 

TX Interval Time [min]:  15 (Per FCC)

TX Delay time [s]:  5.0

CW Speed [word/min]:  20

CW Mod. Delay Time [ms]:  600

Audio Frequency [Hz]:  800

 

I will say this:  I could certainly slow it down but on the surface 20 words/min doesn't seem unreasonable but I of course cannot read Morse code for beans even if it was set to 1 word/minute LOL.  It would slow down the ID'ing portion when the repeater does spit it out which might aggravate most of the people that want to just use the repeater and don't care about Morse code decoding.

 

Thanks!






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