Wouxun-KG-905G-Programming-Software

[TonyAldo]

If you right click on the software and run as admin, then you can change your com port. I believe this is a permissions issue.

[mbrun]

Curious how you set up a calling function—that's something I'm particularly interested in. I know this is not FRS and we are serious radio operators here (), but that would be incredibly useful to me, absent the usual 'call' button bubble-pack radios usually sport. In my usage, there is a member or two of my calling party that will turn the volume down inadvertently or stuff the HT in a bag, and being able to hail them short of screaming over the air or kerchunking with the roger beep on would be very useful.
All I've been able to do so far is set off the SOS alarm on the 905 by some combination of random DTMF presses whose sequence escapes me.
 
 

Good Day Ian.

I have not been able to get any form of useful calling function operational on the KG-905G radio. While I have no current use for it, I do not like a product with menus and apparent functions that do nothing, or at least nothing useful. There seems to be a lot of that going around.

The radio does have a ‘Call’ function that can be assigned to the PF1L and PF2S buttons. In the software there is a place to enter up to twenty (20) discrete 6-digit DTMF calling codes. If you enter a number into one of these twenty slots, and if that slot ID (calling code ID) happens to be assigned to the channel you are using, then pressing the corresponding PF button will cause the radio to transmit the DTMF code you entered. While this is all well and good, I have not yet found a way to get the receiving radio to do anything with that code other than reproduce its audio in the same way every other radio does.

The ability to assign a calling code in the field does not seem to exist either. It appears that one has to program the code in from the software, which will not be useful in the GMRS world. My view of calling codes is that they need to be field assignable to support the needs of ever changing group outings.

There are also menu options in the software for tailoring ring behavior, presumably companion settings for the calling feature functionality. I have tried different combinations in radios none of which has yielded any fruit. Maybe you will have better luck than I guessing.

I think what has happened is that when the radio firmware was adapted from the radio is was based on, a lot of balls got dropped and the radio got developed only to about 60% completion. I sure would like to see a firmware upgrade for this radio because there is stuff I like about it.

My previous comments regard the decoding where based on the inability of all my 905G to accurate decode DTMF signals from other radios, and the inability of the radio to accurately decode the PTT-ID/ANI-ID of even another 905G. Wouxun has also failed us by not suppling the ability to set the ID directly into the radio as is the case in many other of their models.

Wouxun keeps including (theoretically) the ability to use DTMF codes as an alternative to CTCSS and DCS. Not sure anyone in the U.S. does this or will ever do this, and I have yet to test it to see if it even works. I suspect not. If it does, I imagine one would have to use the Calling Code slots present in the software and then assign them to the channels before flashing the radio.

Enough for now. No good news on the calling front, but perhaps some useful insight for you.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

[mbrun]

Do the TX'ing radios allow changing the timing parameters for encoding the DTMF tones? I know on the commercial Kenwoods I have there are timing parameters I can tweak. Maybe your radio needs longer duration tones and slower sending rate to give it more time to decode.

I did explore this, and yes indeed the Tx time per digit and interval between digits can be changed. I made a variety of changes and still experienced unreliable decoding whereas my other radios were always rock solid regardless of which of the few combinations I tried.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

[Lscott]

2 hours ago, mbrun said:

I did explore this, and yes indeed the Tx time per digit and interval between digits can be changed. I made a variety of changes and still experienced unreliable decoding whereas my other radios were always rock solid regardless of which of the few combinations I tried.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

It was worth a shot if it fixed it. Perhaps a firmware update at some point might do the trick.

[Lscott]

2 hours ago, mbrun said:

I did explore this, and yes indeed the Tx time per digit and interval between digits can be changed. I made a variety of changes and still experienced unreliable decoding whereas my other radios were always rock solid regardless of which of the few combinations I tried.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Oh, I hope you tried changing the timing parameters on the other radio(s) not on the 905G.

[mbrun]

Oh, I hope you tried changing the timing parameters on the other radio(s) not on the 905G.

As the settings affect the transmit characteristics, I adjusted them in the 905G used for Tx and observed the results on two other 905G as well as two other models of radio.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

[Lscott]

6 hours ago, mbrun said:

As the settings affect the transmit characteristics, I adjusted them in the 905G used for Tx and observed the results on two other 905G as well as two other models of radio.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Ok. Just wanted to be sure.

[IanM]

Michael, thanks for the detailed reply. I think I misunderstood your original post as when you said you understood the purpose of group calling that you had accomplished it somehow. (as an aside, I feel similarly about devices with functions I haven't figured out or found a purpose for—I have to figure it out and it feels like a waste of capacity if I can't use it) 

It looks like we've done the same experiments (on my end with the 905 and 935) and come to similar dead ends. The 905 seems to want to decode something; but sometimes that something is dialing '1' and getting back '111111'. Playing with a few custom channels programmed with DTMF squelch and PTT-ID haven't worked at all. The closest I've gotten, I think I mentioned, is programming each with PTT ID and getting them to start screaming the siren. Not quite the call tone I was looking for. 

I think you're right, there's some functionality that's been lost in the firmware. The programming software for the parent models (KG-978, UV8H) looks mostly identical save for fewer button options, so I'm wondering if they do work satisfactorily on the LMR/amateur models. It is strange though that in BTWR's own authored manuals, they mention the function in passing without really describing how to implement it. My guess is that they came that way from the factory and know it's not functional (and most users won't bother), but didn't want to have some mystery setting go unmentioned in the manual.

I'd be interested to know what Wouxun really means by 'calling' specifically, and am guessing some sort of paging, unlike the private calling function on DMR. Though I could see how one could setup a 'dispatch channel' set to DTMF squelch, where individual stations could be called from a console. But again, that's much more of a business band feature than of much use on our few channels! 

And now I'm running a bit long, but thanks again for sharing your experience with it!

[IanM]

An update, that I think you'd appreciate @mbrun—

I found the 935 useful and additionally ordered a UV8H for amateur use. These both seem far better at decoding DTMF than the 905 does, even at the default very short tones. And after unlocking the 8H to GMRS frequencies (legality dubious but it is for the sake of experimentation) I got it to work. Sounds like an old cordless phone ring. 

Here's the trick. First, you must assign each unit a unique 3+ digit PTT-ID. Setting them the same won't work, since they appear to ignore calls from the same ID as itself.

Second, you need to set the SP-Mute mode to 'SQ+DTMF' or 'SQ*DTMF'. Nominally it appears the former isn't supposed to open squelch until after it receives a page. Won't hear anything until it rings, then normal conversation can occur. It times out after a while, I think when the backlight turns off or goes to standby.  Alternately 'SQ*DTMF' will open squelch with tones as usual, but will ring when it hears the right DTMF sequence.

Third, you need to set up a sequence in one of the call slots. Either only the PTT-ID of the individual unit you want to call, "*#" for any handset on the channel, or [single digit] + "*#" for any unit whose PTT ID begins with that digit. (i.e., '1' would ring 101, 102, etc but not 201)

I guess the sequence it's looking for is the calling set's ID number, followed by #, or really any DTMF sequence, be it from PTT-ANI, typed manually, or the call key. That's what's displayed onscreen as 'Caller ID.'

Following that, if it hears its own ID, or any of the above strings match, it rings.  Just typing the receiver's ID, or just the '*#' sequence wont work, it has to be preceded with the caller's number and '#', which PTT-ANI and the call key both do automatically.

After receiving a page, pressing the PTT will respond with a sequence to call back the original caller. 

So essentially, say you have two units, 101 and 102. 101 initiates a call—this could be a preprogrammed call key for '102,', or typed in as '101 # 102', or '101 # * #,' etc. 102 rings until it times out or 101 unkeys, and then conversation can occur. Say some time passes before 102 can return the call, and 101 goes to standby. When 102 keys up again, it'll send a call tone back to 101, and it will ring. Ad infinitum.

This is a potentially useful tool for working with group of several users sharing the same channel. Unfortunately, it still doesn't seem to do anything on the 905 but display garbled decoding and set off the alarm, and I haven't tried yet with the 805, which doesn't have a call button option. More experimenting is in order!

 

[mbrun]

Thanks @IanM .

I am glad you have managed to get some resemblance of useful DTMF functionality working. I will do some additional experimentation to experience the behavior first hand. I appreciate the detailed steps.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

[MichaelLAX]

7 hours ago, IanM said:

... And after unlocking the 8H to GMRS frequencies (legality dubious but it is for the sake of experimentation) ...

 

 

 

But immensely valuable (with no legal "dubiosity") during an emergency! 

Are you the "IanM" that posts reviews on Amazon?

[pcradio]

9 hours ago, IanM said:

... ordered a KG-UV8H for amateur use. These both seem far better at decoding DTMF than the 905 does, even at the default very short tones. And after unlocking the 8H to GMRS frequencies

Please share how you did the mars mode/unlock frequencies for this unit. Thank you.

[IanM]

2 hours ago, MichaelLAX said:

But immensely valuable (with no legal "dubiosity") during an emergency! 

Are you the "IanM" that posts reviews on Amazon?

Shhh....definitely don't tell the guy I hear on a local repeater talking about his Motorola GMRS rig. Definitely an emergency.

Who, Me? I may have reviewed something on Amazon recently. But you may be confusing me with someone else. There's many of us out there. 

[IanM]

36 minutes ago, pcradio said:

Please share how you did the mars mode/unlock frequencies for this unit. Thank you.

Quite simple. I mentioned in another thread that there is a UV8H driver for CHIRP under development, found in their repository. You must install it in your CHIRP driver folder, or enable developer functions and load it under File > Load Module. 

Like most of the Wouxun drivers on CHIRP, the frequency limits for each band are editable. The hardware is capable of a wide range, but are sold locked down to the amateur bands for dealers for compliance in their respective countries. It seems this feature was requested as obviously some people travel/move to other countries, or purchase from an international dealer. I did read one report somewhere that a user purchased a radio direct from Wouxun and it came (very slowly, mind you) completely unlocked.

There are also a few 'dealer mode' applications floating around out there for the UV8D and UV9D, but they do not appear to work on the UV8H or 935G. 

But a nice trick for loading memory channels is using the same driver on the 935, and a similar trick for the 805G with the 816 driver. Doesn't seem to work for the 905G, as its parent model doesn't appear to be exported.

[DownEastNC]

On 5/21/2021 at 3:41 PM, MozartMan said:

Another option is to disable all COM ports in the BIOS of your computer motherboard. This way, when you plug in your programming cable, you will have only one COM port to choose from. This was my case.

And disabling all COM ports in the BIOS should not be a problem because I don't think you can find computer peripherals in this age of technology that use serial ports.

Never say never As a systems integrator I run into serial devices on the factory floor on a regular basis. Weigh scales, label printers, PLC's and so on. It's mostly customers that are trying to milk every last bit from that "old technology" before converting over to IP devices and having to re-code the system. Yeah, I know I'm the Lone Ranger, but just making a point that that stuff is still running in someone else's world. You would flip out if you saw the number of virtual com ports I have on my notebook.

[MozartMan]

20 hours ago, DownEastNC said:

Never say never As a systems integrator I run into serial devices on the factory floor on a regular basis. Weigh scales, label printers, PLC's and so on. It's mostly customers that are trying to milk every last bit from that "old technology" before converting over to IP devices and having to re-code the system. Yeah, I know I'm the Lone Ranger, but just making a point that that stuff is still running in someone else's world. You would flip out if you saw the number of virtual com ports I have on my notebook.

I hear you. 

[IanM]

On 10/13/2021 at 3:37 AM, mbrun said:

Thanks @IanM .

I am glad you have managed to get some resemblance of useful DTMF functionality working. I will do some additional experimentation to experience the behavior first hand. I appreciate the detailed steps.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Michael, I did find out this works with the 905 as well. Again, the trick is to change the muting to QT+DTMF or QT*DTMF, and works akin to SelCall. May have said it before but I think a few (much older) VS and Kenwood analog LMR units support DTMF paging/calling but I don't know if it's compatible (Moto is a different beast with MDC and Quik-Call). The downside with the 905 of course is that the actual string to be assigned to the call button is programmed in software on a per-channel basis.

Still experimenting with the 805. It doesn't appear to have an option to send a call other than the emergency alert, and DTMF muting is a system-wide option rather than per-channel. No luck on being able to page it yet. 

I don't think any of us are operating a GMRS system with enough radios to warrant a full-fledged selective calling system plan, but again, it's useful just for sending an alert tone between multiple parties, since there doesn't appear to be any way to set an 'incoming call' alert. I suppose you could turn on BOT Roger Beep but you'll irritate anyone else using a repeater if you don't remember to turn it off.

[mbrun]

Michael, I did find out this works with the 905 as well. Again, the trick is to change the muting to QT+DTMF or QT*DTMF, and works akin to SelCall. May have said it before but I think a few (much older) VS and Kenwood analog LMR units support DTMF paging/calling but I don't know if it's compatible (Moto is a different beast with MDC and Quik-Call). The downside with the 905 of course is that the actual string to be assigned to the call button is programmed in software on a per-channel basis.
Still experimenting with the 805. It doesn't appear to have an option to send a call other than the emergency alert, and DTMF muting is a system-wide option rather than per-channel. No luck on being able to page it yet. 
I don't think any of us are operating a GMRS system with enough radios to warrant a full-fledged selective calling system plan, but again, it's useful just for sending an alert tone between multiple parties, since there doesn't appear to be any way to set an 'incoming call' alert. I suppose you could turn on BOT Roger Beep but you'll irritate anyone else using a repeater if you don't remember to turn it off.

Hello Ian,

Thanks for the continued tips. I set out to try this myself but was met with two separate and distinct viruses present inside the latest version of the Wouxun software I downloaded so I have no way to experiment until that issue is resolved. The virus details have been submitted to BTWR. Latest version of Norton immediately uninstalls the app and reports the issues upon an attempt to install.

I agree that the feature is likely of little practical use for the masses, but as a supposed feature of the radio my objective really is about ‘does it work at all’, ‘how does it work’ and ‘what practical use for it is for the typical GMRS user?’ But I can immediately see benefits in a commercial fleet environment.

Honestly, I rarely hear DTMF on the local GMRS repeaters, and when I do I surmise it is mostly the repeater owner remotely changing settings, based on conversations heard bounding the commands. I theorize there would be a lot of local pushback if suddenly the typical user had DTMF commands as part of their everyday transmissions.

All of the Wouxun radios I have usability quirks that frustrate me, including the 905. In some cases it is the absence of the ability to configure something via the radio controls vs software that makes the radio feel 1/2 finished.

I will admit one feature I would have liked to see work is the remote monitor/inspect. Of course this requires working DTMF. When I am doing simplex range testing I thought that could be a novel feature to leverage when doing some solo range testing.

Regards,


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

[MichaelLAX]

27 minutes ago, mbrun said:

Hello Ian,

Thanks for the continued tips. I set out to try this myself but was met with two separate and distinct viruses present inside the latest version of the Wouxun software I downloaded so I have no way to experiment until that issue is resolved...

Unzip the attached file and see if your Norton passes it as OK!  It works for me in Windows XP; Version 3.02:

KG905G.zip

 

[IanM]

@mbrun I hear ya on all counts, especially re: 'if it has a feature, I need to figure it out.' It's why I've had a bit of an interest in the amateur use of DMR long before I got licensed. 

For sure, I wouldn't use DTMF over a repeater. Easy way to quickly irritate others, or inadvertently mess things up, since you are correct, they're often used for remote command. If I did implement this it would be over a PL-coded simplex channel. 

 

Ditto on the quirks, and it is frustrating, especially with the 905—I understand it is based on a single-band LMR model, but you're right, it's like they really only got halfway through re-writing the firmware for a user-configurable GMRS radio. My biggest frustration is the menu list seems to go backwards, and there's so much wasted screen real estate. I got the 805 specifically for a family member to use, who wanted something lightweight with few buttons to deal with. But the strange quirk there is the keypad lock also locks the channel knob, which sort of negates its use as a 'hand-over-and-go' radio. The tradeoff is that the audio and reception is very, very good, and while I looked at used business radios from VS and Motorola, wasn't finding anything at that price point that wasn't trashed or needed $100 in batteries and chargers. 

 

Good luck on trying Remote Monitor. It's a cool feature I could also see some niche applications for in amateur or GMRS use—say you're out of doors and aren't getting a reply, you could ping the radio and try and see if they're out or range or incapacitated or what have you. Killing an open mic would be nice, too—I know it's possible on digital but I don't think there's any analog sets that do that to my knowledge.

[mbrun]

[mention=3409]mbrun[/mention] …My biggest frustration is the menu list seems to go backwards, and there's so much wasted screen real estate….

You are the first person on this forum to mention the backwards menu operation. I reported that to BTWR the day after I received the radio. At that point in time the rotary knob did not operate when the function menu was live. I reported that I felt dyslectic using the up and down keys. That dual line display needs to go unless the menu can be made to behave like every other scrolling menu in the world. Fortunately the knob issue has since been resolved.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

[mbrun]

Unzip the attached file and see if your Norton passes it as OK!  It works for me in Windows XP; Version 3.02:
KG905G.zip
 

Norton 360 found no virus in the package on initial scan, nor did it balk when trying to install. So this old version appears clean.

73


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

[phottomatt]

Might be important to note that you DO NOT want to change the com port in driver properties. Mine was on com port 3, when I followed the instruction from BTWR it allowed my PC (win10) to recognize the 905G on com port 3. I am using the red Wouxun cable.

[phottomatt]

On 10/29/2021 at 6:52 PM, MichaelLAX said:

Unzip the attached file and see if your Norton passes it as OK!  It works for me in Windows XP; Version 3.02:

KG905G.zip 1.15 MB · 1 download

 

My G4-1 had 462.55000

[MichaelLAX]

2 hours ago, phottomatt said:

My G4-1 had 462.55000

Sounds like they fixed it: what version of CPS are you using?

Can you please post a copy or download link here for us to download?