Club memberships required to use (aka Pay to play)

[LeoG]

Cry, they are coming this way out of school, both grade and college.

[UncleYoda]

Speaking of idiots, I'd include you guys who don't have a clue what thread topics are for.  @rdunajewski it's your forum, you have to do something - it's a forum-wide issue.

[SteveShannon]

36 minutes ago, UncleYoda said:

Speaking of idiots, I'd include you guys who don't have a clue what thread topics are for.  @rdunajewski it's your forum, you have to do something - it's a forum-wide issue.

Relax, forums are meant for conversations and sometimes conversations meander, especially when the original subject has been exhausted. Calling people idiots almost never works. Of course, neither does telling someone to relax.

[WRQC527]

26 minutes ago, UncleYoda said:

Speaking of idiots, I'd include you guys who don't have a clue what thread topics are for.  @rdunajewski it's your forum, you have to do something - it's a forum-wide issue.

You just insulted a fairly large chunk of MyGMRS users. Which, ironically, is leading this thread further off topic. But in the spirit of keeping my post on-topic, I'll say that my repeater association allows non-members and non-associates to use our repeaters, but we encourage them to join, which gives them a vote and helps pay for the whole shebang. I hope your day gets better.

[nokones]

59 minutes ago, WRQC527 said:

You just insulted a fairly large chunk of MyGMRS users. Which, ironically, is leading this thread further off topic. But in the spirit of keeping my post on-topic, I'll say that my repeater association allows non-members and non-associates to use our repeaters, but we encourage them to join, which gives them a vote and helps pay for the whole shebang. I hope your day gets better.

And lay off the intoxicating substances. It's not healthy.

[gortex2]

3 hours ago, UncleYoda said:

Speaking of idiots, I'd include you guys who don't have a clue what thread topics are for.  @rdunajewski it's your forum, you have to do something - it's a forum-wide issue.

Rich doesn't moderate. Nor lock threads over time. He said he can't have moderators unless he pays them and its not finacially feasable. so this forum is a mess. Not much any of us can do. If he would at least lock threads over 60 days maybe that would help some but then we would start yet another 1000th thread on why my CCR wont hit the repeater. 

[OffRoaderX]

21 minutes ago, gortex2 said:

He said he can't have moderators unless he pays them

Having owned/run a forum larger than this one, this makes zero sense to me. But, it's his ball, his rules.

[WRUU653]

4 hours ago, UncleYoda said:

you guys who don't have a clue what thread topics are for

yes yes okay, back on topic... Do you like club sandwiches and would you pay for them... something like that I think. 

[LeoG]

33 minutes ago, gortex2 said:

Rich doesn't moderate. Nor lock threads over time. He said he can't have moderators unless he pays them and its not finacially feasable. so this forum is a mess. Not much any of us can do. If he would at least lock threads over 60 days maybe that would help some but then we would start yet another 1000th thread on why my CCR wont hit the repeater. 

I'm a admin on one and a moderator on another forum.  I get paid $50 a year for one, get a gift card and the other isn't paid.  It's not a requirement to moderate.  Come as you please and if you see something you clean it up.  You get a dozen volunteers across the nation and you have the time slots all covered.

[marcspaz]

Two of the old moderators were the biggest troublemakers.  He bounced them and hasn't put anyone back in the role.

[OffRoaderX]

1 minute ago, marcspaz said:

Two of the old moderators were the biggest troublemakers.

Sometimes they get big-heads and go rouge.. I had that same issue.. You know what they say:  Absolute power absolutely can be a problem..

[WRQC527]

Forum moderators take all the fun out of forums. 

[WRXR255]

Despite the lack of moderators I think the forum actually manages pretty damn well from what ive seen with very few issues.

Ive been on well moderated forums and the amount of absolute idiots that had to be dealt with constantly kept them busy.

So, it could be much, much worse here.

[LeoG]

Usually only a couple of the mods do 90% of the work.  The rest like the glory.  I take care of politics and religion in one of them.....  That can be fun.

[SteveShannon]

52 minutes ago, WRXR255 said:

Despite the lack of moderators I think the forum actually manages pretty damn well from what ive seen with very few issues.

Ive been on well moderated forums and the amount of absolute idiots that had to be dealt with constantly kept them busy.

So, it could be much, much worse here.

This^^^
I’m an admin on three Facebook groups, including one with 10,000 members. It’s a thankless job except for the really nice people, which fortunately is most of them. 
This forum is remarkably well behaved. Sometimes a person gets impatient or drunk posts and makes an idiot of themselves, but for the most part we all get along even though we may disagree. 

[WRKC935]

On 7/19/2024 at 2:22 PM, OffRoaderX said:

Having owned/run a forum larger than this one, this makes zero sense to me. But, it's his ball, his rules.

I am not sure where he is, but it might be some state law mandating that. 

Hell, you can't pump your own gas in New Jersey.  Has to be a station employee and they are all Union.  But that would be my guess. 

[WQAI363]

On 7/12/2024 at 2:03 PM, UncleYoda said:

Does the practice of clubs allowing only paid members to use their repeater(s) violate GMRS regs?  Is it different than similar practice in HAM? (These questions are prompted by comments in various threads here.)

 

No trash posting please; if you don't care, ignore.

Pay to Play GMRS repeater systems are not actually in violation of FCC rules or regulations, because the repeater trustee or owner isn't making a profiting from the repeater. The club dues collected goes solely for upkeep of the Repeater.

 

 

[WRKC935]

On 7/19/2024 at 3:45 PM, OffRoaderX said:

Sometimes they get big-heads and go rouge.. I had that same issue.. You know what they say:  Absolute power absolutely can be a problem..

And the other issue is personalities and 'friends and not so much / enemies' on a forum.  Keeping personal feelings out of it can be difficult.  You and I have had a couple 'issues' of course.  Not a big secret.  If either of us had been a moderator with ban hammer abilities, the other one of us would have been gone.  At least for a minute until the board owner got involved and unbanned whoever, and probably removed the other from being a moderator.  And that would have been a detriment to the board if it would have happened to either of us.    We both have made significant contributions to the 'shared knowledge' on here.

 

[WRKC935]

12 hours ago, Adamdaj said:

Pay to Play GMRS repeater systems are not actually in violation of FCC rules or regulations, because the repeater trustee or owner isn't making a profiting from the repeater. The club dues collected goes solely for upkeep of the Repeater.

Yeah, it really depends on how the whole thing is structured and how the funds are distributed.

If it's a club, with some type of benefit outside of just repeater access.  And the funds are used for things outside of the upkeep of the repeater, then it's legal.  Part of the benefit can be using the repeater, but it can't typically be the only benefit.  And it has to be a 'club'.  Meaning that there needs to be some level of organization with members, a board or some sort of body, and the repeater 'owner' shouldn't be the President in Perpetuity.  If it's a club, there can be 'profit' but it can't just build, or simply all go to the repeater owner and not be used for other club functions. 

It gets a bit into a gray area, and I doubt that the FCC is gonna audit books. 

I am not a big fan of pay to play if it can be avoided.  But, owning and maintaining repeaters personally, I can tell you that unless your name is McCloud and you are running around chopping of head's and saying "There can be Only One" at 50 or 100 bucks a year, you will NEVER get close to the cost of owning a repeater in your lifetime at that rate. 

[LeoG]

1 hour ago, WRKC935 said:

And the other issue is personalities and 'friends and not so much / enemies' on a forum.  Keeping personal feelings out of it can be difficult.  You and I have had a couple 'issues' of course.  Not a big secret.  If either of us had been a moderator with ban hammer abilities, the other one of us would have been gone.  At least for a minute until the board owner got involved and unbanned whoever, and probably removed the other from being a moderator.  And that would have been a detriment to the board if it would have happened to either of us.    We both have made significant contributions to the 'shared knowledge' on here.

 

You have no idea how many people would be banned on the forums I moderate if I had no morals or merits.  But I can constrain myself and my feelings and they, unfortunately are still on the forum.  It's just another job you have to do within the constrains given.

[WQAI363]

5 hours ago, WRKC935 said:

Yeah, it really depends on how the whole thing is structured and how the funds are distributed.

If it's a club, with some type of benefit outside of just repeater access.  And the funds are used for things outside of the upkeep of the repeater, then it's legal.  Part of the benefit can be using the repeater, but it can't typically be the only benefit.  And it has to be a 'club'.  Meaning that there needs to be some level of organization with members, a board or some sort of body, and the repeater 'owner' shouldn't be the President in Perpetuity.  If it's a club, there can be 'profit' but it can't just build, or simply all go to the repeater owner and not be used for other club functions. 

It gets a bit into a gray area, and I doubt that the FCC is gonna audit books. 

I am not a big fan of pay to play if it can be avoided.  But, owning and maintaining repeaters personally, I can tell you that unless your name is McCloud and you are running around chopping of head's and saying "There can be Only One" at 50 or 100 bucks a year, you will NEVER get close to the cost of owning a repeater in your lifetime at that rate. 

You're right!  I did leave out a lot of other aspects of any radio club.  

[Raybestos]

On 7/19/2024 at 4:04 PM, WRQC527 said:

Forum moderators take all the fun out of forums. 

Agreed!  One popular radio oriented site is moderated to death.  I think most of its moderators get a below-the-belt rush from locking threads after proclaiming "All that can be said here has been said.  LOCKED!" even when there was quite a lot still worthy of being said and asked.  They love deleting comments or locking threads if the forbidden topic of "encryption" is mentioned in a way the moderators find to be "unclean", even though encryption is a major problem confronting most users of that site.

Better no moderation or not enough than too much, any day of the week.

 

[JoCoBrian]

On 7/12/2024 at 4:16 PM, SteveShannon said:

If you look at the regulations they specifically prohibit operating as a commercial carrier but they say that companies who are licensed may operate nonprofitably. 
I’ve never seen anything that says a repeater owner can’t recuperate costs. 
Ham radio is completely different. There it’s specifically prohibited to charge. 

I know of at least one instance where the HOA pays for the repeater, the power, the tower, and maintenance.  Or I should say the HOA reimburses the licensee for the gear and assorted costs that go with it.  They pay the cost, not cost plus.  The small repeater covers the housing addition and serves the residents that choose to be part of any crime watch, or chatter, that may happen.