Channels? channels? - What's the difference or "Understanding my radio"

[WSEN940]

Just saw a video by one of our members (I'm talking about you, the Queen of all that is GMRS) and it reminded me to complete the attached document. It's something I started a few months ago and it covers the definition of a channel or Channel. It's absolutely where the problems lie in understanding more complex radios. I know it did for me initially, but hey, I'm a smart guy right!? OK, maybe it took me a lot of reading but I got there.

As this is the internet, I will add that this is pretty much a first pass. I am not married to this, so if I got something wrong, or anyone can clarify something, please, please let me know. This is a community that wants to help others, which is what I am attempting here. 

I got a little more in depth than originally planned, but held back from going all engineering nerd on this. I wanted to keep this beginner friendly. So if you are a novice, read this and let me know if it made any sense.

GMRS Channels.pdf

[Socalgmrs]

Wow. .  That really complicates things a whole lot.   Another solution looking for a problem.  Just set it and talk.   What’s the big deal.  It’s sooo simple.  Gmrs is supposed to be so simple a 90yr old great great grandma can do it.  Why complicated it even more.   My dad who is not tech savvy at all uses and programs gmrs every day.    It really doesn’t take pages and graphs to understand for any one with 1/2 a working mind. And if you have a gmrs certified radio it’s even easier with less head ache. 

[Davichko5650]

3 minutes ago, Socalgmrs said:

Wow. .  That really complicates things a whole lot.   Another solution looking for a problem.  

What we call "making the impossible difficult."

[WSHH887]

Well now, your treatise on channels might seem complicated to some, but by reading carefully and after digesting the information I have a better understanding.  I especially liked the transmit and receive frequencies for the repeater channels.  I'm not sure these little GXT's are preset to transmit on the repeater frequencies and thus repeater capable.  They do say you can assign a "privacy" code which I take to be the same as a tone.  I'm still working on installing the DB-20 but I'm learning a heck of a lot with jst these little handhelds.

Keep funneling the information.  Thanks.

[TDM827]

10 minutes ago, WSHH887 said:

Well now, your treatise on channels might seem complicated to some, but by reading carefully and after digesting the information I have a better understanding.  I especially liked the transmit and receive frequencies for the repeater channels.  I'm not sure these little GXT's are preset to transmit on the repeater frequencies and thus repeater capable.  They do say you can assign a "privacy" code which I take to be the same as a tone.  I'm still working on installing the DB-20 but I'm learning a heck of a lot with jst these little handhelds.

Keep funneling the information.  Thanks.

GXT1000, GXT3000 are definitely not repeater capable. You can hear transmissions on the frequencies used by repeaters, but you cannot access the repeater and transmit on it. But, technically they are still GMRS radios.  

If you want to drop some coin on a handheld Mildand repeater radio you are looking at the GXT67PRO. Not exactly an inexpensive option however. But, to each their own.      

[WSHH887]

Thanks TDM827.  I didn't really intend to try and hit a repeater with them, just more curious.  But since GMRS channels 15 to 22 are repeater channels should I avoid using them in simplex to cluttering up the repeaters?

[TDM827]

18 minutes ago, WSHH887 said:

Thanks TDM827.  I didn't really intend to try and hit a repeater with them, just more curious.  But since GMRS channels 15 to 22 are repeater channels should I avoid using them in simplex to cluttering up the repeaters?

I will admit that I don't know if the GXTs can only receive repeater traffic. Or, they have the ability to transmit on the repeater transmit frequency, but are simply programmed lacking the capacity to connect to a repeater. A check of the online manual could probably quickly clear it up.

Never really gave it much thought. We use these radios frequently for very short range comms, around the house and neighborhood. And sometimes for extended communications in town and it's surrounding areas in the county. We have tested all channels. But solely for simplicity sake, almost all our comms exclusively take place on channels 1-9. 

[WSEN940]

Just to note, the GXT3000 is repeater capable. Or so the website says.  But without looking, I’d suspect that you’d be pretty lucky if they just happened to have the right codes for the local repeaters.

The advantage of these types of radios is that they really are designed to be easy to operate. And TDM872, your usage is typically what most folks probably do with them.

I keep a couple kicking around for this very purpose. 

[WSEN940]

3 hours ago, WSHH887 said:

Well now, your treatise on channels might seem complicated to some, but by reading carefully and after digesting the information I have a better understanding.  I especially liked the transmit and receive frequencies for the repeater channels.  I'm not sure these little GXT's are preset to transmit on the repeater frequencies and thus repeater capable.  They do say you can assign a "privacy" code which I take to be the same as a tone.  I'm still working on installing the DB-20 but I'm learning a heck of a lot with jst these little handhelds.

Keep funneling the information.  Thanks.

Glad it was useful. 
 

yeah! That privacy code thing….yes, it really is just a tone. Worth noting that if you are chatting to someone with ‘privacy tones’ turned on…it’s not private. Anyone without the tones setup on their radio, but on the same frequency will hear you. 

[nokones]

I would like Mr. Queen's take on this, do we now call channels "Frequency Storage Location Radio Positions" or just "Channel" positions?

[OffRoaderX]

4 hours ago, nokones said:

I would like Mr. Queen's take on this, do we now call channels "Frequency Storage Location Radio Positions" or just "Channel" positions?

I think a more proper term would be RF Frequency Storage Location Position Allocations...
If we're going to over-complicate things, we need to overcomplicate theshit out of them at least as well as the H.A.M.s Radios operators do.

[Davichko5650]

17 minutes ago, OffRoaderX said:

I think a more proper term would be RF Frequency Storage Location Position Allocations...
 

We just need a snappy acronym for RFFSLPA.   ReFFSLaPA?

[TDM827]

17 hours ago, WSEN940 said:

Just to note, the GXT3000 is repeater capable. Or so the website says.  But without looking, I’d suspect that you’d be pretty lucky if they just happened to have the right codes for the local repeaters.

The advantage of these types of radios is that they really are designed to be easy to operate. And TDM872, your usage is typically what most folks probably do with them.

I keep a couple kicking around for this very purpose. 

I stand corrected. Thanks for the research! According to the Midland website, while the GXT3000 appears to be a bubble pack style radio they go on to say they are repeater capable. 

I think some people mistakenly view me as a Midland fanboy, who knows what I am doing when it comes down to these radios. When in fact the only reasons I started with the brand is they had a serious discount during a Black Friday / X-mas sale years ago on their mobile / GXT combo packs. And, everyone else in the family said the only way they would participate in my then ambitious radio plans was if I kept things simple for them.   

After that it's a matter of consulting the manuals and google! LOL

[nokones]

4 hours ago, OffRoaderX said:

I think a more proper term would be RF Frequency Storage Location Position Allocations...
If we're going to over-complicate things, we need to overcomplicate theshit out of them at least as well as the H.A.M.s Radios operators do.

Ok, the rule is the K.I.S.S. concept is no longer the way it should be done.

[SteveShannon]

The FCC regulations define 22 specific frequencies with power and bandwidth limits as numbered channels for FRS. 
The FCC regulations also establish limits on those same 22 frequencies for GMRS and add eight more for transmitting to repeaters. 
Read the regulations. 
Then consult the manuals for your radios to see how the manufacturers refer to them. 

[AdmiralCochrane]

On 3/20/2025 at 10:28 PM, WSHH887 said:

Thanks TDM827.  I didn't really intend to try and hit a repeater with them, just more curious.  But since GMRS channels 15 to 22 are repeater channels should I avoid using them in simplex to cluttering up the repeaters?

Not entirely.  Politeness should prevail. If no one is using the channel, use simplex if you want.  If there is other traffic, pick another.  That is why there is more than one channel in the service.

[Jaay]

22 hours ago, OffRoaderX said:

I think a more proper term would be RF Frequency Storage Location Position Allocations...
If we're going to over-complicate things, we need to overcomplicate theshit out of them at least as well as the H.A.M.s Radios operators do.

Not all of us do that ! Simplifying things are what I do ...

[nokones]

"Some People" have CTCSS/DPL enabled on their receive channel that will prevent you to hear the other traffic thus, you will interfere with that traffic. It is the responsibility of all users to not interfere with other traffic and they should monitor to see if the channel is clear before proceeding. Most cheap Pandaland radios have a monitor button to use to see if the channel is clear, but that usually just momentary disables the receiver decoder and blows squelch noise. In order to properly monitor to see if the channel is clear you have to keep the button depressed for a few seconds and put up with the squelch noise. Real radios, like Kenwood, GE/Tyco/Ericsson/Harris, and Motorola, has a feature called PL Defeat or just Monitor, that will disable the receiver decoder, temporarily with a programmable switch or button, without putting up with the radio blowing squelch to allow you to see if channel is clear. 

[Lscott]

1 hour ago, nokones said:

"Some People" have CTCSS/DPL enabled on their receive channel that will prevent you to hear the other traffic thus, you will interfere with that traffic. It is the responsibility of all users to not interfere with other traffic and they should monitor to see if the channel is clear before proceeding. Most cheap Pandaland radios have a monitor button to use to see if the channel is clear, but that usually just momentary disables the receiver decoder and blows squelch noise. In order to properly monitor to see if the channel is clear you have to keep the button depressed for a few seconds and put up with the squelch noise. Real radios, like Kenwood, GE/Tyco/Ericsson/Harris, and Motorola, has a feature called PL Defeat or just Monitor, that will disable the receiver decoder, temporarily with a programmable switch or button, without putting up with the radio blowing squelch to allow you to see if channel is clear. 

One reason why I , almost, never use a receive tone, just a transmit one when operating through a repeater. That way I don't have to fuss with even pressing a "monitor" button.

[WRNU354]

4 hours ago, nokones said:

 It is the responsibility of all users to not interfere with other traffic and they should monitor to see if the channel is clear before proceeding.

When available on the radio, I enable "Busy Channel Lockout".

With this enabled on my mobiles and HTs it prevents me from transmitting on a busy channel and gives me a districtive error tone.

So far I haven't experienced any downside to enabling this feature by default and should I suspect a problem it is easy to disable on the radio.

 

[WRTC928]

On 3/20/2025 at 9:28 PM, WSHH887 said:

But since GMRS channels 15 to 22 are repeater channels should I avoid using them in simplex to cluttering up the repeaters?

Just as a courtesy, I typically use channels 1-7 for simplex unless I need more than 5 watts. So far, that hasn't happened. Just an anecdotal observation -- it seems as if in my area, GMRS users mostly stay on 15-22 whether simplex or duplex, while FRS users are all over the place. I suppose GMRS users are just accustomed to using 15-22, so that's what they dial up, even on simplex, but I prefer not to. A lot of this radio stuff is just about good manners. If I can stay off the repeater channels in simplex, I do. However, in my area, there's so little traffic that it probably doesn't matter.

[Lscott]

2 hours ago, WRTC928 said:

A lot of this radio stuff is just about good manners. If I can stay off the repeater channels in simplex, I do. However, in my area, there's so little traffic that it probably doesn't matter.

Sort of reminds me of this topic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragedy_of_the_commons

[AdmiralCochrane]

That is about overused resources.  WRTC928 spoke of an underused resource.

[nokones]

5 hours ago, WRNU354 said:

When available on the radio, I enable "Busy Channel Lockout".

With this enabled on my mobiles and HTs it prevents me from transmitting on a busy channel and gives me a districtive error tone.

So far I haven't experienced any downside to enabling this feature by default and should I suspect a problem it is easy to disable on the radio.

 

That's true and will work in most cases. However, that feature will also enable and prevent you from using the channel on any signal including a distant signal that just barely breaks squelch.

[nokones]

7 hours ago, Lscott said:

One reason why I , almost, never use a receive tone, just a transmit one when operating through a repeater. That way I don't have to fuss with even pressing a "monitor" button.

I still program the receive channel tones and codes on the channels with downlink tones and codes for the just in cases. However, 99% of the time I run with the PL Defeat or Monitor feature enabled so I can monitor the channel and I disable the feature only when there is constant channel noise from RFI or EMI sources such as LED Street Lights. The street lights on my street are VHF Highband (151 MHz) LEDs and the Street Lights near where I jump on the Freeway are GMRS Channel 22 Street Lights and it takes me to drive a  half mile or so before the noise goes away.