Using UV-82C for Part 95E

[WREB270]

You must have the worst electronic luck imaginable. Ive got a pile of UV5Rs, BF888s, a few UV82HPs, a BFF8HP, Wouxoun KGUV8D and a UV50X2.

 

Ive had all of them on a meter. All put out advertised power levels. The UV50X2 actually does 70 watts on VHF in some parts of the band. This radio is a year and a half old now.

 

Ive got a 8ish year old UV5R that's my motorcycle mobile radio thats been mounted on my bars since new and its survived all that time exposed to vibrations, UV, rain, cold, heat. Being ejected a few times off pavement at 40mph, ect

 

Now i cant speak for how clean their signal is as i dont have the equipment to check that but for my uses theyve been quite satisfactory.

 

Issues ive had with them

 

The UV50X2 has a wonky channel knob.

 

1 of my 888s wont talk to chirp anymore

 

KGUV8D consumes batteries even when its switched off.

 

 

All this being said I switched a surplus Motorola PM400 (UHF) into my Jeep and am enjoying it quite a bit. Nice and simple. I know its rugged. Its pretty compact and the audio quality out and in is awesome. I lost being able to do a VFO mode and dual band of the UV50X2 but I rarely use VHF anymore so no huge deal.

 

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

Could be a bad lot number, batch of 60 or so get made with a sub part or other issue and is not caught, Amazon gets that entire lot and Bam that's what happens. There are plenty of reviews on these radios not out puting their ratings. ALSO I have seen one like yours where it is cranking out 70-80 watts. But that's doesn't say much for consistency.

 

I have UV-5Rs that run excellently. I still have both the 82HPs, they are in fact rebranded uv6r's it's right in the box from btech and only put out 6watts on high. And again look through reviews you will see this is not uncommon. One actually quit work without using an external mic.

[Ian]

https://forums.mygmrs.com/topic/1448-seeking-logical-rationale-for-type-95/?p=13112
 
I believe that using the UV-82C for GMRS would be legal, per the two-year-old FCC guidance linked here.  Then again, the left hand seems unsure of what the right hand is doing, and there's a distressing lack of new-production GMRS radios capable of operating to the limits of permitted emissions.  This'll be a good time to get the popcorn out... But I'm no longer afraid to transmit with my Radioddity GD-77s (which I've long used for scanning repeaters).
 
https://transition.fcc.gov/oet/ea/presentations/files/nov17/54-Part-95-Misc-Eqpt-Filing-r1-TH.pdf

[Ian]

One visit from a FCC field officer and your $24 dollar radio may end up costing you $2400... 

Can't get blood from a stone.  America frequently tries, which is how you spend twenty years in jail moving from trial to trial.

[zackandmack]

Not wanting to get into the CCR battle here, but it is my understanding that Midland mobiles are re-badged Luitons.  If I am wrong, please correct me.  Our local area started a GMRS Neighborhood Radio Fire Watch.  It has come in handy during the PG and E power shutoffs.  I purchased a Btech GMRS V1 hand held with the matching Nagoya 701c antenna.    It was a hurried purchase as my wife needed something for when I was to be gone for two weeks working in another city.  I did not have time to aquaint her with a mobile system and how to set up for use with alternate power supply, much less getting a base antenna, etc, etc...

 

Maybe I have a good one, but I can reach the new repeater easily from my qth.  I will invest in a different system, but at the time the Btech met our needs.  My goal was to have her be able to reach at least one other person...and that it does and more so.  The Btech was heard easily during nets whereas some others running the Midland products could not be heard.  Part of that is of course due to antenna, location and all those variables.  We live in hilly, treed terrain, so that factors in too.  

 

All I can say is that for the money, the Btech has worked for us.  I have another half a dozen various dual and triband hand helds made by the big three, as well as two different mobile/base radios, etc...so, while far from being any expert, I do know enough to get myself in trouble.  

 

Anyway, that has been my experience.  I even purchased one of those darn Btech hand helds for my neighbor across the road, He, licensed Extra, has part 90 equipment that needs ancient DOS programs to do anything...with the Btech, I was able to put in all the desired fire frequencies and air tac frequencies that he wanted and gave him the radio.  It is what it is and will probably fail.  But we aren't rag chewing for hours on end so it might last for a while.

 

As for the original question, the UV-82C is not Part 95 compliant and technically not allowed to be used for GMRS.  I will leave it at that.  If there is a wildfire and PG and E has the power shut off...no one will be questioning which radio I will be using to find out which road is open or closed due to fire.

 

Will it be  Luiton or Midland?  Btech GMRS, or UV 82x3, or Anytone, or an Icom 4001?  

 

73

[gman1971]

I don't know about the Luiton, etc...

 

But like I stated in some other post I made, gauging your radio performance based on its ability to hit repeaters is doomed to succeed (its a useless test to gauge performance). Those BTech stuff RF performance in simplex, when there is no repeater around that is using $2000 radio gear to do the heavy lifting, in simplex, they'll simply fall flat in their face. Especially so in a congested RF area, these are just worthless pieces of junk for anything mission critical. For the money you're better off picking up a used commercial UHF portable, that will have a proper dual conversion superhet receiver with a front end that isn't wide as a barn door, nor will desense with the 89.7 latest 80s tunes radio station. 

 

I am glad it works, but won't be surprised if it doesn't when you need it the most. It has happened to me... and since that day, no CCRs for me.

 

I'd take an Icom, or a Kenwood (like my TH-F6a) any day of the week over anything CCR, especially if it is for anything that is mission critical. Myself, for GMRS I own several used/new Vertex Standard EVX radios. I do use the cheapies for intercom at home, where the range I need is just 20 yards, which those afford fine, but when I walk out the door for anything that requires a radio that won't desense into oblivion? Vertex Standard all the way.

 

The noise at my location, measured with a VNA, is in the -50 dB threshold range in the GMRS range, I live 2 miles from a 1400 foot antenna tower, that makes nearly all the CCRs useless beyond 1/4 of a mile in simplex.

 

G.

 

Not wanting to get into the CCR battle here, but it is my understanding that Midland mobiles are re-badged Luitons.  If I am wrong, please correct me.  Our local area started a GMRS Neighborhood Radio Fire Watch.  It has come in handy during the PG and E power shutoffs.  I purchased a Btech GMRS V1 hand held with the matching Nagoya 701c antenna.    It was a hurried purchase as my wife needed something for when I was to be gone for two weeks working in another city.  I did not have time to aquaint her with a mobile system and how to set up for use with alternate power supply, much less getting a base antenna, etc, etc...

 

Maybe I have a good one, but I can reach the new repeater easily from my qth.  I will invest in a different system, but at the time the Btech met our needs.  My goal was to have her be able to reach at least one other person...and that it does and more so.  The Btech was heard easily during nets whereas some others running the Midland products could not be heard.  Part of that is of course due to antenna, location and all those variables.  We live in hilly, treed terrain, so that factors in too.  

 

All I can say is that for the money, the Btech has worked for us.  I have another half a dozen various dual and triband hand helds made by the big three, as well as two different mobile/base radios, etc...so, while far from being any expert, I do know enough to get myself in trouble.  

 

Anyway, that has been my experience.  I even purchased one of those darn Btech hand helds for my neighbor across the road, He, licensed Extra, has part 90 equipment that needs ancient DOS programs to do anything...with the Btech, I was able to put in all the desired fire frequencies and air tac frequencies that he wanted and gave him the radio.  It is what it is and will probably fail.  But we aren't rag chewing for hours on end so it might last for a while.

 

As for the original question, the UV-82C is not Part 95 compliant and technically not allowed to be used for GMRS.  I will leave it at that.  If there is a wildfire and PG and E has the power shut off...no one will be questioning which radio I will be using to find out which road is open or closed due to fire.

 

Will it be  Luiton or Midland?  Btech GMRS, or UV 82x3, or Anytone, or an Icom 4001?  

 

73

[marcspaz]

I can't really speak to the Midland being a rebadged brand. I have heard some mention it, but I haven't really seen anything that supports it.

 

I think it's like TV tech about 20 years ago. Mitsubishi was making IC's that were used in almost every TV built, so rumor spread that all TV's were just rebranded Mitsubishi TV's.... which was not true.

 

I have several MXT400's. If you want new, no nonsense, out of the box with a warranty, they are great. But like anything else entry level, there are some drawbacks. No split tone and lack of wide-band are the 2 most notable.

 

I have a few Baofeng ham radios. They are okay, but I wouldn't rely on them in a Dark Sky event. I use iCom and Yaesu for "when it counts".

 

I've mentioned this before... GMRS is not a proper solution for COOP/DR ops, even if it's for your family. You really should get ham licenses and use HF. I can talk simplex wide-band FM, reliably, for several hundred miles, and around the globe on SSB.

 

I really love GMRS and it's the platform I use the most... but it's a line of sight service/technology.

[zackandmack]

I don't know about the Luiton, etc...

 

But like I stated in some other post I made, gauging your radio performance based on its ability to hit repeaters is doomed to succeed (its a useless test to gauge performance). Those BTech stuff RF performance in simplex, when there is no repeater around that is using $2000 radio gear to do the heavy lifting, in simplex, they'll simply fall flat in their face. Especially so in a congested RF area, these are just worthless pieces of junk for anything mission critical. For the money you're better off picking up a used commercial UHF portable, that will have a proper dual conversion superhet receiver with a front end that isn't wide as a barn door, nor will desense with the 89.7 latest 80s tunes radio station. 

 

I am glad it works, but won't be surprised if it doesn't when you need it the most. It has happened to me... and since that day, no CCRs for me.

 

I'd take an Icom, or a Kenwood (like my TH-F6a) any day of the week over anything CCR, especially if it is for anything that is mission critical. Myself, for GMRS I own several used/new Vertex Standard EVX radios. I do use the cheapies for intercom at home, where the range I need is just 20 yards, which those afford fine, but when I walk out the door for anything that requires a radio that won't desense into oblivion? Vertex Standard all the way.

 

The noise at my location, measured with a VNA, is in the -50 dB threshold range in the GMRS range, I live 2 miles from a 1400 foot antenna tower, that makes nearly all the CCRs useless beyond 1/4 of a mile in simplex.

 

G.

 

 

And I will be picking something up for next year.  It probably won't be the Midland.  I do have the Kenwood F6a,  TMv71a, Alinco 235, Yaesu FT 60, VX 5, VX 2, Anytone 3318E and a couple of Baofengs.  Oh...forgot the old Icom 751 for HF.  RF Noise is quite limited out here in the foothills of the Sierra.  

 

Look, I know the limitations of CCRs.  And I know it will fail.  But for now it serves my purpose.  We use GMRS for a specific purpose, which is Neighborhood Radio Fire Watch.  For rag chewing, etc...I have other radios and allstar nodes.  If fact, was talking to a guy from Western Australia today as I was walking up our ¼ mile driveway.  Kinda nice.  GMRS, CCR or not..will not do that.

 

73

[zackandmack]

The performance of the Btech has been quite adequate for my uses.  To the repeater its about five miles through hills and trees.  It is located on the flatland and designed to beam back up here into the hills.  Simplex, I can cover everyone from my location within five miles using the Nagoya 701c antenna.  Again, hills and trees.  Its the Gold Country here in far Northern California  just to give you an ideda of the terrain.  And I am not using the radio for rag chewing.  Others may use GMRS for different purposes and that is fine.

 

Would I recommend the Btech radio to a beginner in GMRS?  Sure.  Maybe its heresy around here, but it is  a radio.  I don't think I would recommend any of their mobiles.  Would I also recommend moving beyond the Btech into part 90/95 equipment like Kenwood, or Icom, etc?  You betcha.  But just like in amateur radio, the CCRs provide an entry.  (nothwithstanding all the non licensed uses, etc).  Used properly, one have find great enjoyment from their Potato radio.  They can talk to ISS, Satellites, as well do APRS and a whole host of other things.  In fact Digital radio is being lead not from D-Star, or Fusion, but DMR and CCRs.  (Think Anytone).

 

I went into my purchase of the Btech knowing full well what they are.  But heck, the Yaesu FT-60 new I had to send back as it would not TX...so tell me again?

[marcspaz]

...But heck, the Yaesu FT-60 new I had to send back as it would not TX...so tell me again?

I love the way Yaesu radios look and feel.  They have great features and are very intuitive to use.  BUT... my FT-8900 had blown receive filters, brand new out of the box.  And today, my 5 day old $800 Yaesu FT-857D caught on fire while I was in the middle of a QSO.

 

With all of the terrible stuff that I experienced with BTech/BaoFeng ham radios, none of them caught on fire and nearly burn my Jeep down with me in it.

 

I think I am going to switch to Kenwood.  LOL

[gman1971]

I am not saying don't buy CCR, just know what you're getting. That's all, so you don't put too much faith on those inexpensive radios.

 

GMRS won't do it b/c it is only FCC, but in theory, if another country who follows the FCC ruling has a GMRS repeater linked you could talk all over the world too... I know, not RF direct call, but still cool nonetheless.

 

 

And I will be picking something up for next year.  It probably won't be the Midland.  I do have the Kenwood F6a,  TMv71a, Alinco 235, Yaesu FT 60, VX 5, VX 2, Anytone 3318E and a couple of Baofengs.  Oh...forgot the old Icom 751 for HF.  RF Noise is quite limited out here in the foothills of the Sierra.  

 

Look, I know the limitations of CCRs.  And I know it will fail.  But for now it serves my purpose.  We use GMRS for a specific purpose, which is Neighborhood Radio Fire Watch.  For rag chewing, etc...I have other radios and allstar nodes.  If fact, was talking to a guy from Western Australia today as I was walking up our ¼ mile driveway.  Kinda nice.  GMRS, CCR or not..will not do that.

 

73

[zackandmack]

I am not saying don't buy CCR, just know what you're getting. That's all, so you don't put too much faith on those inexpensive radios.

 

GMRS won't do it b/c it is only FCC, but in theory, if another country who follows the FCC ruling has a GMRS repeater linked you could talk all over the world too... I know, not RF direct call, but still cool nonetheless.

 

 

I have heard of GMRS using allstar linked repeaters and or nodes.  Don't know the legality of this with the FCC, but it might be a gray area someone is taking advantage of.   IIRC it was one gentleman pushing allstar usage with GMRS.  

[gman1971]

AT the risking of possibly starting a fire, I would say that I don't consider Ham Gear mission critical either. Most of the ham stuff I've tried is flimsy, and has RF front ends that are wide as barn doors too. For example, when using my TM-V71a with a triple 5/8 over 5/8, its hammered by intermod pretty hard, mostly due to a NOAA station (and other high powered junk) blasting 2 miles from home from a 1400 foot tower..., and while the CCRs don't hear squat, the TM-V71 hears much better, but still severely desensed and the intermod hurts it really bad. I can hear the NOAA breaking on the GMRS frequencies if I don't run any filtering... In contrast, I don't have that issue with the EVX-5300 radios, even without any filtering added; sure, the EVX-5300 is only an 8 channel mobile with just a single digit numeric LED, and it won't even go below 450 Mhz, but its perfect for GMRS and also allows the option to use DMR.

 

Yes, exactly, a couple of CCR GD77s gave me a taste of DMR, and since then I upgraded all my GMRS FM only gear to high end DMR capable gear, but I still run it on FM. But let me tell you, once you move into high end DMR radios like the EVX-5300, you realize how bad these CCRs really are, even the Anytones (Alinco DJ-MD5) still don't hold a candle to the EVX radios from Vertex Standard (Motorola now)

 

We shall see how it all shakes down. Whatever the future awaits, I am ready to embrace digital the moment the regulations allow for digital voice modes on GMRS.

 

G.

 

The performance of the Btech has been quite adequate for my uses.  To the repeater its about five miles through hills and trees.  It is located on the flatland and designed to beam back up here into the hills.  Simplex, I can cover everyone from my location within five miles using the Nagoya 701c antenna.  Again, hills and trees.  Its the Gold Country here in far Northern California  just to give you an ideda of the terrain.  And I am not using the radio for rag chewing.  Others may use GMRS for different purposes and that is fine.

 

Would I recommend the Btech radio to a beginner in GMRS?  Sure.  Maybe its heresy around here, but it is  a radio.  I don't think I would recommend any of their mobiles.  Would I also recommend moving beyond the Btech into part 90/95 equipment like Kenwood, or Icom, etc?  You betcha.  But just like in amateur radio, the CCRs provide an entry.  (nothwithstanding all the non licensed uses, etc).  Used properly, one have find great enjoyment from their Potato radio.  They can talk to ISS, Satellites, as well do APRS and a whole host of other things.  In fact Digital radio is being lead not from D-Star, or Fusion, but DMR and CCRs.  (Think Anytone).

 

I went into my purchase of the Btech knowing full well what they are.  But heck, the Yaesu FT-60 new I had to send back as it would not TX...so tell me again?

[n4gix]

And today, my 5 day old $800 Yaesu FT-857D caught on fire while I was in the middle of a QSO.

Do you have any idea why the FT-857D caught fire? I have one installed in my Toyota Camry and that report of a fire now has me as nervous as a cat trapped on a front porch surrounded by rocking grannies!

[marcspaz]

Do you have any idea why the FT-857D caught fire? I have one installed in my Toyota Camry and that report of a fire now has me as nervous as a cat trapped on a front porch surrounded by rocking grannies!

It was sent to Yaesu for review. My initial thought is the controller failed.

 

Just moments before, the transceiver would keep sending an FM carrier after I let the PTT go. I had to disconnect the power to shut it off. It seemed okay for about 5 minutes after the reboot,before the fire.

 

Another reason I think it was the controller IC failure is because a huge voltage spike from the IF circuit nuked both antennas and feed lines on the VHF/UHF side and the HF side.

[Elkhunter521]

The Luiton LT-590 UHF and the Midland 400, except for badging and firmware, are the same radio. I have both. Opened up they are identical. The Luiton comes with programming software and programming cable, 200 channels.

[Elkhunter521]

Oops, forgot this part. The Luiton is also either wide band or narrow. Its also capable of split pl tones. Sells for just a little over 1/2 the price of the Midland.

[n4gix]

It was sent to Yaesu for review. My initial thought is the controller failed.

Oh my! Was the unit still under warranty or do you have to eat the repair costs?

[marcspaz]

Oh my! Was the unit still under warranty or do you have to eat the repair costs?

The radio was only a few days old when it broke.  The Ham Radio Outlet gave me a brand new radio and sent the damaged one back for analysis.  It may be a month or so before we hear back.  They may never tell me what the result is... but at least the HRO took good care of me.

[RCM]

The radio was only a few days old when it broke.  The Ham Radio Outlet gave me a brand new radio and sent the damaged one back for analysis.  It may be a month or so before we hear back.  They may never tell me what the result is... but at least the HRO took good care of me.

That means Yaesu took care of you. The reason I say that is I used to be in the business, and Yaesu was always good to take care of the dealers. Kenwood, not so much.

Don't get me wrong; I'm a fan of Kenwood commercial gear and also amateur gear from early '80s and back. But I worked for a full line dealer during the '90s, and Kenwood was dead last in customer service. Yaesu was first. Alinco ran a very close second.

We couldn't just replace a Kenwood that failed. If we did, we would likely have to eat it.

[wrfr886]

 

I have several users on my repeaters that use them and to be honest I plan to start revoking permission because of the poor audio and signal quality.

 

 

MY 2 cents, thats elitism. If you have a problem with them on the repeater, snatch up 'acceptable' radios on ebay and offer them to users at a cost + expense markup to gently encourage them.

 

I am a single dad with 3 kids and have a fleet of radios for camping/hiking. Should I spend $2k on radios or $200 for 3 HT's and a Mobile, or... i dunno, by clothes?

[wrfr886]

 

First... I have purchased several BTech / Baofeng radios and all failed within weeks. The extra time and money spent trying to get them to work was ridiculous.

what are you doing to them? seen one fail cause of a power switch. that is it.

[marcspaz]

what are you doing to them? seen one fail cause of a power switch. that is it.

 

All of the mobiles are gone.  I have two Ham Radio handhelds that seem to work OK.  So, my son and I use them when we go 4-wheeling while out of the trucks.  If one of us mistakenly drops an HT in the mud or on some rocks, better dropping a $35 is better than dropping a $300+ high-quality HT.

[berkinet]

MY 2 cents, thats elitism. If you have a problem with them on the repeater, snatch up 'acceptable' radios on ebay and offer them to users at a cost + expense markup to gently encourage them.

 

I am a single dad with 3 kids and have a fleet of radios for camping/hiking. Should I spend $2k on radios or $200 for 3 HT's and a Mobile, or... i dunno, by clothes?

 

I think that is an unfair accusation. Corey's repeater is not a public utility or a public service. He owns the repeater and lets other people use it.  It is up to him to set whatever standards he wants to: technical, behavior, content, etc. If people don't like his rules, they don't have to use his repeater. Since he has already made the capital outlay to build, house and operate the repeater, I see no reason why he should now have to support the equipment needs of the people who wish to use the repeater.

 

OTOH, you should buy the equipment that meets your needs for communication, reliability and price. That is strictly your decision. Should your equipment need to meet the standards of a repeater operator, that is then one more item you need to factor in to your purchase decision.

 

Here is an example of a similar issue that may help make this clear. The Midland MXT400 is a popular GMRS certified radio. However, because of some design decisions on Midland's part, the MXT400 is not be able to operate with some repeaters. (Available PL tones; split PL operation; and only narrow-band transmission.)  If you own an MXT400 and cannot access a repeater, who's responsibility is it to address the problem? Should the repeater owner change their configuration to accommodate you, or should you change your radio to meet the repeater's requirements?

 

By the way. You present the situation as binary: CCRs, vs. expensive equipment. There is another option, high-quality, used equipment - Part90 and Part95.  For your same $200 budget you could find decent gear - perhaps with cosmetic or other minor issues.

[wayoverthere]

MY 2 cents, thats elitism.

while it may be an unpopular opinion, and I reach that conclusion for different reasons than wrfr886, i kind of agree with that sentiment....i'll explain below.

I think that is an unfair accusation. Corey's repeater is not a public utility or a public service. He owns the repeater and lets other people use it. It is up to him to set whatever standards he wants to: technical, behavior, content, etc. If people don't like his rules, they don't have to use his repeater. Since he has already made the capital outlay to build, house and operate the repeater, I see no reason why he should now have to support the equipment needs of the people who wish to use the repeater.

 

OTOH, you should buy the equipment that meets your needs for communication, reliability and price. That is strictly your decision. Should your equipment need to meet the standards of a repeater operator, that is then one more item you need to factor in to your purchase decision.

 

Here is an example of a similar issue that may help make this clear. The Midland MXT400 is a popular GMRS certified radio. However, because of some design decisions on Midland's part, the MXT400 is not be able to operate with some repeaters. (Available PL tones; split PL operation; and only narrow-band transmission.) If you own an MXT400 and cannot access a repeater, who's responsibility is it to address the problem? Should the repeater owner change their configuration to accommodate you, or should you change your radio to meet the repeater's requirements?

first, i 100% agree that it's the repeater owner's choice to set it up however they want, allow whoever they want (or not), etc.

 

the other side though: it's not a stretch to say that midland is probably one of the most visible off the shelf options, especially at a beginner's price point, so probably what most beginners are going to grab (at least those making an effort to be legal, rather than grabbing whatever radio from amazon that covers the frequencies). and midland certainly doesn't make their limitations clear in any of the materials, nor any of the listings that they're restricted that way (again, especially to beginners who likely won't know to watch out for such limitations).

 

the central issue: i forget if i saw it here or on r/gmrs, but it was stated by a repeater owner that they had configured their repeater with split tones with the intent to keep midland users off their repeater. while that's absolutely their right as the owner, it's hard not to see that as a form of elitism, be it directed toward the equipment, or at beginners.

[berkinet]

while it may be an unpopular opinion, and I reach that conclusion for different reasons than wrfr886, i kind of agree with that sentiment....i'll explain below....

...the central issue: i forget if i saw it here or on r/gmrs, but it was stated by a repeater owner that they had configured their repeater with split tones with the intent to keep midland users off their repeater. while that's absolutely their right as the owner, it's hard not to see that as a form of elitism, be it directed toward the equipment, or at beginners.

 

I think you may be missing a few things...

1. You quote 1 repeater operator, and then use that as a basis for deciding some policy is elitist.
2. Repeater owners do not need to use technical specifications to limit who can use their repeater, then can decide on any (legal) basis they want​. (I.e. they probably can't discriminate based on race, religion, etc.) But, even that is questionable since a private repeater is like a private club and not normally subject to such legal restrictions.
3. It is quite possible that the base issue was narrow-band vs wide-band. In which case adding configuration settings to restrict the offending radios would be warranted.

In other words, as Groucho Marx said "...I don’t care to belong to any club that will have me as a member".