Time to ask for some selection/advise help from those that know

[jas]

Hi All,

 

I have never been afraid to ask for help. I learn a lot quicker that way!  So, I've decided to get my Ham Tech ticket. I have the books, and going through them now.  Lot's to learn but not really a big deal because this is not work, it's fun!

 

And for relaxation, I'm already looking at radios. I want to go strictly HT at first and see how it goes. So that's what I need help with. The choices are so vast compared to GMRS it is almost too much. Features are all over the map as well. I need help! It would go a lot easier if someone guided me through all the must have options and such, so I'm asking

 

I've been reading about the HTs and price being no object I've kind of zeroed on the Yaesu VX-6R. It's  an older radio, and not one of the new fangled touch screen digital capable radios. It seems to have an excellent reputation. It's kind of expensive considering an extra battery and programing cable and software. Still, I always say buy once and save lots of money. The other alternative would be a digital capable radio, maybe something like the Yaesu FT-3DR. Even more expensive but with all the bells, etc. I'm not sold on the idea of a touch screen though. I'm terrible at touch screens and they are impossible to use when driving. I can do keys by touch/feel and not take my eyes of the road. Not so with touch screens. Call me old school.

 

I'm very much open to all suggestions. 

 

All the Best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

 

 

[axorlov]

The answer will depends on what do you want to do with Ham HT. If to talk on repeaters any HT will be good, and if to talk only on UHF repeaters, many of Part 95A radios will tune to 70cm band. If you are into camping-hunting-kayaking and want to talk to your Ham buddies, this is where VX-6R shines being waterproof and sturdy. Any digital activity in your area, DMR or D-Star or Yaesu's System Fusion? If you are interested in any, that narrows down the choice. The Cadillac of Ham HT's (when money no object) Kenwood TH-D74 is discontinued, thanks to fire on the component factory and pandemic. But they will come up with something along the lines of D74 real quick.

 

I have Yaesu FT-1XD, the predecessor of -3DR. Very complicated in operation comparing to foolproof Kenwood TK3170. But smaller and lighter. I've got it because I wanted APRS, this is the feature I use. Looking back and choosing between FT-1XD(-2DR, -3DR) and Kenwood TH-D72(-D74) I would still chose Yaesu because of its smaller and sturdier built and water resistance. On the other hand, Kenwood has packet modem, and can be used for Winlink, while with Yaesu is not that simple at all. And these Yaesu menus are killing me, even though I seem to remember them now without needing the cheat sheet. Choises, choices....

[BoxCar]

I have the FT-4XR on order. Universal Radio has the best prices.

[jas]

The answer will depends on what do you want to do with Ham HT. If to talk on repeaters any HT will be good, and if to talk only on UHF repeaters, many of Part 95A radios will tune to 70cm band. If you are into camping-hunting-kayaking and want to talk to your Ham buddies, this is where VX-6R shines being waterproof and sturdy. Any digital activity in your area, DMR or D-Star or Yaesu's System Fusion? If you are interested in any, that narrows down the choice. The Cadillac of Ham HT's (when money no object) Kenwood TH-D74 is discontinued, thanks to fire on the component factory and pandemic. But they will come up with something along the lines of D74 real quick.

 

I have Yaesu FT-1XD, the predecessor of -3DR. Very complicated in operation comparing to foolproof Kenwood TK3170. But smaller and lighter. I've got it because I wanted APRS, this is the feature I use. Looking back and choosing between FT-1XD(-2DR, -3DR) and Kenwood TH-D72(-D74) I would still chose Yaesu because of its smaller and sturdier built and water resistance. On the other hand, Kenwood has packet modem, and can be used for Winlink, while with Yaesu is not that simple at all. And these Yaesu menus are killing me, even though I seem to remember them now without needing the cheat sheet. Choises, choices....

 

Axorlov,

 

Thank you so much for your quick reply, greatly appreciated.  My interests in radios goes a long ways back - 1960's and '70s, Mostly on sport fishing boats using AM and SSB radios.

 

To answer your question on the Ham HT use - I'll try to keep it short. My primary use is SHTF get out of the town, leave the house, probably not see it ever again, and drive. Been there 4 times already. NOT FUN! GMRS is a critical part of the get out of town thing - convoy comms, and that wont change. The problem is getting information when all the normal comms are down - been there more than once. GMRS is not enough though. I need HAM on wheels and I lease vehicles, so I cant drill holes and permanently mount radios. That's the short story. The longer story is below my signature if you're interested.

 

Secondary use starts with the fact that I loved radio since the first time I used them in the '60s. Nothing like talking to someone with PPT 100+ miles away on SSB while fishing 20 miles out for blue marlin. It was magical. So, I would still like to hook up to repeaters and talk to strangers. Lots and lots of HAM repeaters in my county. GMRS is not that.

 

Is there any new information on when Kenwood  will have a replacement for the TH-D74? Ever year, if history holds true, I have a 20% chance I will have to leave my home. On the radios, I realize nothing ever stays the same, except for one thing - If you can get on the air, analog, someone should be able to hear you. Digital might be more efficient clearer and such. If that's the way of the future I would like to keep both options open. I believe the Yaesu VX-6R does have some DMR capability, although I'm not 100% sure.

 

Thanks!

 

All the Best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

 

The Long Story:

 

I live in Pinellas county FL, on an Island. When the wind blows, and it really blows down here, it's SHTF, pack up and get out of town.  First it was Elena. Much later it was Charlie.

 

Elena in the '80s. Sheriff knocked on our door at 1:00 am and told us to leave NOW. Although my boat was in the water we left for Sebring, FL. Spent two days there with the ceiling rattling. Then we got back with no issues.

 

Second time: GMRS is what I chose to use after the Hurricane Charlie debacle. Wife, two very young kids, two vehicles, 11 hours to drive to Orlando, normally a two hour drive. If that was bad what came next sealed the deal. Charlie went through the center of the FL peninsula hitting our hotel in Orlando. We left the next morning and decided that going back on I4 was not an option. Big mistake (no comms about road closures). We went back on surface roads south so we could then cut West and avoid the I4 100,000+ evacuee vehicle parking lot. 

 

We must have driven over hundreds of downed power lines, avoiding downed trees and telephone poles. As we drove, we had no comms whatsoever. Power was down everywhere, no cell phones, no gas stations, no GPS (always have a paper map), no comms between vehicles. Then a squall went through and my wife and I got separated. And she was already low on fuel. By sheer luck, and after going past three of the roads that led west to our home, which had damage or were blocked, with no sign of my wife, I stopped at was the remains of a gas station where people had gathered to figure out what to do next, and 15 minutes later my wife drove by saw my truck and stopped. Whew! She was really frazzled, to say the least.

 

A highway patrol officer stopped told us that there was a road open 20 miles further south. With very little gas in my wife's van we made it there and were able to head West. About 40 minutes of driving after that the cell phones got back to life. Electricity was on and we were able to fuel her van. Got home 14 hours after we left Orlando.

 

I love my family and felt so helpless without comms. It was awful.  Sooo, I went GMRS and have used them ever since. Still, it is not an option for listening to reports of closed roads, other emergency related stuff etc....... So I want a HAM HT as well.

[axorlov]

Tough stuff! My past summer troubles on the outskirts of SF Bay Area during the fires, 5 days without the power, is a children camping expedition in the backyard, comparing to your story.

Anyway, after reading it, if it was me, I'd focus on better car-to-car-to-home-to-pedestrian system. GMRS gives you an option to run 50W with your family covered by one license. With antennas on the roofs of the vans/SUVs/cars, that's a lot of distance even in flat Florida. If I understand correctly, when hurricane is at full force, the crummy Ham antennas go down much sooner than commercial LMR installations. I would not put much hope into Ham during disaster. And certainly not into the Ham repeaters. I'm aware of ARES, and I saw (listened) to them few times, and my take out of it - they are not here to help the Precious Me, specifically. I'd forget them altogether and focus on what I can control: the reliable comm family system with trained participants.

 

Actually, this is exactly what I did some years ago - we have 40W mobiles in our cars and at home, everybody is trained to use mobiles and HTs (because we use them all the time when outdoors camping, hiking, etc), everybody is aware about Radio-3-3-3 protocol, the quick reference cards are in every car, the buttons and channels are programmed in the same way on mobiles and HTs. And there is a dedicated "home channel" programmed to the same "B" button on mobiles and HTs: the frequency+DPL, and there is also a reserve frequency. And there is a contingency plan. We live in Livermore, and both me and my wife commute to Silicon Valley proper, across the mountain ridge. So, should "the Big One" hit, everybody knows that it would take me 48 hrs MAX to get home on foot. If neither me, nor mom at home after that, the youngsters are on their own.

[jas]

..........

 

Actually, this is exactly what I did some years ago - we have 40W mobiles in our cars and at home, everybody is trained to use mobiles and HTs (because we use them all the time when outdoors camping, hiking, etc), everybody is aware about Radio-3-3-3 protocol, the quick reference cards are in every car, the buttons and channels are programmed in the same way on mobiles and HTs. And there is a dedicated "home channel" programmed to the same "B" button on mobiles and HTs: the frequency+DPL, and there is also a reserve frequency. And there is a contingency plan. We live in Livermore, and both me and my wife commute to Silicon Valley proper, across the mountain ridge. So, should "the Big One" hit, everybody knows that it would take me 48 hrs MAX to get home on foot. If neither me, nor mom at home after that, the youngsters are on their own.

 

Wow!  I've seen those fires out west on TV and that is some serious stuff! Hopefully you wont see the big shake in your lifetime either!

 

I agree with you about GMRS and will follow your advice on mobiles. I already have an MXT275 in my SUV. Had to get that one because of leasing (No holes). I keep it under the seat and use a magnetic mount on the roof.  When I'm in the clear I can open a repeater that has a 500 ft antenna with no issues from about 28 miles. I will be installing another one of those in my wife's SUV as well.  We will still have the GMRS HTs as backups for if we have to abandon the vehicles.

 

I find going to a  HAM HT gives me important options: I can listen on three different bands. I believe listening is critical to getting good information, especially if you are forced to abandon your home. We live in evacuation zone A and are the first ones to go. With the HAM HT I will be able to listen to emergency broadcasts from CERT, ARES, etc. while also having GMRS comms for the family.

 

A bit off topic but fuel is absolutely critical. These days vehicle gas tanks are not big enough and so range in emergencies can become an issue because of congestion on roads. Add loss of electrical power and gas stations can't pump fuel. Been there and it ain't pretty.

 

Thanks Again,

 

JAS

WRKP245

[tweiss3]

Looking at your county (https://repeaterbook.com/repeaters/Display_SS.php?state_id=12&band=4&loc=%&call=%&use=%) you have only two digital modes available, DMR & D-Star.

 

DMR is available on used commercial equipment and plenty of ham options (Anytone, ConnectSystems, etc.).

D-Star is Icom & Kenwood radios

YSF (Yaesu System Fusion) is Yaesu only. 

 

If you want digital, you want to get equipment that is backed by your local repeaters. Personally, I'd look into DMR, only because its wide availability across the nation. When the hurricane hits, how far do you travel? If just inland FL, there are plenty of DMR repeaters around: https://repeaterbook.com/repeaters/feature_search.php?state_id=12&type=DMR including a linked DMR system in Tampa https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=8844 . If you are going further north, there is a very large linked system. I run DMR radios in my cars, Connect Systems CS800D, and use them mostly for analog, but DMR is nice when its late and nobody is on the analog repeaters. It's also a Part 90 commercial radio, for what its worth to you.

 

I would look at reputable radio shops like Universal Radio (RIP, but site is still in tact), DX Engineering, R&L Radio, Ham Radio Outlet. I would take a look reading reviews of the available radios online. I understand the challenges of not drilling, but you could certainly get a full power mobile rig in your car without drilling. The antenna could be mag mounted, or even trunk/hatch lip mounted a Comptenna, which I hear works well on the corner of a car/trunk. Then you could get 50W of power, but the radio will be suck to that car.

 

If you are concerned about keeping GMRS, keep in mind ham radios will not transmit on GMRS frequencies (or MURS). They are all locked out. Part 90 radios would be the closest you would get to compliance, without buying a really expensive dual deck mobile and expensive programming equipment to get Part 90/95 radios.

 

If you are still insistent on a portable radio, don't sleep on the Yaesu FT818. It is a portable base-like radio that will do 6W of power on all modes (FM, SSB, CW & Packet Digital) on 70cm, 2m, 6m and all of HF (10m-160m). As a technician, you have access to all of 6m and a portion of 10m SSB. One of the best features, with just the rubber ducky that comes in the box, you can use it on 2m, 70cm and 6m. Don't sleep on 6m.

 

There are a number of things to think about:

1) How much radio stuff are you going to take with you (either mounted in the car, or go bag of portables).

2) Power when on the go, batteries will wear out, how will you charge on the go.

3) Where do you usually evacuate, and what systems are in place there and on the way.

4) How much are you willing to spend?

5) How do you intend to keep GMRS in operation?

6) Do you plan on going beyond Tech to General or Extra?

 

I hope I didn't give you too much to think about, but I do hope I helped. I'd be happy to answer any of your additional questions too.

[jas]

I have the FT-4XR on order. Universal Radio has the best prices.

Just looked into it. Seems like a great radio at an Excellent price.

 

Thanks!

 

JAS

WRKP245

[Lscott]

Hi All,

 

I have never been afraid to ask for help. I learn a lot quicker that way!  So, I've decided to get my Ham Tech ticket. I have the books, and going through them now.  Lot's to learn but not really a big deal because this is not work, it's fun!

 

And for relaxation, I'm already looking at radios. I want to go strictly HT at first and see how it goes. So that's what I need help with. The choices are so vast compared to GMRS it is almost too much. Features are all over the map as well. I need help! It would go a lot easier if someone guided me through all the must have options and such, so I'm asking

 

I've been reading about the HTs and price being no object I've kind of zeroed on the Yaesu VX-6R. It's  an older radio, and not one of the new fangled touch screen digital capable radios. It seems to have an excellent reputation. It's kind of expensive considering an extra battery and programing cable and software. Still, I always say buy once and save lots of money. The other alternative would be a digital capable radio, maybe something like the Yaesu FT-3DR. Even more expensive but with all the bells, etc. I'm not sold on the idea of a touch screen though. I'm terrible at touch screens and they are impossible to use when driving. I can do keys by touch/feel and not take my eyes of the road. Not so with touch screens. Call me old school.

 

I'm very much open to all suggestions. 

 

All the Best,

 

JAS

WRKP245Try looking at the Kem

Try looking at the Kenwood TH-D74A if price is not a problem. I have one with the mods to open up the TX and RX ranges,

 

https://www.kenwood.com/usa/com/support/pdf/TH-D74A.pdf

 

I ordered mine from here and they will also do the MARS/CAP mod for you as an extra cost option.

 

https://www.hamradio.com/detail.cfm?pid=H0-015269

 

You might want to look around a bit for a better price. I paid $550 with no mods when I got it a while back.

[Lscott]

This is the mod to open up the RX and TX on the above radio.

 

https://radioaficion.com/cms/th-d74-modification-of-the-us-version/

[jas]

Looking at your county (https://repeaterbook.com/repeaters/Display_SS.php?state_id=12&band=4&loc=%&call=%&use=%) you have only two digital modes available, DMR & D-Star.

 

DMR is available on used commercial equipment and plenty of ham options (Anytone, ConnectSystems, etc.).

D-Star is Icom & Kenwood radios

YSF (Yaesu System Fusion) is Yaesu only. 

 

If you want digital, you want to get equipment that is backed by your local repeaters. Personally, I'd look into DMR, only because its wide availability across the nation. When the hurricane hits, how far do you travel? If just inland FL, there are plenty of DMR repeaters around: https://repeaterbook.com/repeaters/feature_search.php?state_id=12&type=DMR including a linked DMR system in Tampa https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=8844 . If you are going further north, there is a very large linked system. I run DMR radios in my cars, Connect Systems CS800D, and use them mostly for analog, but DMR is nice when its late and nobody is on the analog repeaters. It's also a Part 90 commercial radio, for what its worth to you.

 

I would look at reputable radio shops like Universal Radio (RIP, but site is still in tact), DX Engineering, R&L Radio, Ham Radio Outlet. I would take a look reading reviews of the available radios online. I understand the challenges of not drilling, but you could certainly get a full power mobile rig in your car without drilling. The antenna could be mag mounted, or even trunk/hatch lip mounted a Comptenna, which I hear works well on the corner of a car/trunk. Then you could get 50W of power, but the radio will be suck to that car.

 

If you are concerned about keeping GMRS, keep in mind ham radios will not transmit on GMRS frequencies (or MURS). They are all locked out. Part 90 radios would be the closest you would get to compliance, without buying a really expensive dual deck mobile and expensive programming equipment to get Part 90/95 radios.

 

If you are still insistent on a portable radio, don't sleep on the Yaesu FT818. It is a portable base-like radio that will do 6W of power on all modes (FM, SSB, CW & Packet Digital) on 70cm, 2m, 6m and all of HF (10m-160m). As a technician, you have access to all of 6m and a portion of 10m SSB. One of the best features, with just the rubber ducky that comes in the box, you can use it on 2m, 70cm and 6m. Don't sleep on 6m.

 

There are a number of things to think about:

1) How much radio stuff are you going to take with you (either mounted in the car, or go bag of portables).

2) Power when on the go, batteries will wear out, how will you charge on the go.

3) Where do you usually evacuate, and what systems are in place there and on the way.

4) How much are you willing to spend?

5) How do you intend to keep GMRS in operation?

6) Do you plan on going beyond Tech to General or Extra?

 

I hope I didn't give you too much to think about, but I do hope I helped. I'd be happy to answer any of your additional questions too.

Wow! Thanks so much, especially for looking at my county info.  You sure gave me enough to chew on for a while. Much appreciated. Extremely useful information. I had no idea  digital was that involved. It adds a whole other layer of functionality. That always comes with a lot more decision making though but I have the time to so I'm digging in.

 

My plan is to keep evolving GMRS for family evac comms but I also want to augment my capability with the addition of HAM radio.  Because of living in a zone A evacuation I need to make everything portable. And once in a safe place (hotel room probably) I want to be able to bring the radio inside with me,

 

More to study now - THANKS!

 

Best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

[Lscott]

If you are still insistent on a portable radio, don't sleep on the Yaesu FT818. It is a portable base-like radio that will do 6W of power on all modes (FM, SSB, CW & Packet Digital) on 70cm, 2m, 6m and all of HF (10m-160m). As a technician, you have access to all of 6m and a portion of 10m SSB. One of the best features, with just the rubber ducky that comes in the box, you can use it on 2m, 70cm and 6m. Don't sleep on 6m.

If the FT-818 has about the same output filter as the FT-817, I own the original version with the MARS/CAP mod, the power drops fast above the upper limit of the Ham 70cm band. Around 462 MHz it does about half power max, and at 467 MHz lucky to get 1 to 2 watts out of it at best if you are thinking about GMRS access for emergency comm's.

 

Also the radio won't tune above 154 MHz on VHF so even on RX you can't get any of the NOAA weather stations. The later seems to be a big complaint with even the unmodified radios since the market for is is QRP operation while camping, hiking etc.

[Lscott]

I was just thinking based on your story about getting out of the path of a hurricane and keeping track of everyone perhaps APRS would be the ticket. You can find info on it here.

 

Basically APRS uses a GPS receiver connected to a radio which will periodically, and automatically, transmit you current GPS position to any compatible radio in the area. This data can also be displayed on a map accessible on the internet so anybody can see your location if one or more of the RX'ing radios has an internet connection. Even if there is no internet access close by APRS can use special APRS digital repeaters to propagate the APRS packets over a very large area.

 

http://www.aprs.org/

 

Mapping.

 

https://aprs.fi/#!lat=42.6206&lng=-82.9608

[tweiss3]

If the FT-818 has about the same output filter as the FT-817, I own the original version with the MARS/CAP mod, the power drops fast above the upper limit of the Ham 70cm band. Around 462 MHz it does about half power max, and at 467 MHz lucky to get 1 to 2 watts out of it at best if you are thinking about GMRS access for emergency comm's.

 

Also the radio won't tune above 154 MHz on VHF so even on RX you can't get any of the NOAA weather stations. The later seems to be a big complaint with even the unmodified radios since the market for is is QRP operation while camping, hiking etc.

 

True. I have an 817, and its supposed to be MARS/CAP, but I haven't tried it. I was assuming he already has GMRS equipment, and this would be an additional unit. Besides, he will get better information on 14.325MHz during a hurricane than the NOAA weather (which he will likely have on his GMRS HT).

[tweiss3]

I was just thinking based on your story about getting out of the path of a hurricane and keeping track of everyone perhaps APRS would be the ticket. You can find info on it here.

 

Basically APRS uses a GPS receiver connected to a radio which will periodically, and automatically, transmit you current GPS position to any compatible radio in the area. This data can also be displayed on a map accessible on the internet so anybody can see your location if one or more of the RX'ing radios has an internet connection. Even if there is no internet access close by APRS can use special APRS digital repeaters to propagate the APRS packets over a very large area.

 

http://www.aprs.org/

 

Mapping.

 

https://aprs.fi/#!lat=42.6206&lng=-82.9608

 

APRS is a viable option with the few exceptions:

1) Need an active gateway to receive the signals during the entire trip.

2) Every radio must have a ham licensed operator, already stated is a problem

3) It does rely on the internet, could be spotty at times

4) Doesn't mean a lot to someone receiving if they don't know what they are looking at.

 

If APRS is desired, the Kenwood D74A is really good at APRS, I love mine. I'm still taking my 817 on vacation instead of the Kenwood.

[AdmiralCochrane]

Not to be a downer, but most SHTF ham use is fantasy.  It just doesn't work like TV and movies.

[jas]

Not to be a downer, but most SHTF ham use is fantasy.  It just doesn't work like TV and movies.

That's really an interesting statement. I'd be truly interested in knowing what you suggest as a better option for comms - seriously..... What do you suggest then? Not even licensed for HAM  yet so I'm all ears at this point - that would save me a lot of work and expense. In my case SHTF means hurricanes - Driving to get out of the way along with another 1 million evacuees. Afterwards, blocked roads, no electricity, no fuel, no cell phones, no internet, no home to go back to, etc.  Maybe your definition is different. Again, I'm all ears.

 

All the best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

[BoxCar]

Admiral Cochrane makes a very broad statement with nothing as background. While I'm in western NC I do know a little more about how the amateurs in Florida have setup some of their emergency communications network throughout the state. I know the Florida DOT has made space available on their radio towers for hams to install repeaters. Orange County has an active emergency management center that includes amateurs within the structure. I believe Pinellas also includes hams in their emergency ops center. The more times regional and state emergency operations are activated, the more agencies and groups are included to facilitate the flow of information both into the center and out to the affected areas and general public. I firmly believe you are on the correct path for the protection of not only your family, but those you come in contact with when evacuated. You will have a means of getting information in and out of wherever you are.

[jas]

An addendum....

 

Did not mention this before. The last time we had a SHTF episode was in August 2017. Again, we left and went to Orlando. And again the brunt of the hurricane winds went over us at the hotel. We were on the top floor and it was iffy for about 3-4 hours. The hotel sprung a roof leak and the lobby got quite a bit of water. The hotel was packed to the gills but luckily there was no power loss. We had a GMRS plan working so we had no comm issues between vehicles. No  issues there.

 

On the way back we had a long wait close to home. A large floating restaurant boat got loose from her moorings and ended up caught under the bridge leading to our home. Had to wait until the bridge was declared safe.

 

We had no comms to tell us about that beforehand, power outages were widespread and most cell towers were not working, The one's that worked were jammed up with comms. Sooo, we sat there for a couple of hours before we could get back to our home. By the way, the sheriff department wont let you in on the island unless you have  ID with your address on it. We got there and we had some minor roof damage and a lot of tree limbs to clear out. We had no power (that lasted for four days), no Internet, no cell phone, etc. We left the house (it was almost 90 degrees inside the house) and went to stay with relatives that had power, but no cell or internet, until the power came back for us. Still, we had no cell nor internet for a couple more days. I believe that with a HAM HT I could have at least kept track of what was going on.....

 

Attaching an image of Irma's track from the NHC. Our home is only 15 miles west from the center white dot. It was a close one!

 

All the best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

 

[jas]

Admiral Cochrane makes a very broad statement with nothing as background. While I'm in western NC I do know a little more about how the amateurs in Florida have setup some of their emergency communications network throughout the state. I know the Florida DOT has made space available on their radio towers for hams to install repeaters. Orange County has an active emergency management center that includes amateurs within the structure. I believe Pinellas also includes hams in their emergency ops center. The more times regional and state emergency operations are activated, the more agencies and groups are included to facilitate the flow of information both into the center and out to the affected areas and general public. I firmly believe you are on the correct path for the protection of not only your family, but those you come in contact with when evacuated. You will have a means of getting information in and out of wherever you are.

 

Thank you!  By they way I love your state. I try to go there often in October,usually to Asheville for some photography (I'll post an image below).

 

You are absolutely right about Florida. It's different down here. We get hit by Hurricanes rather often, so state and local governments have established programs to get information out to the folks, and amateur radio is a big part of it. That said, there is a lot of talk about DMR and such digital stuff, but when the comms go down, analog still wins the day...

 

Thanks again!

 

Best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

 

[Lscott]

APRS is a viable option with the few exceptions:

1) Need an active gateway to receive the signals during the entire trip.

2) Every radio must have a ham licensed operator, already stated is a problem

3) It does rely on the internet, could be spotty at times

4) Doesn't mean a lot to someone receiving if they don't know what they are looking at.

 

If APRS is desired, the Kenwood D74A is really good at APRS, I love mine. I'm still taking my 817 on vacation instead of the Kenwood.

All valid good points.

 

When I was running around the country doing service for a few years I also took my FT-817 with me. Tried to get hotel rooms up on the top floor where possible. Used a small camera tripod to support some VHF and UHF antennas. Made a few surprising contacts on 2M SSB that way. 

 

[tweiss3]

Not to be a downer, but most SHTF ham use is fantasy.  It just doesn't work like TV and movies.

I would happen to agree, though, part of his situation is a little different.

 

That's really an interesting statement. I'd be truly interested in knowing what you suggest as a better option for comms - seriously..... What do you suggest then? Not even licensed for HAM  yet so I'm all ears at this point - that would save me a lot of work and expense. In my case SHTF means hurricanes - Driving to get out of the way along with another 1 million evacuees. Afterwards, blocked roads, no electricity, no fuel, no cell phones, no internet, no home to go back to, etc.  Maybe your definition is different. Again, I'm all ears.

 

All the best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

Here is why I agree with his sentiment. In any SHTF situation, you cannot, and should not, rely on others yo udo not personally know. You can only rely on you and your party, and what you have prepared for.

 

You currently have a GMRS communication plan. GREAT!!! Do not deviate from that. I think its great, and it allows all family members, old or young, participate. I think you have a huge part hurdle figured out there. I say stick with it, unless you can get every member of your convoy licensed on ham (I really doubt it).

 

But here is the other point, and the reason I say still go for you ham license. Its not that hard to get tech, and even general is marginally more information to remember. In the event of evacuation, besides communication with your party, INFORMATION is the next most important thing. While you shouldn't count on other ham operators to save you, there listening may provide plenty of benefit. 

Listening to 146.52 and 446.00, as well as local repeaters can provide invaluable information from others evacuating. Beyond that, there is other information from emergency response that can be heard on HF:

14.325MHz USB and 7.268MHz LSB (main) for hurricane net information

3.815MHz LSB is marritime mobile/waterway net

3.950MHZ LSB (N. FL) & 3.945MHz LSB (S. FL) is the Caribbean Net

14.265MHz USB is Salvation Army Team Emergency Radio Network

 

Get the amateur radio license, expand your knowledge, and make a plan. Don't think you can make it up on the go.

 

Admiral Cochrane makes a very broad statement with nothing as background. While I'm in western NC I do know a little more about how the amateurs in Florida have setup some of their emergency communications network throughout the state. I know the Florida DOT has made space available on their radio towers for hams to install repeaters. Orange County has an active emergency management center that includes amateurs within the structure. I believe Pinellas also includes hams in their emergency ops center. The more times regional and state emergency operations are activated, the more agencies and groups are included to facilitate the flow of information both into the center and out to the affected areas and general public. I firmly believe you are on the correct path for the protection of not only your family, but those you come in contact with when evacuated. You will have a means of getting information in and out of wherever you are.

 

True. Like I said above, his situation is a bit different than the usual SHTF prepper, as his situation relies on evacuation, not bunker down and protect the family.

 

An addendum....

 

Did not mention this before. The last time we had a SHTF episode was in August 2017. Again, we left and went to Orlando. And again the brunt of the hurricane winds went over us at the hotel. We were on the top floor and it was iffy for about 3-4 hours. The hotel sprung a roof leak and the lobby got quite a bit of water. The hotel was packed to the gills but luckily there was no power loss. We had a GMRS plan working so we had no comm issues between vehicles. No  issues there.

 

On the way back we had a long wait close to home. A large floating restaurant boat got loose from her moorings and ended up caught under the bridge leading to our home. Had to wait until the bridge was declared safe.

 

We had no comms to tell us about that beforehand, power outages were widespread and most cell towers were not working, The one's that worked were jammed up with comms. Sooo, we sat there for a couple of hours before we could get back to our home. By the way, the sheriff department wont let you in on the island unless you have  ID with your address on it. We got there and we had some minor roof damage and a lot of tree limbs to clear out. We had no power (that lasted for four days), no Internet, no cell phone, etc. We left the house (it was almost 90 degrees inside the house) and went to stay with relatives that had power, but no cell or internet, until the power came back for us. Still, we had no cell nor internet for a couple more days. I believe that with a HAM HT I could have at least kept track of what was going on.....

 

Attaching an image of Irma's track from the NHC. Our home is only 15 miles west from the center white dot. It was a close one!

 

All the best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

 

 

See, your GMRS plan worked. Amateur radio can help expand that. Your last problem is power, as you noted. That is something you can work on improving.

 

Thank you!  By they way I love your state. I try to go there often in October,usually to Asheville for some photography (I'll post an image below).

 

You are absolutely right about Florida. It's different down here. We get hit by Hurricanes rather often, so state and local governments have established programs to get information out to the folks, and amateur radio is a big part of it. That said, there is a lot of talk about DMR and such digital stuff, but when the comms go down, analog still wins the day...

 

Thanks again!

 

Best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

 

The tail of the dragon. I must go back soon.

 

All valid good points.

 

When I was running around the country doing service for a few years I also took my FT-817 with me. Tried to get hotel rooms up on the top floor where possible. Used a small camera tripod to support some VHF and UHF antennas. Made a few surprising contacts on 2M SSB that way. 

 

I haven't yet traveled while licensed, but plan on changing that this summer, besides vacation, I'm planning on SOTA and PTOA activations this year.

[tweiss3]

So I will end with a few questions, then say what I would consider fully prepared (if it were me making the plans).

 

1) What is YOUR GMRS equipment? Are you on a HT, or a mobile with magmount? Which transceiver do you have? I ask because some of the dual watch and/or NOAA weather capabilities are in many now.

2) How do you handle the extended power outage with your radio equipment?

 

 

What would I do? This is a tough call, but is a mixture of equipment I already have, what I know of your area (and based on information available) and my understanding of hurricane evacuations. Do NOT take this as a list of what you must have, as obviously, you have more experience and history with these situations. Also, note, I have my General license and privileges. I would consider your preparations to be a continually shifting plan of attack.

 

1) First and foremost, as you probably have phased evacuation plans, make a written plan for each evacuation zone. If that means there are 3 different places you could evacuate to, research all three places (local radio systems, first responders systems, is GMRS available on local repeaters, what digital modes are used, etc.). You will never be able to get that information on the go, count on cell phones/internet to go down.

2) KEEP your current GMRS plan, improve when possible. A GMRS HT that can also listen to NOAA weather is helpful.

3) Install a 50W mobile dual band radio in the car, even if it means using a mag-mount antenna. This will double your communication capabilities. Me, I would just use my CS800D (DMR and Analog). In addition to my local repeater frequencies, I would have a zone of analog frequencies for each spot I could end up, plus each DMR repeater will have its own zone. I will also have 146.52 & 446.00 simplex in the radio as well.

4) FT-817 connected to mag mount CB antenna to listen to hurricane net. 817 will come inside with me when arriving, and I would have antennas for HF in addition to the rubber ducky that works on 2M/70cm/6m. I have two end fed half wave antenna (40m-10m & 80m-10m) plus a GRA-1899T telescoping vertical.

5) I would have a way to monitor local power company, police, ems, public works and DOT. This gets complicated, but I have a Uniden SDS100 scanner that would handle your area. It also has a GPS, so when evacuating, it could jump systems in the database to listen to the local PD when I would get into the area. I could expand more if you want in PM to not muck up this thread with scanner information, but based on your area:

   Duke Energy uses a 900MHz Moto Smartnet Type II trunking radio system

   Pinellas County has their own 800MHz P25 Phase 1 system

   FL has a statewide 800MHz EDACS system

   Other inland counties have 700/800MHz P25 or EDACS systems

All of these above systems can be scanned with a SDS100 or SDS200.

6) Keep car chargers and wall chargers for all radios in the radio back ready to go.

 

Again, thats just what I would do. It does seem overboard when I type it out, but then again, I do have all that equipment laying around, and absolutely does not mean you should go out and buy a bunch of stuff right now. I only posted it to get you thinking.

 

Again, study for the test, you should go for it.

[jas]

So I will end with a few questions, then say what I would consider fully prepared (if it were me making the plans).

 

1) What is YOUR GMRS equipment? Are you on a HT, or a mobile with magmount? Which transceiver do you have? I ask because some of the dual watch and/or NOAA weather capabilities are in many now.

2) How do you handle the extended power outage with your radio equipment?

 

 

What would I do? This is a tough call, but is a mixture of equipment I already have, what I know of your area (and based on information available) and my understanding of hurricane evacuations. Do NOT take this as a list of what you must have, as obviously, you have more experience and history with these situations. Also, note, I have my General license and privileges. I would consider your preparations to be a continually shifting plan of attack.

 

1) First and foremost, as you probably have phased evacuation plans, make a written plan for each evacuation zone. If that means there are 3 different places you could evacuate to, research all three places (local radio systems, first responders systems, is GMRS available on local repeaters, what digital modes are used, etc.). You will never be able to get that information on the go, count on cell phones/internet to go down.

2) KEEP your current GMRS plan, improve when possible. A GMRS HT that can also listen to NOAA weather is helpful.

3) Install a 50W mobile dual band radio in the car, even if it means using a mag-mount antenna. This will double your communication capabilities. Me, I would just use my CS800D (DMR and Analog). In addition to my local repeater frequencies, I would have a zone of analog frequencies for each spot I could end up, plus each DMR repeater will have its own zone. I will also have 146.52 & 446.00 simplex in the radio as well.

4) FT-817 connected to mag mount CB antenna to listen to hurricane net. 817 will come inside with me when arriving, and I would have antennas for HF in addition to the rubber ducky that works on 2M/70cm/6m. I have two end fed half wave antenna (40m-10m & 80m-10m) plus a GRA-1899T telescoping vertical.

5) I would have a way to monitor local power company, police, ems, public works and DOT. This gets complicated, but I have a Uniden SDS100 scanner that would handle your area. It also has a GPS, so when evacuating, it could jump systems in the database to listen to the local PD when I would get into the area. I could expand more if you want in PM to not muck up this thread with scanner information, but based on your area:

   Duke Energy uses a 900MHz Moto Smartnet Type II trunking radio system

   Pinellas County has their own 800MHz P25 Phase 1 system

   FL has a statewide 800MHz EDACS system

   Other inland counties have 700/800MHz P25 or EDACS systems

All of these above systems can be scanned with a SDS100 or SDS200.

6) Keep car chargers and wall chargers for all radios in the radio back ready to go.

 

Again, thats just what I would do. It does seem overboard when I type it out, but then again, I do have all that equipment laying around, and absolutely does not mean you should go out and buy a bunch of stuff right now. I only posted it to get you thinking.

 

Again, study for the test, you should go for it.

 

 

Super info!! Thanks so much. I printed your post  and threw it in my bug out bag

 

My long experience with Hurricanes has taught me a great deal.  First and foremost, although I am definitely safe at home in a CAT1 or minimal CAT2 I always get out of the way these days.  I stayed for a couple of CAT1s early on and after that, thanks but no thanks. We lost power on both, had nothing but a battery radio. One of the storms was a slow mover and lasted 24 hours!! Not fun at all....  So now I leave. I coined a saying: "When the going gets tough, the tough go on vacation"

 

Second, and a really important point is that these storms are finicky. That plus the way Florida sits geographically puts us right where these storms make their turn to the N and then back E. Those turns are completely unpredictable, all the way down to landfall. Charlie for example was coming straight for our home and in the last 3 hours made a wiggle to the east and missed our house by 100 miles! I unfortunately was 100 miles E away and it went right over us. There is really no way to get out of the way with 100% certainty unless you travel 500 miles...

 

Third, the storms are so large that the effects can be felt hundreds of miles away. So radios are CRITICAL. Like you mentioned and I agree, In these situations HAM is not for talking, it's for LISTENING. You are basically on your own and must rely on GMRS for family comms. It is that simple.

 

To answer your question, I already have an MXT275 in my vehicle. I'm planning on installing another in my wife's. The way leases work we need radios that have all the controls on the MIC. I am waiting on my wife's however because there are indications of a Midland 50 watt radio coming out with the same setup as the MXT275. I would be all over that one and pass my MXT275 over to my wife's vehicle.

 

There is always a chance of having to abandon a vehicle, God forbid both.  That's why we have GMRS HTs and why I want the HAM radio to be a HT as well. My vehicle has a 110 outlet and I plug all the chargers to it. If the vehicle runs I can charge everything from just that outlet. Plus it has 3 cigarette lighter plugs and I forget how many USB ports, a couple of those are fast chargers.

 

Thanks again for the info!!

 

All the best,

 

JAS

WRKP245

[n4gix]

Not to be a downer, but most SHTF ham use is fantasy.  It just doesn't work like TV and movies.

 

I disagree. That is too fatalistic. Should any such SHTF occur, you can be assured that I'll be roaming the HF bands calling CQ!  In any lesser event simplex communications doesn't require any infrastructure to be useful.