So what's the point?

[RedFive]

Hey all, I'll preface this by saying other than tuning in a music station I know diddly squat about radios.

I have a nagging question.  If GMRS radio is truly 'line of sight' and I have a tough time talking to someone 1/2 mile away due to trees, geography, buildings then what's the point of this all?  I know there is a point but I'm just not getting it.  If I need to 'see' the other person why wouldn't I just walk up to them and chat rather than using radios?

I want to be ready in the event I need to use my GMRS radios for an emergency but I'm getting the sense I know nothing of the power I yield in my hand.

Thanks!

 

[Guest]

Well gmrs is meant for family’s and friends while doing an activity like hiking, hunting,  off roading, road trips, farming, ranching  ect….   After that people starting using repeaters to extend range, have nets, emergency preparedness ect.  Gmrs works great for many many people for many different needs.   But for some, maybe like your self, it just won’t cut it.  Maybe you live in a hole with too many trees hill mountains buildings ect and it really just won’t work.  Maybe your area has no repeaters and you literally can’t talk more than 1/3 of a mile.  It does happen.   But maybe in some of these cases a better antenna, a base or mobile unit with more power and more antenna height might help out.  Or maybe not. Maybe you just need to move down the street 100 yards or go around a corner or fan a few feet in height.    You may need to put up a local repeater with some friends if you can find a hill, mountain or tower. 
 

if your one of the few where gmrs just will not work for you in your area ham may work better.   
 

 

[Davichko5650]

15 minutes ago, RedFive said:

Hey all, I'll preface this by saying other than tuning in a music station I know diddly squat about radios.

I have a nagging question.  If GMRS radio is truly 'line of sight' and I have a tough time talking to someone 1/2 mile away due to trees, geography, buildings then what's the point of this all?  I know there is a point but I'm just not getting it.  If I need to 'see' the other person why wouldn't I just walk up to them and chat rather than using radios?

I want to be ready in the event I need to use my GMRS radios for an emergency but I'm getting the sense I know nothing of the power I yield in my hand.

Thanks!

 

If you were engaged in  a task or activity where you are 1/2 mile from another person engaged in same, and needed to talk with them, but couldn't leave your location, you'd be hard pressed to yell loud enough to be heard.  Vehicle to vehicle comms are very much something GMRS is good at facilitating. As well as, in my case, not having to yell when working around the house/yard where I need something done but can't leave my location.  Sure I could use a cell phone, but the ease of pusing a PTT switch on a radio gets things done with less delay.

Many more examples are out there, but I'll leave it at this...

[Guest]

In the old days, we would walk next door to talk to our neighbor. A 5 minute walk, sometimes to find they were not at home. We were not bothered by this when it happened. Sure, we could use the phone but the phone was a luxury that was mostly reserved for adult activities. Getting caught flapping on the phone usually came with sanctions. Now days, we use a cellphone to talk to the person in the next room. Using a radio is kinda like walking over to your neighbor's house but still sitting on the couch. And you can "walk" to a neighbor's house that is 10 minutes by foot. If you are out camping, you can tell your kids to "check in" every 1/2 hour or so and hand them a watch. This has the effect of geofencing them as they can't get far and still meet the 1/2 hour check-in. A radio lets them "check in" without the walk and extends their range of exploring and what ever. It also lets them function autonomously and interact with one another when they want. "Line of sight" is a term that is used to control expectation not a hard condition. If you are truly in line of sight with a person, and not in an area with background noise, you can likely yell at them and be understood. The radio makes this easier on your neck bones

GMRS is not a replacement for anything, it's an additional tool to be used when acting as a group. In the event of an emergency, there has to be someone ready at the other end. If your 10-minute neighbor lives on the other side of the local creek, then you have a real tool in the event of a weather generated disaster. The creek washes out the bridge and the cellphones are out and your landline used the poles along side that same bridge... all now down stream somewhere, the GMRS radio becomes something very useful. Sure repeaters are a "thing" but unless you are routinely using them, buying a GMRS radio and dropping it into a desk drawer next to your Glock is not a "ready" situation.

 

[SteveShannon]

7 minutes ago, RedFive said:

Hey all, I'll preface this by saying other than tuning in a music station I know diddly squat about radios.

I have a nagging question.  If GMRS radio is truly 'line of sight' and I have a tough time talking to someone 1/2 mile away due to trees, geography, buildings then what's the point of this all?  I know there is a point but I'm just not getting it.  If I need to 'see' the other person why wouldn't I just walk up to them and chat rather than using radios?

I want to be ready in the event I need to use my GMRS radios for an emergency but I'm getting the sense I know nothing of the power I yield in my hand.

Thanks!

 

You don’t need to see them. Line of sight means that UHF radio waves travel in a mostly straight line. Lower frequencies frequently bounce off layers of the atmosphere; UHF cannot be relied upon to do that. It pierces through the atmosphere and travels farther without attenuating. Hams use VHF and UHF to communicate to the space station or to bounce signals off the moon. Nor does UHF follow the curvature of the Earth. 
A half mile is seldom the outer limit, but under certain circumstances it might be. On the other hand many of us frequently enjoy ranges of several or even many miles.
Most people get GMRS radios for communications while they’re doing other things, like hiking, fishing, off roading, or recovering rockets out in the wide open spaces. 
 

[RedFive]

1 hour ago, Socalgmrs said:

Well gmrs is meant for family’s and friends while doing an activity like hiking, hunting,  off roading, road trips, farming, ranching  ect….   After that people starting using repeaters to extend range, have nets, emergency preparedness ect.  Gmrs works great for many many people for many different needs.   But for some, maybe like your self, it just won’t cut it.  Maybe you live in a hole with too many trees hill mountains buildings ect and it really just won’t work.  Maybe your area has no repeaters and you literally can’t talk more than 1/3 of a mile.  It does happen.   But maybe in some of these cases a better antenna, a base or mobile unit with more power and more antenna height might help out.  Or maybe not. Maybe you just need to move down the street 100 yards or go around a corner or fan a few feet in height.    You may need to put up a local repeater with some friends if you can find a hill, mountain or tower. 
 

if your one of the few where gmrs just will not work for you in your area ham may work better.   
 

 

Yep, I'm in Texas hill country and wedged inside the coverage gap between two local repeaters.  

[WQAI363]

1 hour ago, RedFive said:

Hey all, I'll preface this by saying other than tuning in a music station I know diddly squat about radios.

I have a nagging question.  If GMRS radio is truly 'line of sight' and I have a tough time talking to someone 1/2 mile away due to trees, geography, buildings then what's the point of this all?  I know there is a point but I'm just not getting it.  If I need to 'see' the other person why wouldn't I just walk up to them and chat rather than using radios?

I want to be ready in the event I need to use my GMRS radios for an emergency but I'm getting the sense I know nothing of the power I yield in my hand.

Thanks!

 

I could try to suggest something to you, but I don't want to confuse anymore then you already are. Although, if you're using them Blister Pack Radios, that's part of your problem.

 

 

[AdmiralCochrane]

I made a 12 mile simplex (radio to radio) contact yesterday.  I could clearly recognize my friend's voice.

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, WQAI363 said:

I could try to suggest something to you, but I don't want to confuse anymore then you already are. Although, if you're using them Blister Pack Radios, that's part of your problem.

 

 

Yup. It would be good to know what radios you’re using? 

 

12 minutes ago, AdmiralCochrane said:

I made a 12 mile simplex (radio to radio) contact yesterday.  I could clearly recognize my friend's voice.

that’s not bad at all.  .  I’m so spoiled I can do 50-60 miles simplex on hts just because of my area. But 12miles is better then most people I talk to. 
 

 

[DONE]

Many here have stated what GMRS was actually setup to do.  Provide extended family and small group communications beyond what the FRS service could.  It was a medium power service that allowed fixed stations (base setups with elevated antennas) and repeaters for the extension.  That is what is was originally for.  And the rules and regulations pretty much bear that out.

But that's not what it has turned into.

I will preface this with the fact that 3 days ago I renewed my ham license for the 3rd time.  That is a 10 year license, so I have been involved with ham radio since 1994, so 30 years at this point.   And ham radio wasn't ever really to be a social gathering place.  It was for the furtherment of communications through experimentation and to build a pool of qualified electronics technicians that could provide support for technology in the future.  Of course, ham radio isn't that any more either.

 

But, GMRS is now a conduit for social interaction.  This was once done with CB radio.  A great many people had radios and they communicated throughout their community with other individuals in a social manner.  AKA they would get on the radio and BS back and forth.  It wasn't for building RF techs, radio nerds, or specifically for emergency communications.  But ANY radio service can be used for EMCOMM.  It's just going to be limited by the regulations and equipment available for that service.   But GMRS is now a gathering place for folks to chat with each other via voice communications.  My guess is that COVID may have sparked renewed interest in having a reliable conduit for communications that didn't require face to face interactions and was always readily available.  I wasn't personally involved with GMRS during COVID.  But I have since done testing and continue to test coverage and gather radios for deployment for family so that the path of communications can't be easily severed.  My repeater site will soon have alternative 'off grid' power in addition to the current grid, battery and generator power that is in place and functioning.  Single 'car' batteries with a single 100 watt solar cell and charge controller will maintain power and limited light for family members during a disaster situation so we can check in with each other and maintain some sense of normal during an abnormal situation.  But again, that's not what it was really for.  It just lends itself to that function.  But in the end, it still is a conduit for social interaction.  And that is a good thing. 

 

[808Beachbum]

12 hours ago, RedFive said:

Hey all, I'll preface this by saying other than tuning in a music station I know diddly squat about radios.

I have a nagging question.  If GMRS radio is truly 'line of sight' and I have a tough time talking to someone 1/2 mile away due to trees, geography, buildings then what's the point of this all?  I know there is a point but I'm just not getting it.  If I need to 'see' the other person why wouldn't I just walk up to them and chat rather than using radios?

I want to be ready in the event I need to use my GMRS radios for an emergency but I'm getting the sense I know nothing of the power I yield in my hand.

Thanks!

 

 

Your best bet is to find a local radio club (amateur or GMRS, regardless of what type of radio you THINK you want), then attend a meeting or two, meet some active members, ask questions, ask for demos, ask for advice specific to your area with regard to what bands/freqs are most used in the region; available repeaters and amount of "traffic" (radio comms). Most clubs allow non-members to attend, and are more than happy to share their knowledge. These same clubs are usually involved with coordinated EMCOMMS with local agencies, providing simulated exercises and practice of their protocols so those that participate know what the heck to do when actual SHTF. Once you learn more about local reality, THEN you can decide what you want to pursue, and what you want to spend money on.

Having said all that, "line of sight" is not as, ahem, clear cut as you might think. I'm dealing with highrise buildings in an urban area with mountains (actually little more than pointy hills) and difficult terrain, yet with some actual testing with a buddy, I have pretty decent capabilities out to about 2.5 - 3 miles in general. GMRS is NOT a "social gathering place" in a lot of areas, so a lot of people get discouraged when no one responds. GMRS is also NOT for hobbyists/experimenters that want to try new methods, as it has severe restrictions of band usage and types of transmissions. The Amateur (ham) bands are where there is a lot of contesting, long distance random contacts, multiple modes (including multiple digital modes which simplify long distance contact by combining RF with internet linking of repeaters/reflectors), and lots of regular "nets" where you can check in, test your equipment, and interact with others on a more or less regular basis. There are FAR more bands and unlimited freqs within those bands (based on actual local band plans), vs maximum of 30 specific channels on GMRS which are shared among all within range.

 

[nokones]

17 hours ago, RedFive said:

Hey all, I'll preface this by saying other than tuning in a music station I know diddly squat about radios.

I have a nagging question.  If GMRS radio is truly 'line of sight' and I have a tough time talking to someone 1/2 mile away due to trees, geography, buildings then what's the point of this all?  I know there is a point but I'm just not getting it.  If I need to 'see' the other person why wouldn't I just walk up to them and chat rather than using radios?

I want to be ready in the event I need to use my GMRS radios for an emergency but I'm getting the sense I know nothing of the power I yield in my hand.

Thanks!

 

If you have any emergency who are you going to call? 

If the brown smelly stuff hits the fan, everybody else will also have the same emergency and everyone else will be trying to transmit at the same time and hopefully you know what happens when more than one person tries to key up when someone else is keying. There will be a gazillion people keying at the same and they won't care if you're transmitting or not and they will not be polite and ask for a break. It will be a total radio chaos and you won't be communicating with anyone.

Public Safety Agencies have the same problem when an extreme life & death emergency happens, but most public safety radio systems these days have a feature to prevent more than one transmitter being keyed at the same time and jamming up the frequency. Also, public safety agencies usually have training for those situations and strict radio discipline.  GMRS user don't have that training or any radio discipline for during emergencies.

It would be best for you to have other contingency plans during those emergencies, the 9-1-1 and GMRS systems will not be the solution during those times for you. The GMRS is not an emergency radio system, but it "may" be a system for communication to use when the emergency subsides.

[WRXB215]

@nokones expressed it well. After hurricane Beryl, the only coms I had for a few days was GMRS and ham radio which worked very well. But that was NOT an SHFT situation and there were repeaters that were still available. Under a real SHFT, radios may not be as useful as we would like.

[WQAI363]

21 hours ago, Socalgmrs said:

Yup. It would be good to know what radios you’re using? 

 

that’s not bad at all.  .  I’m so spoiled I can do 50-60 miles simplex on hts just because of my area. But 12miles is better then most people I talk to. 
 

 

The antenna really makes the difference, especially when you're using simplex channels instead of using a repeater. Of course, you still have issues of not hitting a repeater, but that's not as problem as radio to radio.

[marcspaz]

Give this a watch. It's about an hour, but many people have found it helpful. 

 

https://youtu.be/1rZ_oWdls-E?si=Kjnqac1q3oqPvj0i