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I live in a port town. For my entire life I have driven past a marine electronics store. Not needing "marine" electronics (radar, sonar, gps and its predecessor LORAN, and of course radios). I never had a need to visit. But as it turns out the store carries all sorts of GMTS, FRS and HAM equipment. And not just for boats. i called yesterday and found out that not only do they have probably everything you find all your needs met in one place. Plus and more importantly, they are more than to share decades of knowledge and experience. Heading down tomorrow with a list of needfuls and more importantly a list of questions.

I think the FCC said it best… In addition to violating Commission rules, linking repeaters is not in the public interest. Because GMRS spectrum is limited and used on a shared “commons” basis, the service only works well on a localized basis when users can hear each other and cooperate in the sharing of channels. Linking repeaters not only increases the potential for interference, but also uses up a limited spectrum resource over much larger areas than intended, limiting localized availability of the repeater channels. GMRS and the Family Radio Service (FRS), which share many of the GMRS channels, are intended for individuals such as family members and friends, scouting troops, emergency response groups, and hobbyists to communicate with each other over short distances, directly or through a repeater station. Linking repeaters, via the internet or other networks, undermines the purpose and usefulness of the GMRS and FRS.

Yep, that's why Midland is a good choice. Glad we agree.

Hi Stanley, Before you buy another radio, make sure you exhaust the possible solutions. There are at least three different technical possibilities for why people using the repeater didn’t acknowledge you: 1. You might have been on the wrong channel. Channels 15-22 are for talking directly to other radio users. On the Trailblazer 450 the repeater channels are named 15RP - 22RP. You can hear repeaters on either group of channels but you can only transmit to a repeater on the repeater channels. 2. Nearly every repeater uses tones or digital signals to prevent accidental interruptions. The tones are called PL, or CTCSS, or something similar. Digital signals (codes) are called DCS or DPL. If you have no receive tones set you hear everything. If you have the wrong transmit tone or no transmit tone set, the repeater will automatically ignore you. Nobody will hear you in that case. 3. Finally, you mentioned power output. It’s possible your radio isn’t reaching the repeater. Try getting closer. Welcome to the forum!

Dang nab it, i used up all my reactions on this post.

This was sent to the FCC for clarification to start the conversation. POC GMRS rule clarification, The rules and definitions pertaining to utilizing digital to analog FM technologies are not real clear and I am seeking clarification regarding the following scenario. Utilizing POC (Push to talk over cellular) data radios bridged to an analog GMRS repeater. The POC’s do not fall into the definition of network, linking, Clear Communications or real time communications as defined by the FCC. There are multiple questions regarding this, and I hope to lay them all out to the best of my ability get the best clarification I can. The scenario would be users utilizing a POC radio with a license validated group meaning that users in that group hold a valid GMRS license, the users would access a dedicated server through digital means, not a phone system as currently specified and defined by the FCC. Once the signal reaches the bridge a conversion takes place from digital communications to analog FM just as a standard radio accessing the repeater would. The bridge, a radio would be under physical control and not operated remotely. One of the questions that needs clarification is, what is the point of “Clear Communications”, is it the point that the data stream is initiated or the point that the conversion from digital to analog FM takes place. This I feel is crucial point of the transmit chain since “Clear Communication” does not take place until conversion to FM happens and vice versa. The way I understand “Clear Communications” is for example FM to FM not digital to FM it would be unintelligible. I would also like to note in part 47 points out that GMRS or FRS devices ARE authorized to transmit data to include location and “Text Messages” essentially creating a digital network if there is more than one device. This creates confusion when part 47 states no network connections are allowed on GMRS systems or repeaters. Outside mesh networks could decipher and decode the digital location or text message essentially expanding the network between the two devices. A ruling clarification has already been rendered on linking multiple GMRS repeaters, this is not applicable since there is no repeater linking or additional spectrum use either from the end user or repeater associated with this approach. I would also like to point out that only licensed users in the designated community would have access to the system, meaning that NOT anyone with a POC radio would be able to access the Repeater as in a linked repeater scenario. According to the following rules: § 95.1749 GMRS network connection. Operation of a GMRS station with a telephone connection is prohibited, as in § 95.349. GMRS repeater, base and fixed stations, however, may be connected to the public switched network or other networks for the sole purpose of operation by remote control pursuant to § 95.1745. § 95.1731 Permissible GMRS uses. The operator of a GMRS station may use that station for two-way plain language voice communications with other GMRS stations and with FRS units concerning personal or business activities. (d) Digital data. GMRS hand-held portable units may transmit digital data containing location information, or request location information from one or more other GMRS or FRS units, or containing a brief text message to another specific GMRS or FRS unit 95.1733 Prohibited GMRS uses. (8) Messages which are both conveyed by a wireline control link and transmitted by a GMRS station; This brings into definition what is the legal definition of a network and at what point does clear communications take place. The FCC does not explicitly define "network" in a single, clear statement, but based on its regulations and interpretations, a network is generally understood as a system of interconnected communication points, like radio stations, television channels, or internet service providers, that can transmit signals or data across a large area, falling under the FCC's jurisdiction for regulating interstate and international communications via radio, television, wire, satellite, and cable. The follow up definition would be the definition of interconnectivity by the FCC. The Federal Communications Commission (FCC) defines "interconnected VoIP service" as a service that allows users to make and receive calls to the public switched telephone network (PSTN). Interconnected VoIP services use Voice over Internet Protocol (VoIP) technology. According to this definition a direct example of VOIP was given which clearly states switched telephone network and I present no contest on this, but by mere definition this does not apply to a POC bridge to a GMRS repeater. The POC is digital stream, controlled by a closed server which directs a digital stream to a bridge device facilitating the conversion to FM. Just to point out another perspective on network, would the GMRS repeater with the users not also be considered a network or defined as such? Although the broad definition of network could be applied to a POC radio system, I believe that at the point of conversion utilizing the “Clear Communications” principal when the conversion and transmission to the repeater takes place it would be no different than a local user accessing the system as intended and does not apply. The possibilities this system brings to communities utilizing a GMRS repeater are multifold coupling utility with safety and maintaining the integrity of the allocated frequency spectrum. The antiquated approach to GMRS management is falling short of market technologies and advancements in communication. I am grateful for your time and counsel on this I look forward to hearing from you. Frank Sellers CEO/President Cogent Radios Group +1.931.208.0484 Submit Help Request Your request for support has been received at 2025-03-11 15:57:27. FCC Support will contact you within the next 3 business days. You may track your support request online using the tracking number below. Please print or save this number! Tracking Number: HD0001478045

I look forward to hearing what you discover. Although the technology is interesting I think it will be turned down for the most basic reason: You’re connecting a GMRS repeater to a network, which means you are carrying GMRS communications on a network which is prohibited by the FCC interpretation of the rules. Here’s their interpretation: GMRS stations cannot be interconnected with the public switched telephone network or any other network for the purpose of carrying GMRS communications, but these networks can be used for remote control of repeater stations.

Am I the only GMRS user who is kinda frustrated with linked repeaters on gmrs frequencies. The more I’m using gmrs the more I’m realizing the frequency allocations for it just doesn’t leave enough space for linking on this service.

Not me, I ain't skeered of nothin', I'm married. While I'd like to see the OP edited to make sense, from what I can squeeze out of it, I think you're right. We do the same thing to encourage kids in amateur radio. During Field Day, we act as "Control Operators" and encourage kids to make contacts, which unfailingly delights them. We also work with the Boy Scouts and help them earn their "Electronics" badges by virtue of letting them use our radios and making it a point to be available during their activity days so they can make successful contacts.

Especially since RT Systems does NOT even have a program for the KG-905G.

I said it like that because I am not convinced that the regulations support this interpretation. But I suspect it would be very expensive to fight them.

Right, so the initial transmission is active on a digital fabric through an isolated server frame then relayed to a bridge where it is transmitted to the repeater in analog FM. Yes the transmitter is type accepted, a Hytera MN360. That's the point of establishing what the FCC defines as "Real Time Communications". So the bridge is under my direct control and not remote and does not go through a phone system. I will be writing up a request for clarification this week and forwarding it to the FCC . Its going to take me a week to just cover the definitions and applicability. Once I hear back I will share the request and findings with everyone. If I am wrong then I am wrong and will comply but under part 47 rules I really do not think I am. Even the definition of remote would not apply if I have physical control over the bridge.

Please go read the Law. Its clear you cant operate on digital modes on GMRS. Its clear you cant connect GMRS to another network for comms. I don't need an attorney to take it to court to show its illegal, its written in the law. This horse is dead. If you don't want to read the law or are looking for bits and pieces to justify what you want to do, go hire an attorney for a few hundred to review it and give you a legal opinion. Or do it anyway and end up on the FCC enforcement radar and risk it. Telling people what your doing and selling them a product or service that is not legal opens you up to liability. Hire an attorney and get a legal opinion from them.

OK Cogent, I'll call your bluff. What law firm are you using as an advisor for interpretation of the FCC's rules and Part 97 regulations? If you don't have an attorney of record providing regulatory guidance who has worked with the Wireless Telecommunications Bureau on the feasibility of this proposal, then it is nothing but a pipe dream borne from a desire to increase division revenues.

I don't believe the 905G will do the announce for the channels, my Baofeng will but the Wouxun doesn't. There is a voice option #11 I believe that will give you voice prompts for the menu items but it doesn't do so for the channels. Also no support for the 905G from RT Systems, the 935G yes but not the 905G.

I like to Write down the channels I want to add in Excel and group them accordingly (for future export/import and other radios code plugs) Keep space between Categories of Channels for ease of growth later!

I thought I read somewhere in the FCC Rules, "Thow shalt not speak in code"

LOL, I prefer to think of it as dry humor with some sarcasm added in to keep people from taking themselves to serious.

Hi, I'm Jackie. I've been a radio fan for years and have listened to scanners, shortwave and utility radio. I've also been an amateur radio operator for over 20 years but off the air for a good portion of that time due to antenna and space restrictions. I just got my GMRS license a couple of months ago; I thought it would be a good idea to add one more communication method to my collection. I can't have an outdoor antenna of any kind where I live so I'm using some handheld radios at the moment.

It kind of depends on your needs. I would say that a 10-watt radio will be sufficient for most situations, but if you're looking to cover greater distances, a 50-watt radio would be the best option. You don't necessarily need to spend a lot on a 50-watt radio; you can get a Baofeng GMRS version for around $20. It works well indoors or in a car, but using an outside antenna will improve its performance significantly.

1. What was the purpose of establishing a worldwide repeater system when other countries do not have GMRS? 2. GMRS has only a few repeater frequencies. If all the repeaters in the United States operate on the same frequency, it will lead to interference, including with some rescue repeaters.

This makes sense. Thanks for the tip. It surprises me I never considered this as my father used to commercial fish.

It is far far from clear. Mabey in your head. But the language as written is certainly, not clear. All it says is telephone network is prohibited. That's it. That phrase has been challenged in other services and has settled to mean telephone networks, public switched exchanges and the internet. Which leaves many other types of "networks" as not prohibited. BTW, they are not laws. Just rules.

Ok thanks, have a great week.

Oh but you are, It’s in your own thread title what you’re selling, and that’s not local communication. You were right about one thing and that was the horse is dead. This has been hashed out here before. It’s just the first time I know where the idea was coming from a sales pitch.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be a win, but currently what your doing is not legal. Also, it sounds a lot like your talking about DMR talk groups on GMRS and taking a page out of the HAM / DMR / Brandmeister playbook and marketing it. All of which is available on the HAM bands for free, including linked and worldwide repeater network, hotspots, etc. as I'm sure you know. Now I'm knocking you for trying this, cant really fault you for it. But at the end of the day, GMRS does not allow it and does not have the bandwidth other radio services do, like HAM, which is easily accessible to the public.

I understand your frustration. GMRS is easier to get into than HAM, especially for families. No, there is not enough bandwidth, that's why linking untimely isn't allowed.

Please see my post above citing the law on linking / connecting repeaters. I sure lots of GMRS users are using equipment that is not type accepted equipment. There is no type acceptance requirement for HAM. That's why its HAM, you can build and use, legally, your own radio.

You're still connecting over the internet, and for the purpose of carrying voice. Yes, this ^^^ Others have tried the tactic of ignoring the FCC for profit and paid the fine. The "illegal marketing" by Rugged Radios back in 2020 comes to mind. They don't do that anymore. I expect there are others. The risk you may well find is yours.

From your website... Digital modes are not permitted in GMRS. "Other networks" is the internet, and literally any other network... LTE networks included. The law: § 95.1749 GMRS network connection. Operation of a GMRS station with a telephone connection is prohibited, as in § 95.349. GMRS repeater, base and fixed stations, however, may be connected to the public switched network or other networks for the sole purpose of operation by remote control pursuant to § 95.1745. § 95.1731 Permissible GMRS uses. The operator of a GMRS station may use that station for two-way plain language voice communications with other GMRS stations and with FRS units concerning personal or business activities. (d) Digital data. GMRS hand-held portable units may transmit digital data containing location information, or requesting location information from one or more other GMRS or FRS units, or containing a brief text message to another specific GMRS or FRS unit 95.1733 Prohibited GMRS uses. (8) Messages which are both conveyed by a wireline control link and transmitted by a GMRS station;

But you're experimenting with other peoples' liability, without an actual legal consultation on the issue, and other associated due diligence. That is irresponsible. And people are justified in being skeptical. People who adopt are trusting your discussion with a friend who practices law not pertaining to communications law, putting themselves at risk.

That's why I leave the radio on 24/7, so I can listen to strangers. But most of them are really people I know and have talked to because of the nets.

Here ae a couple of videos from Ham Radio Crash Course where he tested a bunch of different HT antennas. He tested dual band antennas on 2m and 70cm. This will at least give you an idea of how each performs. ABBREE Tacticool Ham Radio Antenna Performance Test and Review Tested! ABBREE, TWAYRDIO, Smiley, MFJ Ham Radio Antennas & QuirkQRP ZipTenna!

@WROQ359 is correct that you want menu number 11 to change the voice prompt. I am not familiar with the 905G, but if it is anything like the 935G then it will say the channel number when the voice prompt is on. And you will have to use the official Wouxun programming software to program the radio using a computer. RT Systems does not make a version for the KG-905G and the radio is NOT supported by CHIRP. Use the correct Wouxun software so that you do not take an unnecessary risk of bricking your radio.

I try and not listen to any one else I don’t know. I try and find channels with no traffic then use tones. Can’t stand to listen to strangers on the radio. Then Maybe you should turn it Off, since there are Millions on the air you don't know .

The poster lives in Lynchburg, VA He is trying to get the kids (who knows whos) to get on and have fun using the GMRS comms. Probably posted that here in case there where other families here that live in the vicinity to participate it the ose parents want them to get in on the noise... Just more people like yourselves, that want to talk to other people they have never met in a different medium. You do it all the time, right here. Why can't the little ones get in on the fun too?

Sounds like something you would do.

One of my daughters is an SLP at a local elementary school where most of the teachers and all of the admin use FRS radios. I was sitting in the parking lot one day waiting on my granddaughter and scanned and then listened for a while. I told my daughter about doing that and she said she needed to get her own FRS radio. I gave her an old Motorola FRS radio I had purchased new around 2002 or so. I had given two of those to her and her sister to keep in contact with me at a music event we used to attend yearly. It still works perfectly and brought back memories as a bonus.

Do you feel like pidgin English is the language of this thread?

WSHJ950, nice job. Most of us knew what you meant. Learning how to use repeaters with their radios is a stumbling block a lot of new users encounter. So I am glad things seem to be working out for you.

Mostly hear kids talking back and forth. Also hear contractors / road crews. During the school year I pick up transportation coordinators at our local schools talking to bus drivers and staff. The school traffic is the most entertaining as the transportation coordinators often talk to the bus drivers like a general coordinating a battle plan. Who would have imagined getting kids on to school busses could be so intense.

WSHG974, If you already haven't figured it out OffroaderX,s youtube channel, "Not a Rubicon" is a good place to start learning if you are new to GMRS

I thought that might happen so my sig only refers to the Medium End Radio Dork Experimeter (MERDE) level.

SILENCE! You have no permission to speak! This prestigious award has already gone straight to your head!

I am humbled by this honor. I’m not sure I’m worthy so I will try a day at the middle level first. Thank you, Queen.

There's hams here that are used to the normal answer, "it's complicated". It actually isn't. For a first mobile/base GMRS radio, the correct answer is the Radioddity DB-20G.

My repeater has a roger-beep and I require that anyone using the repeater also has their roger-beep enabled.

I'm with you brotha! I use it primarily for off-roading and on the trip to get TO off-roading and it busts my britches every time i hear the H.A.M.s radios wanna-be's long-talking on the repeaters.

Wow! You can back with an update 4 years later. Good on you! Your a rare gem in this post it and forget it forum world.

It’s an individual choice. If you choose to violate the regulations that’s your choice. You’re correct in anticipating that nobody can discern by listening whether someone is truly your relative. But many people like to fully understand what the regulations actually say. That’s not “going too far into the weeds.” If you’re not interested, just ignore the conversation.