Now I'm a believer

[marcspaz]

1 minute ago, WRXL702 said:

OMG..... Unbelievable....

Maybe All You Folks Should Consider Talking On Your Radio Stations Instead Of Constantly Arguing, Bickering, & Discussing On How They Are Supposed To Perform...

 

 

1 minute ago, WRXL702 said:

Folks Just Need To Loose Their Attitudes & Share Their Supported Knowledge...

 

How do we "loose" an attitude? And which one is it? Should we stop discussing this stuff or should we share our knowledge and experience? I'm confused. 

[WRXL702]

You Just Posted It.....

Another Attitude - Please Re-read My Post - Or Not......

Peace Out.....

 

[tcp2525]

1 hour ago, WRTC928 said:

So what is the right cable? "You're doing it wrong" isn't helpful information. It might make you feel superior, but it sure as hell isn't going to save me any heartache or money.

As stated above, RG400 MIL spec Teflon dielectric with silver plated copper conductors. Perfect for mobile installation and works great with the world famous and highly cherished NMO mount. In other words, pure perfection. 

And here ya go, an already made cable that's ready for installation and it even has the dreaded PL-259.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/375935266177

[BoxCar]

1 hour ago, tcp2525 said:

As stated above, RG400 MIL spec Teflon dielectric with silver plated copper conductors. Perfect for mobile installation and works great with the world famous and highly cherished NMO mount. In other words, pure perfection. 

And here ya go, an already made cable that's ready for installation and it even has the dreaded PL-259.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/375935266177

The spec sheet for the RG400 cable shows a loss of 28.3 dB at 400MHz per 100 meters. RG8X has a 26.25 dB loss per 100 meters at 400 MHz.

[WRYZ926]

I ran the numbers using the https://kv5r.com/ham-radio/coax-loss-calculator/ for several types of coax. Here are some screen shots showing the losses for 100ft of coax.

LMR400

RG-8X

RG-8

1/2" Heliax

[WRTC928]

12 hours ago, Socalgmrs said:

So you have a ground plane antenna with out a proper ground plane?  Why bother you neutered your antenna.  The whole system is not good at that point.  You probably 1/4erd your tx distance.  All that time and money wrapped up in a bad ground plane makes the rest pointless.  

No, you illiterate. I specifically stated that it's an NGP antenna. But even an NGP antenna can often benefit from a good ground plane.

[tcp2525]

21 minutes ago, BoxCar said:

The spec sheet for the RG400 cable shows a loss of 28.3 dB at 400MHz per 100 meters. RG8X has a 26.25 dB loss per 100 meters at 400 MHz.

Kind of irrelevant since most of us won't be using 100 meters of either in our mobile instalation anyway. Again, using the right coax for the job is key.

[WRTC928]

10 hours ago, tcp2525 said:

RG8x on UHF? Definitely not a optimal choice no matter where it's made. I use RG400 on all my NMO mobile installs. It's quality stuff even if it's made in an Asian country. 

I'll look at that for next time. In the meantime, I'm not having any more line loss than 99% of the installations out there. Less than most, in fact.

[tcp2525]

3 minutes ago, WRTC928 said:

No, you illiterate. I specifically stated that it's an NGP antenna. But even an NGP antenna can often benefit from a good ground plane.

Come on now. Please be civil as this is a family oriented forum.

[WRTC928]

15 minutes ago, WRYZ926 said:

I ran the numbers using the https://kv5r.com/ham-radio/coax-loss-calculator/ for several types of coax. Here are some screen shots showing the losses for 100ft of coax.

LMR400

RG-8X

RG-8

1/2" Heliax

That's nice to know, but LMR400 and Heliax aren't practical for vehicle installations.

[WRTC928]

3 minutes ago, tcp2525 said:

Come on now. Please be civil as this is a family oriented forum.

I'll be civil to him when he stops being an ass.

[WRYZ926]

10 minutes ago, WRTC928 said:

That's nice to know, but LMR400 and Heliax aren't practical for vehicle installations.

I reran the numbers using RG-58, RG-8X, and RG-8 with the length of 15 feet since that is the average length used in vehicle installations.

RG-58

RG-8X

RG-8

 

Now most mobile antennas will not have 5 dBd of gain so you will have to adjust that number using the calculator.

 

[tcp2525]

1 minute ago, WRTC928 said:

I'll be civil to him when he stops being an ass.

Hey, just trying to spread some love. I know some people here might not seem like they love each other, but think of it this way, it can be just as difficult picking the right coax. No shame in selecting the wrong coax, just admitting to yourself you made a poor choice is the first step towards inner peace.

[WRTC928]

2 hours ago, SteveShannon said:

RG58 is used because the dielectric is solid and doesn’t deform like foam dielectrics, but you’re right that it’s even lossier than RG8x. 
Choosing cables for a mobile installation is a juggling act. The only cables that will withstand being pinched in a door are thin and stiff because of solid dielectric materials. But they’re also very lossy. So you minimize the length as much as possible and accept that they aren’t ideal. 

Exactly. So, what's the point of telling me I'm using the "wrong" coax? I'm sure ladder line would give better results, but it won't fit through the holes in the floor of the back of the cab, to say nothing of going under the side bed rail, over the top of the front bed rail, down the front of the bed, under the cab, and back up through the hole in the floor. 15' is about as short as I can go and it has to be very flexible. I'm not aware of anything "better", but I'm open to suggestions. 

[marcspaz]

Im just trying to help and little, but i think there is benefit to watching this video. I put it together for some new Hams in my club, but the Amateur frequencies in UHF are close enough to GMRS, that the demo is still very valid. 

 

 

[SteveShannon]

40 minutes ago, WRTC928 said:

Exactly. So, what's the point of telling me I'm using the "wrong" coax? I'm sure ladder line would give better results, but it won't fit through the holes in the floor of the back of the cab, to say nothing of going under the side bed rail, over the top of the front bed rail, down the front of the bed, under the cab, and back up through the hole in the floor. 15' is about as short as I can go and it has to be very flexible. I'm not aware of anything "better", but I'm open to suggestions. 

I don’t recall ever saying that you are using the wrong coax. I pointed out that RG8x has a foam dielectric and RG58 has a solid dielectric and that’s why RG58 is frequently used for mobile installations.
RG400 also has a solid dielectric and a tiny outside diameter. It’s expensive though. A person could build a Frankenstein cable using RG400 where needed and something with less attenuation elsewhere to make up the necessary length, but the splice points reduce reliability and potentially add losses. 
Also, nothing I’ve said has been demeaning or critical of you or in any way personal. I’ve tried to stick to factual information, demonstrating how I did any calculations.