Un-official GMRS travel channel?

[dhardin53]

DanW; I know like the line is but a small portion of the US. but one should not discriminant any Citizen. The number of people greatest effect with this Line A is upper part of MI and the line across the north east is a bit more populated. All in all lets not make this that confusing. Channel 19 is not a great option, but the FCC rules would suppressed anything a small group might do. I'm sure anyone living in or around line Already knows this, or they should.

 More likly the channels 1-7 low power might work over all. 

Example;

Say I'm on the Dan Ryan express way 5 or 6 lanes going both way and at a complete halt (been there done that)  More power is great but not needed in a this saturation. 

If someone sees my singe/decal and thinks 30-40 minuets later is going to receive/transmit there call later operating on 5 watts is unlikely. Where only talking about local direct and a smaller radio radiation communication. Just one step above FRS, with preferable Licensed operators. Not all GMRS transmission needs to be extended long range transmission. This is only GRMS communications.  Not WLS. (oops told my age)

I don't know exactly what a good 10 to 20 watt mobile with a nice exterior antenna setup will do as miles transited and receive but the point is a travle channel is NOT your palce to chit chat into the next 2 or 3 counties. The scope of this concept needs to fit FCC rules, promote informed Licensed operators, and keep us safe and informed. With a side befit of advance the GNRS form and function.  NO more not less. We are not re-inventing the wheel here. Look back to my ordinal post of 3 goals.

 

[WyoJoe]

Something to possibly consider for those living in or near small towns, would be to designate a channel that would be monitored by a local radio club or the like. You might even get the town council on board to designate such a channel for that area as an official act.

For the benefit of travelers, you could post signs along the roadways as you enter the town, stating which channel is monitored. This could be very similar to what is done in some national parks where they post a radio frequency to tune to for park information, except in the case of FRS and GMRS, it would allow for two-way communication. The sign could read "FRS/GMRS Channel 4 is designated for local radio traffic" or something similar. It could also be used by both the FRS and GMRS services, however with GMRS, of course higher power output would be possible.

If there was a nearby repeater and the owner were to allow it, you could even (instead or in addition) designate a repeater channel to be used for this purpose.

The biggest drawback I see to such a designation, is that you'd want to be sure some locals stayed tuned to that channel in case anyone traveling through chimed in with a question about the area, traffic, etc., because, if it is posted, I think they might likely expect a response if they asked a question on the air.

This would also result in a fairly small area where that channel would be officially designated for this purpose. You could, however, reach out to other adjacent communities and pitch the idea there, too. If you had an area with five or six small towns, and all of them designated the same "local" channel, you could conceivably establish a travel channel for your region.

[gortex2]

8 hours ago, DanW said:

Most Americans wouldn't be close enough to worry about that.  19 Simplex make sense.

A lot more than you think. Syracuse NY is above line A. That's a pretty decent sized city with 2 interstates running thru it and GMRS repeaters in the area. While it may not affect you it may affect folks who live there. In reality many large cities in NY are above line A including Rochester and Buffalo. Going West Cleveland Ohio, Detroit and so on...

 

[gortex2]

11 hours ago, AdmiralCochrane said:

Its not an option, you don't have any more rights to the use the frequency than any other licensed GMRS user. 

Never said it was. Just said if I have a repeater on that pair I dont want to listen to others all the time just traveling thru. Guess it isn't an issue as this will never take off.

[MichaelLAX]

7 hours ago, kb2ztx said:

Never said it was. Just said if I have a repeater on that pair I dont want to listen to others all the time just traveling thru...

The FCC, in its wisdom, mandated that those simplex users transmitting between greater than 5 and up to 50 watts, must do so on one of the 8 repeater output frequencies.

If you "don't want to listen to others all the time just traveling thru," you should set a transmitting tone on your repeater that is not the traveling tone and set your receiver to only open your squelch when your repeater's tone is detected.

In this way most of the simplex travelers who are using the travel tone will not open your squelch and hence you won't have to listen to them.

There is a subset of travelers who you will hear, even when this plan is in effect: Those simplex travelers who are within your simplex receiving zone who transmit while someone else who is properly using your repeater.

In those situations you will hear both the simplex user and the repeaters output of the repeater user, which will cause some interference depending upon which station "captures" your receiver and to what extent.  

 

[kirk5056]

Keep 20!  Every time this topic comes up many people cite 20 as THE travel channel all ready.  Why reinvent the wheel.

If we keep PL filter of 141.3 then few will even hear the channel unless they choose to.  I would rather have a few choosing to MONITOR the channel then a lot of people randomly LISTENING to it (and trying to use their ears to filter out non-travel traffic).  If you think simplex Travel channel users will bother your repeater then use a different out put PL filter, they are not using your input freq.

BTW I live in Michigan, if we go with 19 then I cant use it in most of my state.

I like the idea of just declaring channel 20 the "hailing/distress channel" it might be working for the "off road channel" (which I really like).

[Lscott]

I wish people would do some basic research first about travel tones for open repeaters and the semi official channel 20 for travel. A simple Google search lists a bunch of references on this topic.

If people just used what has been the norm for years instead of trying to change it maybe we would have more people using it.

 

[MichaelLAX]

2 hours ago, Lscott said:

I wish people would do some basic research first about travel tones for open repeaters and the semi official channel 20 for travel. A simple Google search lists a bunch of references on this topic...

 

Ok so I did that and the first listing directed me to @rdunajewski’s post:

“Travel Tone is when a repeater enables 141.3 Hz as an open tone for travelers to use when in the area. For example, you could tune your radio to each GMRS repeater channel with 141.3 as your tone, and the repeaters with a Travel Tone are open for temporary use without permission. Good for when you don't have time to program each repeater along your route.

 

“ORI stands for the Open Repeater Initiative which was created by Popular Wireless many years ago. It was a way to indicate a repeater is open for any licensed GMRS operator to use without having to ask the owner's permission. These repeaters you can just jump on and use as long as you follow GMRS rules and use your callsign.“

I don’t see your supposed designation about Channel 20 (not that Channel 20 isn’t a good idea!)?

[DanW]

22 hours ago, OffRoaderX said:

This is the obvious answer.. Everyone knows that CB Ch19 is the unofficial official road channel so it makes sense that GMRS Ch19 would be the same..

Someone should go on Youtube and decree it, to make it official..

Lol, yeah, someone with more than the two Youtube followers I have.  I know you've got at least double that!  

[DanW]

15 hours ago, kb2ztx said:

A lot more than you think. Syracuse NY is above line A. That's a pretty decent sized city with 2 interstates running thru it and GMRS repeaters in the area. While it may not affect you it may affect folks who live there. In reality many large cities in NY are above line A including Rochester and Buffalo. Going West Cleveland Ohio, Detroit and so on...

 

Still a small percentage of the population.  Small enough not to worry about it.  They can make FRS channel 7 their official channel if it is a problem.  I like 19.

[MichaelLAX]

16 hours ago, kb2ztx said:

A lot more than you think. Syracuse NY is above line A. That's a pretty decent sized city with 2 interstates running thru it and GMRS repeaters in the area. While it may not affect you it may affect folks who live there. In reality many large cities in NY are above line A including Rochester and Buffalo. Going West Cleveland Ohio, Detroit and so on...

 

Can you explain to me why Channels 19 & 27 and 21 & 29 are verboten above Line A, but not Channels 20 & 28? which are smack in-between these frequencies!?

[MichaelLAX]

1 hour ago, DanW said:

Still a small percentage of the population.  Small enough not to worry about it.  They can make FRS channel 7 their official channel if it is a problem.  I like 19.

@Lscottmakes a pretty reasonable case that Channel 20 is historically the travel channel.

Why not accept his perspective and not isolate any percentage of the population?

[DanW]

7 hours ago, MichaelLAX said:

@Lscottmakes a pretty reasonable case that Channel 20 is historically the travel channel.

Why not accept his perspective and not isolate any percentage of the population?

Because nobody knows about channel 20.  How about this?  Scratch that line or move it to the border.  

 

 

[MichaelLAX]

39 minutes ago, DanW said:

How about this?  Scratch that line or move it to the border.  

Take it up with the FCC and let us know how that works out for you!

[DanW]

1 hour ago, MichaelLAX said:

Take it up with the FCC and let us know how that works out for you!

They really don't do much.  They have bigger things they are up to.  

I'm going with channel 19.

[gortex2]

3 hours ago, DanW said:

Because nobody knows about channel 20.  How about this?  Scratch that line or move it to the border.  

 

 

For years GMRS 462.675 was the emergency channel in many folks area's as channel 9 was in CB. Many REACT teams had repeaters for this channel. Prior to SAR in CNY React had a repeater and got given to SAR when React faded. It is still on the air to this day on 462.675. While it was used more for SAR stuff before local VHF systems flourished it was used randomly by hikers on the FLT. There is alot out there on GMRS 462.675 (CH20) being used for this. I knw many monitor this channel while traveling still (my Priority) with the travel tone. 

As said in the end unless the FCC designates a frequency its going to be up to an individual or area to use what they want. Personally I think CH1 is the smartest channel as most never leave it.  On my last Jeep ride that's basically the channel they said to go to if you can't get an answer on the trail channel.  My guess is its simple and basic and most radios all match on CH1. If you use the travel PL on it you wont hear all the FRS users who just got a Christmas radio. 

On a similar topic State of Wyoming designated Channel 3 and PL7 (307) as a search and rescue channel. People are giving 100 reasons why it wont work. So no matter what gets picked some will like it and some wont. 

As for scratching the Line A idea I can't argue as it takes forever to get public safety and LMR licenses above Line A also, but its the rules. Saying to disregard the rules is not what GMRS users should be promoting. We should be promoting following the rules as well as getting a license. 

 

 

[Blaise]

On 12/9/2021 at 11:11 AM, tweiss3 said:

Channels 19 & 21 cannot be used above line A or east of line C.

Well crap, I may have already broken this rule.  We camp in the Adirondacks north of Lake George all the time!

[tweiss3]

11 minutes ago, Blaise said:

Well crap, I may have already broken this rule.  We camp in the Adirondacks north of Lake George all the time!

It's an important line. My house lies about 1000' north of the line. Lines A and C also affect Part 90 LMR and Amateur Radio where every UHF LMR system requires coordination with Canada and and ham radio cannot use 420-430

[gortex2]

1 hour ago, Blaise said:

Well crap, I may have already broken this rule.  We camp in the Adirondacks north of Lake George all the time!

How many people actually read their license after they get it ? Yes parts of the ADK park are above line A. Dealing with Canada is a PITA for LMR/Public Safety stuff.

 

[DanW]

3 hours ago, kb2ztx said:

For years GMRS 462.675 was the emergency channel in many folks area's as channel 9 was in CB. Many REACT teams had repeaters for this channel. Prior to SAR in CNY React had a repeater and got given to SAR when React faded. It is still on the air to this day on 462.675. While it was used more for SAR stuff before local VHF systems flourished it was used randomly by hikers on the FLT. There is alot out there on GMRS 462.675 (CH20) being used for this. I knw many monitor this channel while traveling still (my Priority) with the travel tone. 

As said in the end unless the FCC designates a frequency its going to be up to an individual or area to use what they want. Personally I think CH1 is the smartest channel as most never leave it.  On my last Jeep ride that's basically the channel they said to go to if you can't get an answer on the trail channel.  My guess is its simple and basic and most radios all match on CH1. If you use the travel PL on it you wont hear all the FRS users who just got a Christmas radio. 

On a similar topic State of Wyoming designated Channel 3 and PL7 (307) as a search and rescue channel. People are giving 100 reasons why it wont work. So no matter what gets picked some will like it and some wont. 

As for scratching the Line A idea I can't argue as it takes forever to get public safety and LMR licenses above Line A also, but its the rules. Saying to disregard the rules is not what GMRS users should be promoting. We should be promoting following the rules as well as getting a license. 

 

 

I won't be violating a rule.  I don't go near the line.  Never said anyone shouldn't get a license, either.  

I don't like 1 and 7 because they are low power.  But if that became the primary channel used, I'd use it.  It'd still probably be better than CB.  At least more clear.  

But my vote is for 19.  High power and easy to remember.  

[MichaelLAX]

6 minutes ago, DanW said:

I don't like 1 and 7 because they are low power. 

Technically speaking, if you are going to use that terminology for GMRS channels:

Channels 1-7 are Medium power

Channels 8-14 are Low power; and

Channels 15-30 are High power.

Just like on my Anytone AT-779UV:

[DanW]

5 minutes ago, MichaelLAX said:

Technically speaking, if you are going to use that terminology for GMRS channels:

Channels 1-7 are Medium power

Channels 8-14 are Low power; and

Channels 15-30 are High power.

Fair point, but technically, I don't use 8-14, so anything I use that isn't high is low.

[MichaelLAX]

3 minutes ago, DanW said:

Fair point, but technically, I don't use 8-14, so anything I use that isn't high is low.

Is that a double entendre  or just a double error? 

[gortex2]

Being most GMRS mobiles don't have 8-14 (as defined by the rules) those should not be discussed as a use case. 

 

[MichaelLAX]

 

24 minutes ago, kb2ztx said:

Being most GMRS mobiles don't have 8-14 (as defined by the rules) those should not be discussed as a use case. 

 

The context was using High, Medium or Low power when discussion Channels.

My attached photo was to show Channel 8 being set for LOW power; and not calling Channels 1-7 at 5 watts as Low, but Medium power.