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I make zero assumptions that any repeaters will be up and available in a time of serious local emergency involving a grid-down scenario (especially long-term), unless the repeater was put up and maintained for that express purpose and eventuality. I know of no such system within radio range of me. The closest candidate (but one I cannot reach) lives on a hospital and is known to be powered by the hospitals main emergency backup system. For most individuals, putting up a repeater is a technical and costly challenge. Add in the investment and maintenance costs for a quality long-term grid-down power backup system and suddenly the repeater, antenna and duplexer costs are dwarfed. Most will not invest in something that they receive no immediate benefit from. For those with repeaters co-located on a commercial tower site, some maybe connected to the local UPS and emergency power generators. That is good, but other equipment may be given emergency power priority. As I continue my personal GMRS and amateur radio journey, my focus is optimized simplex communications, such that operation is not reliant on repeaters. Working repeaters in a time of need will just be the sweet icing on the cake. Wayoverthere, perhaps you have discovered a need and the opportunity for pulling local resources to support a mission of creating and maintaining that ideal local site that you and the community can count on during a time of need. Michael WRHS965 KE8PLM

Hello Kirk, and welcome to the forum! I have been using FRS and GMRS off and on for nearly 20 years. This is the first time I have heard the suggestion of there being a ‘reluctance’ to use PL codes. You have me curious. What is the nature of the comments you’re hearing that give you this impression? My personal perspective follows. While I do use repeaters, my primary reason for having GMRS is simplex. There are times I operate both with and without PL codes. More often without them. I use codes only when I am in an area where there is heavy use of the frequencies and I want to leave my radios on for extended periods but only want to hear traffic from my group. After all that is the reason PL codes came into existence in the first place. They provided a way for different businesses and other groups to share a frequency without having to listen to with each other’s conversations. My personal experience has also shown that without codes, when in an area of low RF noise that the receiver will open squelch at a slightly greater distance without the code than with. Then there is the “real” interference thing. Two people cannot operate on the same frequency without adversely affecting the reception by the intended listeners residing within their shared coverage area. This is true no matter how many PL codes there are. The use of codes masks the presence and use of the frequency by others. A knowledgable and respectful two-way radio user knows not to transmit when the frequency is in use. When PL codes are active it is easy to overlook the fact that someone else might be talking and complacency will result in unintentional interfering transmissions. If no PL code was being used, it would be pretty obvious if someone else nearby was using the frequency. I hope this helps. I look forward to hearing more about the reluctance. Michael WRHS965 KE8PLM

enjoy the chatter of kids while it lasts, someday you may wish to hear kids chatter instead of suffering through a horrific time. When the kids are silent start to worry...any parent will tell you that Yes, I hear them.

No. It has everything to do with the equipment you are using. If the equipment you are using is certified for FRS then you do not need to apply for a license. If you are using equipment certified for GMRS, you must have a license. Previously the rules were interpreted like you describe by many users. In 2017 the FCC eliminated that ambiguity. They now make it clear that to use FRS and GMRS frequencies you must use type certified equipment to be legal. That also translates to also mean that if you are using GMRS equipment, you must have a license. As part of their ruling, pre-existing equipment with power less than 2 watts were legally reclassified as FRS. Anything with more was reclassified as GMRS. There are no longer any more legal “hybrid” FRS and GMRS radios. They are either one or the other, not both. Yes, max power for FRS is 2 watt on channels 1-7 and 15-22. Channels 8-15 are 1/2 watt for both FRS and GRMS. Regards, Michael WRHS965 KE8PLM

Here in the San Francisco Bay and Sacramento regions we have started hearing a "baby monitor" type devices using GMRS 462 and 467 MHz primary repeater frequencies, in nursing home settings (given the message content). We are aware of about twenty incidents of this over the past three months, but the rate of occurrence is rising. The most recent was strong enough to interfere with a CERT/Fire Council repeater out here. These typically operate during daylight periods, and appear to be continuously keyed for up to 12-16 hours at a time, although background noise, such as televisions, could be keeping them transmitting if set for VOX. They do not have time-out timers enabled. These change channels occasionally, but usually end up on 462.625, 462.725, 467.625 and 467.725 MHz. They use a D754 or a D734 DCS code. This kind of device was explicitly mentioned in past FCC GMRS rulings as it was feared that manufacturer's might use these channels for such things. Given most repeaters here in California are on 1500-4000 ft. mountains, continuous destructive interference will occur to our repeater inputs. I tried to DF the source of one of these last week, but it was found to be in San Francisco and we ran out of time. SF is a particularly difficult place to do this due to the density, hills and other sources. Thankfully these are constantly keyed. The device I was looking for was horizontally polarized, making it about 10-20 dB weaker when received on a vertical vehicle antenna. A Yagi in horizontal worked best. My goal was not to go after the user (they don't know better), but instead get a picture of the device, determine its manufacturer and model number, and establish who is selling it. As these may be used in nursing care facilities, they will likely have to bring the device out to us to be safe. Please let us know here if you hear these as we are trying to keep a list of the channels and codes in use so we can identify the specific radio model. This is clearly in violation of §95.1733(a)(10) and §95.1763© for GMRS, and §95.587(3) for FRS. It also appears to violate §95.533.

I have only been in the GMRS comunity for a year. I have noticed in this, and other forums, that people show a reluctance to use CTCSS/DCS (PL codes). Or the apparent belief that they are only for repeater use. With GMRS radios we can transmit on 30 frequencies and listen on 22 frequencies. Using PL codes we increase those to 3-4,000 CHANNELS (freq + PL). Can some one enlighten me on the reluctance?

If your background is in natural sciences or crafts, the test preparation will be easy. On the other hand, if you are more into philology, literature (especially english romantics of 18th century), art in general - the preparation could take like maybe the whole 4 hours! There are helping resources on the internet. hamexam.org is one, there are plenty of others.

All is moot with EMP. Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

depends on how many batteries. I have 3 hooked up to 2×100w panels and can run a bunch of stuff off it. The controller actually just died last month after 3 years

KB2ZTX, agreed I have several commercial sites that I maintain, only one of which has full back up power and one that has B/U for certain radios on the site. Only one of my three machines has full battery B/U for when the power goes out.

The other issue is many GMRS repeater owners don't or wont spend the money on true commercial gear. A $5000 repeater with duplexer and hardline up a tower can easily get to $10K in new hardware depending on what you use. A lot of the GMRS repeaters are done on the economical aka cheap design with LMR style cable, TRAM antenna and GR1225 or similar on a garage or house to cover a local area. These are fine for that purpose, but a true emergency repeater requires a lot. Going on the cheap if you were to drop a generator on site and know what your doing you can buy a new Generace for around $3K but then you need a tank or propane or natural gas source. That's a money fee on top of the equipment. Some locations have solar backups but that's only going to last so long for the hobbyist solar system. I use a small system mainly to keep batteries and repeater controllers up on a power flicker or short outage. Even at home where I have a standby generator my repeater location does not get backup power. Id rather have heat and water at that point. As was said earlier some may be at a commercial site and have some access to the backup systems but I wouldn't rely on any of it. As reference out of my 4 search and rescue repeater systems I maintain only 2 of them have standby emergency power. The others have a battery backup but nothing that will last 24 hours.

In my neighborhood, the most annoying thing by kids using Christmas present, bubble pack radios, given to them by their not-in-the-know parents, is the roger beep. The kids can't seem to hold down the PTT. So a single sentence (or sub-sentence) typically has 3-5 roger beeps. And this can go on for an hour. But fortunately, just as the children don't know how to turn off the beep, they also don't seem to know how to change the channel, and thus ALL the children in my neighborhood are on channel 1, which is the factory default it seems. The few businesses I've picked up are on channels 2,3 and 7, all with PLs. They probably moved off Ch-1 just for this reason. My solution? I almost always avoid channel 1. Just my 2 cents. ...

No reluctance here. Yes, I use repeaters with a PL to talk to friends outside my area. But more importantly I use simplex to talk to family members (who are almost always within simplex range). But family members just are not radio savvy, and so not to confuse things, I preset all radios to simplex with a likely unused PL. That way I can hand anyone a radio and the only thing they have to worry about is PTT, and there I am on the other end of the line. In fact, (mostly) the only time I use no PL at all, is when everyone else is asleep, and I start scanning frequencies to keep boredom at bay. ...

I don't mind hearing kids on the air. Maybe a few years down the road, they too will pick up the hobby.

Personally, I don't mind the chatter....that may be the seeds of the radio hobby taking root to bloom later on. Its just the endless call tones that get old.

The actual M1225 LS model was a distinct version of the radio. Just to make things confusing, there was also an LTR "add-on" option board that could be installed into a regular M1225 to make it into an LTR capable trunking radio. The M1225 LS had limited "conventional" modes- I believe it was only 2 conventional non-LTR channels, and I also believe the early models required you to power up on an LTR home channel. Later versions of software or firmware fixed that. The most recent version Motorola M1225 programming software - HVN-9054 - will do either the conventional M1225 or LS models. Earlier versions of software was split into two different versions if I recall (20+ years ago) correctly. Make sure you get the latest, and it won't be a problem. The M1225 LS radio probably has a duty cycle of 10 to 20% when run at 40 watts. It was never designed or suggested to be used as a repeater by Motorola. I'd set the thing to LOW Power and run a cooling fan on it the entire time that the repeater is on. The heat sinks on the M1225 series is not very big. Keep it supplied with fresh cool clean air. Internal shielding was also not the greatest, and the M1225 series was known to suffer from desense. Get some physical separation between the transmit and receive radios, even if it's just 6 or 8 inches. Don't stack them directly on top of each other. Also, those inexpensive repeater maker cables that plug into the back of a 16 pin option plug can go in either way. Make SURE you're plugging it with the correct orientation up/down. There's only one way that's correct, but the incorrect way will brick your radio. https://www.repeater-builder.com/motorola/manuals/m1225-service-manual-6880904z96-a.pdf Pages 54 & 55 have the pinout information. If you didn't already own the radios, I'd be telling you to find another radio for the project. I like M1225's - but I don't like them for repeaters that have any type of duty cycle. I've made a few "poor man repeaters" in my life, but I usually used the low power M1225 models for the transmit side, and set them down to 10 watts. With a fan. And a time out timer set at 60 or 90 seconds.

Distance with GMRS is 95% antenna height and antenna, 5% radio. As you continue your exploration of GMRS you will hear that theme over and over. Do not ignore it. I only recently acquired a higher power radio. With all my testing using just a low power HT I now know for certain I can talk upwards of 50 miles in certain directions hitting well placed repeaters using just 5 watts and a good, well placed external antenna. Your mileage will vary. Given the extensive testing I have done in my area I have now lived both the bad and the good. It is nice knowing I operate at only 5 watts, and communicate everywhere I need to cover, and have extra power available to reduce the noise in my signal at distance locations when propagation conditions are not in my favor. At only 5 watts, the means when I am operating on backup power I can operate 10 times as long as compared to high-power. Nice little side benefit too. Welcome to myGMRS. Michael WRHS965 KE8PLM

One owner of a repeater has spoken to me plenty of times. Several owners have responded to my request via email.

Cool line! Permission to reuse? Michael WRHS965 KE8PLM

You might try an Arrow beam made for the 70cm/440 ham band. They make some very high gain antennas. I have the moon bounce portable beam that I bought for my 2m/440 ham rig. You may find other models are better suited to your situation. I'm sure there are other makes as well. I guess the main point is that there is a lot more available for Ham 440MHz than GMRS and the match is probably good enough or tunable. My 440 mag mount antennas match pretty good on GMRS but I'm not sure if the beams are more critical. So do a little home work first. Vince

That would make you the third, John. I am the fourth! In my professional career owning a GE Service Station, we only used 1/4 wavelength 'stingers' for both VHF and UHF roof-mouned antennas.

Yes. No doubt. They publicly assert that the radio is a firmware modified version of the KG-UV9P. That suggests that only the firmware is different. The major complaint I have with the ham version KG-UV9P is the display. While I have no complaints with radio performance thus far in 6 months, I find it frustrating as all get-out not being able to view the display to see what channel, frequency, PL codes or signal level except when indoors. I use it nearly every day outside. That issue makes the radio less usable to me than the KG-805G. So unless its radio performance were to be substantially superior (which I doubt) I will stick with my KG-805G for GMRS usage and use my KG-UV9P when I want to listen to non-GMR frequencies.

There is a tremendous amount of benefits with Amateur Radio vs. GMRS. First, lets just talk about voice. On GMRS simplex, the absolute very best you can expect from a perfect setup, is going to be about 70 miles. Likely less. That would be mobile or base. With Amateur Radio VHF and UHF, the power limits are 1500 watts with no radiated power restrictions. That means with a little elevation, you are talking coast to coast on the higher portions of VHF and the lower portions of UHF. On the lower portions of VHF, you can talk to Europe, Mediterranean, Northern Africa, etc. Even in my mobile, I can talk to NY from Virginia on VHF simplex. With things other than voice... there is no limit to what you can do beyond no encryption. If you can dream it, you can do it on amateur radio. There is APRS, which provides transceiver location services. There FLDigi which is used for texting and simple messaging. There is WinLink which is a 100% radio-based email service that allows you to email other operators as well as people on the public internet. And much, much more. The benefit of HF and MF is, the ease of global comms as you drop in frequency. I was driving around in my Jeep today on an HF frequency that Tech license holders have access to. I talked to people in 3 different countries on 2 different continents with a simple 100 watt mobile radio and a whip antenna. It's really a lot of fun. As far as a base station goes, I don't use mobile radios for base a station. I have base station radios that I use for VHF, and a VHF/UHF repeater. I talk on VHF on the base for several hours a week, sitting in my executive desk chair. As far as the quality of conversation... I can't really say much about that. I would assume there are plenty of people to talk to without getting into religion, politics, etc. I avoid them like the plague. With regard to if it's worth it... that is a personal choice that each person needs to decide for themselves. I think it is. I held my Tech license for 17+ years before I got my General and had a great time. I also think the GMRS and FRS are great radio service and fill a nice niche.