FRS Mobile?

[MichaelLAX]

2 hours ago, wrci350 said:

That's a GMRS radio, not FRS.  The only difference is that if someone uses it without a GMRS license then they are in violation of FCC regulations.

Allen, did you read the full text of my post?

[wrci350]

9 minutes ago, MichaelLAX said:

Allen, did you read the full text of my post?

My name is not "Allen", but if you would like to call me "Mr. Allen" that would be fine.

And which part of your post did I miss?

[MichaelLAX]

31 minutes ago, wrci350 said:

My name is not "Allen", but if you would like to call me "Mr. Allen" that would be fine.

And which part of your post did I miss?

Sorry, Stuart: How about the part where I say:

4 hours ago, MichaelLAX said:

As I pointed out: It already exists: the Radioditty DB20-G for $105 you plug it into your cigarette lighter, connect an antenna and you're on the air!

Get a GMRS license for you and your family for $35, or don't: The only difference is having to say your callsign every now and then!

One guy on this Forum even installed one in his Ferrari!

Bubble Wrap GMRS Mobile in a Ferrari

 

[wrci350]

Sorry, but I fail to see the point you are trying to make.

That's not an FRS radio, it's a GMRS radio.  Yes, someone can buy it and install it and use it without a license.  That's true of any GMRS radio.

[MichaelLAX]

13 minutes ago, wrci350 said:

Sorry, but I fail to see the point you are trying to make.

That's not an FRS radio, it's a GMRS radio.  Yes, someone can buy it and install it and use it without a license.  That's true of any GMRS radio.

Somebody in this thread quoted the rules and pointed out that FRS radios can only be hand-held and not mobile: I think his name is "Junior!" 

Since there is no such thing as a "FRS Mobile" radio, I am pointing out a workable alternative that works today instead of just petitioning the FCC and waiting for Godot...

Also, the DB-20G is in the same price class as the OP's suggested Midland MXT-105; which is not true of just any GMRS radio (mobile).

Lastly, I am not really suggesting anyone use it without a GMRS, as I point out they can now easily acquire one for $35 -- if that is too much money after a $109 radio purchase, they have other problems...

[DONE]

Fixed station VS base station.

Gonna assume that fixed station MAY mean control station where a base radio installation is being used to communicate to a repeater.

Commercial radio refer to that as a control station and they are limited in both power and antenna height. 

 

[BoxCar]

A control station IS NOT a fixed station. A very good example of a fixed station is a microwave link. It only communicates with another fixed station and no mobiles. Other examples are sprinkler control stations used for irrigation, flood control monitors, or other stations used for datalinks. 

[Radioguy7268]

A Control station is properly licensed as an FX1 "Fixed Station" in Part 90. I would agree with the concept that a Fixed Station could either refer to a link or an uplink to a repeater. The FCC does a terrible job of defining the terms used in Part 95.

Previous discussion here: 3523-what-is-a-fixed-station

[DONE]

On 4/2/2022 at 1:37 PM, Radioguy7268 said:

A Control station is properly licensed as an FX1 "Fixed Station" in Part 90. I would agree with the concept that a Fixed Station could either refer to a link or an uplink to a repeater. The FCC does a terrible job of defining the terms used in Part 95.

Previous discussion here: 3523-what-is-a-fixed-station

Right,,, anything in the commercial part 90 realm with F as the beginning of a station designator.  FB = Fixed Base.  A 'base station' would be a simplex Fixed Base running a single frequency (simplex) to another station.  That station may be a portable or mobile.

FB-2 is the designation for a 'shared' repeater frequency that is not being used without first verifying the repeater transmit frequency is clear and not in use be a co-channel licensee adjacent to your licensed operating area. These licenses can and are granted to multiple users in the SAME geographic area.  THe use of PL and DPL coded squelch is used to limit the users from hearing each other BUT users are required (although it's RARELY done) to monitor the output frequency BEFORE transmitting to limit interference.  Radio's operating under this type of license are programmed to monitor for any carrier that may be present and keep the user from transmitting until the carrier is gone. 

FB-6 designates you are the only user in the coverage area and the next user of that frequency does NOT overlap with your licensed operating area and you may use the frequency as a control channel or other use were it's NOT required to first monitor the frequency to see if it's in use before transmitting.

Then you have FB-8 and Market frequencies.  These are effectively OWNED frequencies for a large region.  Paging companies used these for paging transmitters that would constantly bang away 24-7 and never stop transmitting.  Market frequencies are typically not licensed as a single pair however, they are a frequency range in some instances that cover multiple 'pairs' of repeater frequencies.  Paging would typically use the input frequencies as links and the outputs were what the pagers were listening for.

So back to the Fixed base thing with GMRS.  It would make little sense to limit the power between a mobile or portable and a fixed base but limiting the output power of a radio that was accessing a repeater with an elevated antenna (commercial limits BOTH power to a certain wattage and an antenna height to 20 feet above any obstruction specifically for radios that are communicating to a repeater and not directly to subscribers (mobiles and portables) so they are NOT interfering with other repeaters on the same frequency. 

But, I will also repeat that the FCC has not made it really clear on what a Fixed Base is specifically when it comes to GMRS.  A repeater is technically a fixed base in the commercial realm, but that doesn't seem to apply to GMRS as you would need to limit a repeater to 15 watts if that were the case.  So again, my vote is they are referring to a control station or a radio at a fixed location that is NOT in a vehicle or a portable radio that is directly communicating to a repeater.  Now I am applying logic to this and the FCC is not logical at times. But it does make the most sense.  That being said, a call to the nearest field office or an email to someone at the FCC may clear this all up.  If someone is motivated enough to email or call them please report your findings back here.  I may also ask them the next time I have need to call them on other non-related matters. 

[Lscott]

This page has a nice listing of the various FCC designators.

https://digitalfrequencysearch.com/Search/Codes.php

[WRQX963]

Those Radio Shack FRS mobile units might date back to the time after channels 8-14 were added, but before the first seven channels were allowed more than half a watt, so they could be half a watt on all fourteen channels. The commission might have added their mobile restriction with that model in mind. I do not remember the exact chronology of rule changes.

[jwilkers]

Those Radio Shack FRS mobile units might date back to the time after channels 8-14 were added, but before the first seven channels were allowed more than half a watt, so they could be half a watt on all fourteen channels. The commission might have added their mobile restriction with that model in mind. I do not remember the exact chronology of rule changes.

Frs had 14 channels and .5 watts from day one. Just some early radios only had a limited number of channels. Frs never allowed more than half a watt......until the recent rule change.

Sent from my SM-A125U using Tapatalk

[WRQX963]

12 hours ago, jwilkers said:

Frs had 14 channels and .5 watts from day one. Just some early radios only had a limited number of channels.
Frs never allowed more than half a watt...until the recent rule change.

You may be correct, I have found conflicting information from various websites.
The first sentence in number two below is all messed up:
https://midlandusa.com/blogs/blog/6-things-you-should-know-about-fcc-changes-for-frs-and-gmrs-radios

[MichaelLAX]

16 hours ago, jwilkers said:

Frs had 14 channels and .5 watts from day one. Just some early radios only had a limited number of channels. Frs never allowed more than half a watt......until the recent rule change.

Spare me doing the research: There are FRS radios allowed to transmit over 0.5 watts?

[SteveShannon]

26 minutes ago, MichaelLAX said:

Spare me doing the research: There are FRS radios allowed to transmit over 0.5 watts?

Up to 2 watts since 2017. 

[MichaelLAX]

21 hours ago, Sshannon said:

Up to 2 watts since 2017. 

Oh, right: Senior Moment and only 0.5 on Channels 8-14.

[SteveShannon]

50 minutes ago, MichaelLAX said:

Oh, right: Senior Moment and only 0.5 on Channels 8-14.

I resemble that remark, myself.

[WRQX963]

Whenever my wife and I go out shopping, we stay on channels 8-14 because
1. 500mw should last all day
2. Even throughout the local shopping mall, we are both nearly full quieting from one end to the other.
3. Radio school taught me to always use the minimum power necessary and the untrained are forced to do this on 8-14,
so there is less chance of bumping into other traffic.

[back4more70]

On 3/28/2022 at 1:38 PM, PartsMan said:

OH. I am not going to "do that". I just think if some radio company did people would buy them. The bubble pack mobile.

They could be included in a new off road vehicle or even rental jeeps/atvs. It wouldn't matter who ran it.

I think this is an interesting idea, an option for a two-way in a new offroad vehicle may be attractive. However, why not install MURS mobiles instead? Granted, these can only talk to other MURS units, but the antenna and power limitations (as well as license by rule) are already built in.

[MichaelLAX]

Maybe Radioddity is on the verge of offering a MURS mobile, as they just released their MURS HT, the MU-5

 

[Over2U]

Now that MURS and FRS radios are allowed the same transmitter power (except on FRS Channels 08-14), it would be fun to see range comparison tests between the two services over various terrain (with their stock H/T antennas).

[WRTL847]

All other things being equal (power output, antenna efficiency, location), MURS would go further under most circumstances. And would tend to have better penetration of foliage, walls, etc. We used to use low-band VHF because it worked better in our hills and valleys, but antennas were bigger, radios were more expensive. They switched to high-band VHF, which worked fine but required more tower sites (5) to have effective coverage. Then the state got the bright idea to bring in an 800 MHz system, they were up to over 95 sites in our county and still had poor coverage before they finally pulled the plug on the whole system. 

[gortex2]

On 7/3/2022 at 12:43 PM, back4more70 said:

I think this is an interesting idea, an option for a two-way in a new offroad vehicle may be attractive. However, why not install MURS mobiles instead? Granted, these can only talk to other MURS units, but the antenna and power limitations (as well as license by rule) are already built in.

Already have them...

https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/702373

Uses MURS channels. Have seen them in many SXS already. Have not had a chance to order one yet but plan to for off road use.

[Breezewood]

On 3/26/2022 at 2:16 AM, WRCZ387 said:

It was sold by Radio Shack, #21-1850

I forgot what year or years it was offered

I believe that they pop up on eBay every so often

I have one of these and, sadly, the external shielding on the wiring is deteriorating quite badly...

I wonder how difficult it would be to replace it all...

[Breezewood]

On 7/16/2022 at 2:55 PM, gortex2 said:

Already have them...

https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/702373

Uses MURS channels. Have seen them in many SXS already. Have not had a chance to order one yet but plan to for off road use.

Interesting, after following the link in your post, I did some research on those Garmin units and it appears that the Group Ride Radio feature you mentioned also includes data transfer of locations of other users. I imagine this to be a scaled down implementation of part of the idea behind APRS...