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Showing content with the highest reputation on 08/31/21 in all areas

  1. OffRoaderX

    Repeater question

    Be careful on those "Free speech" repeaters.. Those boys play rough..
    2 points
  2. Back in the Dark Ages (long before even ARPANET!), I took COBOL, FORTRAN IV, and PERL during the same semester. The same professor taught all three classes. For our major project in each class he essentially gave us the same task, which basically was a simple accounting application for a golf course. I decided to combine all three assignments into a single solution: PERL for the input/output routines, COBOL for the database, and FORTRAN IV for all maths operations. The professor was only mildly amused, but he did finally give me a 4.0 for all three classes. ? EDIT: I don't remember the exact number now, but as close as I can recall this took close to 4 thousand punch cards!
    2 points
  3. MichaelLAX

    Repeater question

    Appendix D of the manual: this appears to be Channel 23 for the repeater split frequencies (according to the manual, channel 1 is 462.5625 simplex a/k/a FRS Channel 1). You can change the display to Frequency instead of Channel to confirm the correct frequencies (Menu items 21 and 22). To clarify, if you enter a DPL, you do not have to enter a CTCSS; they are mutually exclusive. RT725 gets pretty raunchy, and I assume that this new 550 will be likewise, so don't have children around when you listen. RT725 was the first GMRS repeater I ever listened to, and I incorrectly concluded that GMRS was the same as CB radio! hahaha
    2 points
  4. Hmm.. just to be a contrarian, I will posit that the whole appeal of FRS/GMRS is its simplicity and "open the box and get started" ease of use. Thus, having designated channel numbers helps the vast majority of FRS/GMRS users. I'll bet that if you polled 1,000 frequent users of FRS/GMRS radios what frequency their favorite channel was on, 950 of them wouldn't have a clue. The other 50 are participating in this forum. ?
    2 points
  5. Many of those people that are waiting for that huge-price decrease are the same ones that will drive 20 miles out of their way and burn $4.00 in fuel to save $0.02 per gallon at the gas station..
    2 points
  6. As of yesterday, the fee has not yet dropped.. Nobody, apparently not even the FCC knows when it ever will, but the latest rumors/guess/hopes/dreams suggest sometime in 2022.. And no, AFAIK, you will not find anything in the multi-million dollar dumpster-fire that is the FCC website that will tell you anything about the what current status is for the changes.
    2 points
  7. rdunajewski

    Welcome!

    Welcome to the new forums! Unfortunately, over the last year or so we've had serious problems with our previous board software (phpBB and vBulletin), so I did some shopping around and decided that Invision Power Board is the way to go. Between vBulletin and this new software, I've had to lay out over $400, so I didn't make the decision lightly. While it's possible to migrate the posts from the previous software, I decided it wasn't worth the effort. I prefer having a clean platform and I will be tying the forum software to your main user accounts, so you no longer need two accounts for the site. This extra step will take some time for me to implement, so I'm going to lock down user registrations so we don't have duplicate accounts everywhere. Keep a look out for an update in the near future! So without further ado, welcome to the new forums! I hope this will be our last migration for many years to come, and donations to help offset the software licenses would be very much appreciated.
    1 point
  8. (FYI: I am adding this prefacing text to my original post to tip manufacturers and readers off that I am creating a new reply today, 9/2, which will serve as a running, bullet list summary of the various points. You can go there for a quicker summary and look throughout this entire post for more specifics. Back to the original post...) A post to GMRS radio manufacturers... (For other folks, admittedly this post is a bit lengthy. This is because my main target audience are radio manufacturers who might read this forum, so I wanted to include details for their benefit. Of course, if not a manufacturer, feel free to continue reading if you'd like.) I'm fairly recent to GMRS. Even so, in that short time I've found myself in astonished [not in a good way] amazement regarding radio design decisions, quality control issues, and documentation issues. Taking these one at a time (and throwing in the bonus topic of price creep) ... Radio Design Decisions Hopefully manufacturers realize that many people buying what-should-be-more-capable GMRS radios want to use them with GMRS repeaters and not just to talk with their children on simplex. However, the design decisions I've witnessed leave me in stunned it-can't-be disbelief: + Some radios allow for the storage of the eight GMRS repeater pair channels in only eight memories. This entirely misses the mark that repeater users may need to access repeaters which use the same freq pair but with different access tones. What are GMRS repeater users expected to do in this case? Keep programming / reprogramming the tones as the users switch between those repeaters? This is inconvenient and annoying. It is even more inconvenient if the radio has to be programmed with a PC and programming cable instead of being programmable in the field using a radio's keypad. + Though I'm not sure, I seem to recall reading that at least one radio was designed with access tones in an all or nothing mode. That is, specifying an access tone applied it to all of the stored frequencies. Not good. And even if this was not the case, some radios do not (or did not) support split tones. Split tones are important for GMRS repeater use. These days some repeaters utilize a DCS transmit tone and a CTCSS receive tone, or vice versa, or two different CTCSS tones, or two different DCS tones. Split tone capability please. + Some radios were released with narrow band only. For people with wide band radios, the apparent volume of a narrow band transmission is lower, which can be annoying to listen to. Capable GMRS radios (i.e., "non-bubble-pack" variety) especially should be designed with selectable wide band and narrow band capability. Quality Control Issues It's amazing what quality control issues were released to consumers: + Without specifying which manufacturers, even recently released radios capable of both wide and narrow band were factory pre-programmed with memories set to narrow band. So right away, especially non-bubble-pack radio users will likely want to change those to wide band. This is not convenient if such radios must be programmed via a PC and programming cable, and even worse if the cable is not provided with the radio. A before-it's-released-to-the-consumer quality check should have detected and prevented this. + Similar to the above, without specifying which manufacturers, some recently released radios were factory pre-programmed with access tones stored in the memories. Not good. For example, if a particular memory had CTCSS receive tone 156.7 stored and the radio is set to use that memory, that means a transmission would be heard only if the corresponding 156.7 transmit tone is transmitted by a sender. This would be bad especially for new users - they might not even realize that they are not receiving transmissions which don't send the appropriate tone. And as above, this is a irritant if such radios require a PC and programming cable to correct this, and even worse if the cable is not included with the radio. A before-it's-released-to-the-consumer quality check should have detected and prevented this. + OEM programming software is often buggy. Or the ability to copy/paste whole row(s) or selected cells of programming data is not supported. This makes programming painful. Documentation Issues To put it kindly, often the documentation, especially for Chinese radios, is lacking. Important details are omitted. The English is poor. Please hire people with a better command of English. But that is not enough. Also make sure that the document writers understand radios well enough to know what to write. Both of these skills are needed to create worthwhile documentation. Price Creep I've been noticing price creep recently. For example, one manufacturer released a radio not long ago, then fairly recently released an updated model for $20 more, and then released an even more recent model shortly later for $50 more than the first model. I'm not saying necessarily that the two latter radios do not warrant their increased prices, but the higher prices in rapid succession have been noticed by others as well. This manufacturer also sells a mobile GMRS radio that is a bit shy of $400, which is in the mucho dinero level of the established, big name manufacturers. Again, I'm not saying necessarily that this manufacturer doesn't deserve such prices, but as the saying goes, "people are beginning to talk." This manufacturer can afford to charge these prices at least currently due to the design features incorporated in their radios versus the past, lacking offerings from their competitors. But if their competitors incorporate such features at more modest prices, they might woo customers away. Such is the waltz that is capitalism. Consumers are noticing the rapidity with which the increasingly priced radios with incremental improvements (perhaps an intentional business model) are released. As such, the consumers and their wallets might hold off on future purchases for a few beats to see what's coming 'round the bend. Examples of Good Execution I didn't want to provide only examples of bad execution. Here are some examples of good execution: + I don't know what Wouxun did or didn't do in say the last five years, but they seem to have their act together in the more recent past I'm aware of. For example, I purchased a KG-905G radio recently. Rightfully so, it did not arrive from the factory programmed in narrow band for channels in which wide band is permissible. Rightfully so, it did not arrive with access tones factory pre-programmed in memories instead of the more desirable case of no factory pre-programmed tones. Also, this radio allows a user to store multiple versions of the same repeater freqs with different tones. + Randy, from youtube channel "NotaRubicon Productions," reviewed the newly released Wouxun KG-935G handheld GMRS radio recently. It is apparent that the designers understand features to include which facilitate the use of this radio. Or possibly they included such features due to listening to influencers such as Randy and/or buytwowayradios.com. For example, the radio can be operated in a dual receive mode. To make it readily apparent which of the two selectable channels is the one that will be transmitted on when pressing the PTT button, an attention-getting red bar is present in the portion of the display corresponding to that frequency. Nice. Now let's take the case in which dual receive is active and one steps away from the radio but can hear that a transmission was received. Was it frequency A or B? There is an indicator which shows which frequency last received a transmission. Nice. But let's say you're a person who likes to keep things simple. You might find dual receive confusing or annoying. Dual receive is selectable; one is not forced to use it. Nice. * Recently, buytwowayradios.com has made the Wouxun KG-XS20G mobile radio available for purchase. While I'm waiting for reviews of this radio (believe one will be coming soon from Randy), a feature I like is one that was abandoned by many manufacturers, including the big name $$$ ones. I'm referring to the use of the sturdy, old-style mic connector. This is the connector which utilizes the strain-relieved mic cord secured by a rotating, threaded locking collar instead of the RJ-45 type of connector. I, and plenty of others, dislike the RJ-45 type of connector, especially for mobile radios. Disclosures + I have no connection with Wouxun, other than I purchased their KG-905G radio. I mention them simply because I like many of their design decisions. In case anyone thinks that I'm an automatic Wouxun fan-boy, that is not the case. For example, I wish the KG-905G radio was fully field programmable via it's key pad and knobs. As far as I know, to add or change frequencies in its memories, a PC and programming cable is required. Once that's been done, one can use the radio's limited keypad and knobs to specify or change things such as access tones, power level, and wide or narrow band. While this is better than radios that don't allow for any or next-to-nothing programmability from their keypad/knobs, I wish that the KG-905G was more field programmable in addition to the PC and programming cable method. Since the keypad of this radio is basic (i.e., numeric keys are not included), even if a convoluted way of inputting or updating frequencies could be done via the radio's keypad and knobs, I would like that. This would make the radio more flexible when traveling or otherwise away from home. + I have no connection with Randy nor his NotaRubicon youtube channel. I mention them only because he and his channel provide spot-on information about GMRS and GMRS radios. + I have no connection with buytwowayradios.com other than that's the web site from which I bought the KG-905G radio and some accessories. It is my understanding that BTWR may have interfaced with manufacturers such as Wouxun to drive design decisions for certain, uniquely-offered radios. If so, BTWR is a good asset for the GMRS world. And if that helps the manufacturer create desirable products which differentiate them from competitors and therefore drives sales, it's a win-win. Summary For the radio manufacturer's, I've provided examples of problematic radio designs, quality control issues, documentation issues, and a potential warning about increasing price creep. I've also provided examples of good execution. Finally, while providing radios with good features is nice, it is important that manufacturers also ensure reliability. The allure of whiz-bang features is long forgotten if a radio/its battery/etc fail a short time after the warranty period ends. But the bad reputation for such a manufacturer will exist long after in this case. Bad or non-existent after-purchase support also falls in this category. Note: The opinions expressed are my own. The opinions of others may vary.
    1 point
  9. Must be PEARL, no? Before the ARPANET and in the same sentence with C... and F...-IV, let not these names be uttered after dark.
    1 point
  10. Actually I took SNOBOL4 the next semester. SNOBOL4 pattern-matching uses a backtracking algorithm similar to that used in the logic programming language Prolog, which provides pattern-like constructs via DCGs. This algorithm makes it easier to use SNOBOL as a logic programming language than is the case for most languages. SNOBOL stores variables, strings and data structures in a single garbage-collected heap. A simple example: OUTPUT = "What is your name?" Username = INPUT Username "J" :S(LOVE) Username "K" :S(HATE) MEH OUTPUT = "Hi, " Username :(END) LOVE OUTPUT = "How nice to meet you, " Username :(END) HATE OUTPUT = "Oh. It's you, " Username END
    1 point
  11. I think the lesson here is that if all you want is a cheap simplex radio to talk short distances in your group, then by all means buy a couple Midland radios. They will unfortunately be low performance narrow band radios by design. If you want to talk through repeaters and talk to other licensees, you need a commercial grade radio like many of the Kenwood radios. They are plentiful from used market at cheap price. They will have wide band capability, better receivers, multiple CTCSS ( PL ) / DCSS (DCS), split tone , repeater capability. Etc Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk
    1 point
  12. MichaelLAX

    Repeater question

    Not if you are a Proud Boy insurrecting at the Capitol Bldg! ...tortured, that is!?
    1 point
  13. stockjock

    Repeater question

    I will if I can figure it out. As a side note, just received a Baofeng UV-5RUSH, which I think is just a UV5R with higher output that really isn't higher output, a programming cable, a mic/earpiece, and a bigger battery. Pretty sure I will be imprisoned and tortured if I use it for GMRS though.
    1 point
  14. n4gix

    Repeater question

    Actually, "Pofung" is how "Baofeng" is pronounced in Mandarin! ?
    1 point
  15. MichaelLAX

    Repeater question

    Maybe: Tone Scanning - you are listening to a conversation on a repeater and the scan stops on the CTCSS or Digital tone that they are using, so that we can program our HT to use that tone to transmit (and be heard) on the repeater. Let me know if the feature actually results in a Tone and if that tone gets you into the repeater. Thanks! Let us know if you can get into a local repeater successfully, as well!
    1 point
  16. stockjock

    Repeater question

    I do reviews for "a major online retailer" and I can snag a lot of these CCRs for free, although I do have to pay tax on the fair market value. There are so many that are super similar to others and have one name on the listing but another on the radio (usually Baofeng). Some claim to be 8 watts but most or all seem to be testing at around 5 watts output. But yes, so many versions of the same, or very similar, radios. I think I had about 6 in my review offerings and I grabbed 2 of them.
    1 point
  17. wayoverthere

    Repeater question

    Looks like the same radio sold as the tyt th-uv88 as well, just locked down for gmrs (like so many others) That aside, DPL is another name for DCS, where PL is equivalent to CTCSS.
    1 point
  18. pcradio

    Repeater question

    I have the G version of that antenna. Very nice and does help. I had the GM-30 for a while, testing to see if I wanted it or the Retevis RT76P. I went with the RT76P, but the GM-30 was nice enough. It did have a scanning feature as I recall. The fun of these CCR's (cheap Chinese radios) is finding out which radio is actually the same by three different brands!
    1 point
  19. MichaelLAX

    Repeater question

    I found the manual and it looks like Paragraph 6.3 is CTCSS scanning and Paragraph 6.4 is DCS scanning (digital tones). Listen in when you hear a conversation on a repeater channel and try it and see if they can hear you once you select the proper tone. Let us know if it works!
    1 point
  20. MichaelLAX

    Repeater question

    WELCOME to GMRS! If it were me, I would go up on the repeater and ask permission there and if they are testy, tell them you wrote and no reply. Since there are only 8 GMRS repeater pairs, I like to SCAN and if I hear obvious repeater communications on those channel, I take notes. Can your rig "scan" CTCSS tones, that is, tell you what tone is being used by the repeater users when they transmit. This is a very handy feature and I may buy another HT just to get that feature! My "ham radio" Yaesu FT-857d can do that feature for me now, but it cannot transmit on the GMRS channels; only receive. It is necessary to know the repeater tone for your transmissions to be "heard" by the repeater. Using tones for your reception is optional; they help eliminate interference to you from other repeaters on the same frequency. Since I am an explorer, I never use reception tones, so I can always hear what other activity is present and then do some tone and location research about the others I hear. You have, of course, looked at the San Diego area of the map here on MyGMRS? UPDATE: the previous poster, OffRoaderX, has a terrific series of YouTube instructional videos about GMRS and other topics: Search NotARubicon on YouTube and Subscribe and Thumbs Up him, if you like his videos!
    1 point
  21. OffRoaderX

    Repeater question

    The best way to find repeaters in your area is to check the MyGMRS database, 2nd best way is to hook up with the local GMRS gang and find out what they are using.. 3rd best way is to just monitor channels 15-22 and see if you hear anyone, but then you need to figure out the tone to use which can be difficult.. The tones/codes need to match up with the repeater.. you have to use the TX/Input tone, or you wont be able to activate the repeater/talk on it. the RX/output tone is optional and used only to quite-out other repeaters on the same channel. Generally what you do is find the repeater, then save the tone(s) on the repeater-channel in your radio, then you dont have to worry about them again.
    1 point
  22. There is allso the issue of support costs. Developing the necessary infrastructure to support a radio that retails at a low price point can end up costing the company more than sales returns.
    1 point
  23. You don't have to re-type all text. Copy all text from your post and paste it in Notepad. Go edit your post on the forum, delete all text, copy all your text from Notepad and paste it in the EDIT window. Copying from Notepad and pasting into EDIT window should remove all formatting. PS. Ha ha. I see you already fixed your font while I was typing reply.
    1 point
  24. I'm new to radio and was shocked too at how bad, like completely terrible, the execution has been. No wonder Wouxun is taking off like they are. The term in my industry for this is called Product Management and User Experience. All of these companies need to do some user and field testing, get feedback, iterate, etc. I was trying to standardized on Retevis for my uses. The new models from Wouxun are very interesting. I don't need or want a $400 radio that lives in a glass case. Need something that can bet beat up. However, I do appreciate fine art and there is a place for $400.
    1 point
  25. Trying not to, though someone turned up a pile of punch cards at work not too long ago. I hear we actually still have things running on COBOL, not that they let me near much of anything...I've ticked off too many of the helpdesk techs over the years.
    1 point
  26. I drove 180 miles to get free fast charging from the Calif Department of Transportation in Kettleman City for my EV (and some BBQ at Bravo Farms)! Hahaha ?
    1 point
  27. JLeikhim

    Sheriff on FRS?

    I think his dual band base antenna is presenting a ton of signal at 155.850 MHz and his Chinese receivers are overloading and creating third harmonic on or near 467.6375 MHz . A quick check would to put a UHF single band whip on the radio and see if the signal is radically reduced or goes away. It is too coincidental that the third harmonic falls right on channel. I would not rule out a spurious signal from the sheriff repeater, but we are talking about a $30K repeater and duplexer versus a $35 Chinese receiver. Any bets? Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk
    1 point
  28. The revamp of the MyGMRS forums looks amazing on desktop and functions very well on mobile. However, these "Open this topic on..." nag screens that pop up every time on mobile browsers are very annoying: There doesn't appear to be a way to permanently disable this as every time I navigate to the forums page I see it. "Chrome" is always shown as the option for all Chromium-based browsers, and this yields a confusing UX. Who even uses Tapatalk anymore in this day and age of mobile-first web development? So many forums I subscribe to have dropped support for this app long ago, RadioReference included. Anyway, my 2¢...
    1 point
  29. The overlap between simplex and repeater could be a good thing if you're using a "highway channel" for max range, as anyone tuning in for this will hear both the repeaters and the simplex calls. Another plus of .675 is higher power vs 5 watts on the 462 interstitials.
    1 point
  30. Agreed about the “channels” as my Icom IC-F21GM has the channels laid out more logically: 1-8 are the repeater pairs, & 9-15 are the interstitials (there are no FRS 467MHz frequencies). I would people would go back to saying frequency instead of the illogical channel numbers.
    1 point
  31. Yup. The question was already answered. If there is going to be a standard highway/road channel, where one has been proposed and used for a while, we should stick with it. Trying to establish another one just confuses people and likely guarantees nether get used much. Unless there is a very good reason to change it I don’t see the point trying to establish something different.
    1 point
  32. Gee, I'm a little confused here Miichael. When I tune to a repeater I thought my receiver was set to the output of the repeater rather than the repeater input frequency. Is it different in your radio?
    1 point
  33. As long as you are not transmitting on the 467.000 repeater input part of the band you are not interfering with a repeater. Its not a prevailing opinion, its an FCC reg. The 50 watt simplex frequencies are the same as the repeater output frequencies, they are shared. 7 miles would be possible with well elevated antennas. A directional antenna isn't that much help in the GMRS frequency band if there are obstructions. Height is might. I have made 11 mile VHF simplex contacts with my Anytone 50 watt VHF mobile, UHF/GMRS is harder without pure line of sight.
    1 point
  34. What's the make, model and type of duplexer? Duplexers always lose some power, I've measured losses like that first hand on the Jesai, Fumei and other Chinese flatpacks around the 6-7dB range which is exactly the power drop you're measuring. They're really only acceptable down to about a 7mhz split or bigger, not the 5mhz split we're used to. If it's something with a reputable brand name, it's not normal. a Celwave/Phelps Dodge or Telewave duplexer will have insertion losses around 1.5dB or so, if you take your time tuning those you can get that down to 0.8dB or so; if you get something like that the 42W you measured would be up around 35W after passing through...
    1 point
  35. The most official designation of frequencies as channel numbers that I have every found comes from here: § 95.563 FRS channels. The FRS is allotted 22 channels, each having a channel bandwidth of 12.5 kHz. All of the FRS channels are also allotted to the General Mobile Radio Service (GMRS) on a shared basis. The FRS channel center frequencies are set forth in the following table: 1 ................................................ 462.5625 2 ................................................ 462.5875 3 ................................................ 462.6125 4 ................................................ 462.6375 5 ................................................ 462.6625 6 ................................................ 462.6875 7 ................................................ 462.7125 8 ................................................ 467.5625 9 ................................................ 467.5875 10 .............................................. 467.6125 11 .............................................. 467.6375 12 .............................................. 467.6625 13 .............................................. 467.6875 14 .............................................. 467.7125 15 .............................................. 462.5500 16 .............................................. 462.5750 17 .............................................. 462.6000 18 .............................................. 462.6250 19 .............................................. 462.6500 20 .............................................. 462.6750 21 .............................................. 462.7000 22 .............................................. 462.7250 And here https://apps.fcc.gov/kdb/GetAttachment.html?id=biZxuanIfZOUqdjvLHdsyw%3D%3D&desc=888861%20D01%20Part%2095%20GMRS%20FRS%20v01&tracking_number=239603 https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/95.563 Although within part 95e, standard channel number are not defined as they are in the FRS, it does seem logical that since they are defined for FRS and both services share 22 of the same frequencies that there is a logical numeric correlation that can (as has) been made between the two. Michael WRHS965 KE8PLM
    1 point
  36. VHF and UHF and shorter frequencies are mostly line of sight. The HF (aka shortwave) is reflected from ionosphere and gives you a global reach. VHF and UHF sometimes are too reflected from atmospheric layers (tunneling) and from ionosphere (E-layer reflections), but this type of propagation is accidental, not reliable at all. VHF and UHF can be reflected and diffracted from and by any sort of things - meteors, airplanes, buildings, rocky canyons. This is how you get non- line of site communications on V- and UHF. Hams do these modes for fun, you can look up airplane scattering. There is also a ground wave - when RF truly goes around the the curvature of this miserable planet, over the mountains and oceans. But the shorter the the wavelength, the less pronounced the effect. It's pretty much nonexistent on 40m and shorter. Best examples of ground wave are MW and LW radio broadcasts.
    1 point
  37. Once again, for some reason the original post has been edited, but in this case, the subject line sums up the original question, and several posts agreed on a valid answer. There is already a well established "Highway" or "Travel Channel" for GMRS, and it is 462.675 with a CTCSS Tone of 141.3Hz. Again, on a Midland MicroMobile, (and many other GMRS or Combo radios) that would be channel 20 with a "Privacy Code" of 22. (However, check your radio's owner's manual for the privacy or quiet code that matches 141.3 Hz. Not all radios are mapped the same for these codes.) This frequency can be used in repeater mode, or simplex if a repeater is not available in the area. ...and if you don't want to miss any possible action, then use WRAF233's suggestion, and just set the radio to "SCAN". Also of note, just yesterday, I was traveling on US HWY 81 in North Central Kansas, and heard 2 truckers using channel 20-22.
    1 point
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