FCC

[JCR]

First off, I am a law abiding citizen. I would like to know if anyone has ever had a inspection or run in with the FCC? I have been checked many times by possum cops for fishing and hunting and I was just wondering about the feds..... I was once checked during bow season 5 times in one month by the same CO, same property, same time of day, same LIFE TIME LICENCE.... WTH! .... he questioned me about me getting back to my truck kinda late. I explained that I had about a half mike walk in and out...

I got checked by a federal game warden once, while duck hunting. I had no idea that they made AHs that pure.

The best one….. I was working on a custom load for 1 of my rifles, on my property. I was not shooting rapidly. A conservation officer pulled in my drive and inquired what I was doing. After disturbing the heck out of me, he said he needed to inspect my rifle. I said for what. He said he had to inspect the fire control group. After explaining to him that he had a better chance of groping me personally than taking my rifle apart, I told him I would disassemble the gun and show him. I told him I had my doubts about him knowing what he was inspecting, and he seemed upset… he went away mad, I think?

Anyway, just wondering about big brother.... a new question for the year. Strictly curiosity.

Happy new year everyone!

WROP891

Edited January 1, 2022 by JCR
just thought I'd add. and spelling.

[OffRoaderX]

 

[n4gix]

He's absolutely correct. The FCC simply hasn't got the budget they once had to enforce the rules any longer.

[PACNWComms]

Short answer, yes. Long answer, I used to work in the oil industry, providing emergency communications services through a sort of "insurance policy" funded by many oil industry corporations that pooled their budget for response efforts. During: larger oil spills, a few floods, and some hurricane aftermath response periods, the Federal Communications Commission would check licenses of: vessels, corporation repeaters and radio infrastructure, and personnel. On several occasions this impacted how things were done: no more portable repeaters on ships for example, no more portable repeaters placed on roofs of buildings (each site had to have its own license), and all personnel working on vessel comms needed to get GROL's (General RadioTelephone Operators Licences), as previously there was an "emergency exemption" granted. At the beginning of 2013, all licenses and some radios were checked for narrowband in the appropriate bands that now required 25kHz to be changed to 12.5kHz spacing. When Motorola Trbo series radios were becoming popular, licences were checked for correct emissions designators. However, it was most often the U.S. Coast Guard that checked radio licenses, personnel training records, and with some of the fleet being in Puget Sound, information was also given to Candian authorities, where many of us had to get Restricted RadioTelephone Operator Licenses, essentially the Canadian version of a GROL to take radios into Canadian waters, with all the issues with operating along the border and associated waterways. 

Besides those instances, I sometimes had airport TSA wonder why I had a better radio than they did when traveling for work across the nation, carrying a multi-band Harris Unity XG-100P handheld. Packed next to it was a copy of the NIFOG (National Interoperability Field Operations Guide) and I still had a military affiliation that kept them at bay, but you could tell they just wanted to jack me up to paw through my gear. It appears you may have some power tripping people in your area. But, as others have mentioned, the FCC lacks funding for enforcement, and seems to go after those that have money and hardware, and then only when something else regulatory is taking place, such as an oil spill or refinery incident. In that case, they may even rely upon other government entities to do the work, such as with the Coast Guard and commercial vessel inspections. In my current work,with many counties public safety radio systems tied into large corporate radio networks, the biggest inspection element comes from the cellular phone companies making sure we are not impacting cell phone infrastructure with public safety radio infrastructure, while merging the two under FirstNet (Band 14). 

[gortex2]

I have had the pleasure in the past to work with the FCC. Mostly public safety related but did have one come check my GMRS repeater site. More out of curiosity of his. As said funds today are hard. Whats harder is the same as every field. Finding folks who want to do the job. They are still out there but the chance of a guy knocking on your door to check your radio is slim to none. 

[BoxCar]

The Enforcement Bureau is more focused on protecting the commercial users such as FM radio and cellular providers than individuals. They do go after major importers of equipment but not as aggressive as they used to.

[JCR]

SO...… if I knew someone who wanted to buy a high power dual band HT radio that had unauthorized frequencies on it, from a overseas supplier, I  could tell them they'll prolly be ok???

[PACNWComms]

6 hours ago, BoxCar said:

The Enforcement Bureau is more focused on protecting the commercial users such as FM radio and cellular providers than individuals. They do go after major importers of equipment but not as aggressive as they used to.

+1 on the protection of cellular providers. Much of my current interaction with the FCC involves the use of Bi-Directional Amplifiers (BDA) and Distributed Antenna Systems (DAS) that allow public safety radio coverage in large commercial buildings, to ensure that they are not impacting cell phone operation and location capabilities for 911 Public Safety Answering Points. Regulation of cellular phone amplifiers is also an issue, as older Wilson amplifiers did not discriminate between cellular phones and 800-956 MHz portable radios. Some amplifiers have been burned up when they get their front end burned by an in-band 5 watt handheld radio.

[MichaelLAX]

1 hour ago, JCR said:

SO...… if I knew someone who wanted to buy a high power dual band HT radio that had unauthorized frequencies on it, from a overseas supplier, I  could tell them they'll prolly be ok???

Could you be more specific?

Which HT?

High power? 10 watts?

Ham radio use on GMRS?

Does "he" plan to use it outside the technical specifications of GMRS while on GMRS (for example wide band and 5 watts on GMRS Channel 8-14)?

There are two different situations: Part 95 certified radios that can be made to transmit outside of GMRS; and "Ham radios" that can be made to transmit on GMRS.

For example: I have the Anytone AT-779UV, which is Part 95 certified for GMRS. The software provided by Anytone (and by Radioddity for their DB20-G clone) allows me to easily open up transmission for 2 meters, 70 cms and even MURS and I enjoy scanning all the available frequencies for some action.

Now I don't have much use for MURS, since I can transmit 18 watts on 2 meters.  But for testing purposes, I have programmed into my AT-779UV MURS 1, 2 and 3 (in narrow band) and Blue Dot (MURS 4) and Green Dot (MURS 5) in Wideband and all at low power given the 2 watt restriction on MURS.

I also have the Radioddity RD-5R HT (in the UV-5R configuration) that transmits analog and DMR on all the above listed bands.  I restrict my DMR to 2 meters and 70 cms.

But for convenience I do have it programmed for local GMRS repeaters and all the other simplex GMRS channels, so I can scan with it at my "easy chair" and communicate on my choice of band as necessary.

But other than for "testing" and "emergency" communications, no one (with substantial assets) is going to give you a "green light" or even commit themselves to a "probable ok" YMMV! 

PS: I loved the movie: Law Abiding Citizen, with Jamie Foxx and Gerard Butler!

[PACNWComms]

This is like asking if it is alright to "freeband" a radio for someone not knowing their: legal status, licenses held, or even country they plan to operate the radio within, after asking about FCC interaction and being a "law abiding citizen".....there will always be a few that ask a lot of questions about regulation. I know city and county-wide Auxiliary Communications Service (ACS) entities that dodge this question as well, but still let you look at their radio where you can confirm they are programmed or modified to be "wide open" which is to be expected for emergency use. As MichaelLAX states above, you will find it hard to get the green light from anyone that is credible or has a huge interest in the industry. It is not worth the risk to someone that actually has to make a living or administer a radio network where lives and large sums of money are involved. 

[JCR]

I guess I'm not sure of any of that.

[DownEastNC]

3 hours ago, JCR said:

SO...… if I knew someone who wanted to buy a high power dual band HT radio that had unauthorized frequencies on it, from a overseas supplier, I  could tell them they'll prolly be ok???

We're all adults here. You or your "friend" should be familiar with the FCC regulations. If you choose to use a radio in an illegal fashion then you do so at your own risk. You're asking about the likelihood of the FCC conducting an investigation. That all depends on how bad you piss someone off or perhaps interfere with commercial or public service broadcasting. I'm not sure if anyone knows the answer to that. By appearances, the FCC only goes after the most egregious offenders, but you never know when you might catch an agent that's having a really bad day and wants to make an example of you. Like many choices that we make in life, let your conscience be your guide.

 

[Blaise]

8 hours ago, MichaelLAX said:

I have the Anytone AT-779UV, which is Part 95 certified for GMRS. The software provided by Anytone (and by Radioddity for their DB20-G clone) allows me to easily open up transmission for 2 meters, 70 cms and even MURS

Really? My DB20-G is so locked down that Tx is only allowed on 22 of its channels, and all of those have preset frequencies!  I can't even clone a channel so that I have an open version and a version with pl codes...

[PACNWComms]

28 minutes ago, Blaise said:

Really? My DB20-G is so locked down that Tx is only allowed on 22 of its channels, and all of those have preset frequencies!  I can't even clone a channel so that I have an open version and a version with pl codes...

That is the "as shipped" configuration that is locked down. Like many Chinese imported radios, the FCC has locked down a bit on what configuration they can be imported with. However, there are many tutorials online that show how to "change" the base configuration, then you read a copy and modify that version to open up other bands and frequency options. A common problem with these radios is people try to read that "as shipped" configuration codeplug and then try to modify that version, getting an error when they try to write it back to the radio. This is so the manufacturer, importer, seller have some plausible deniability, as amateur users are legal in "modifying" their equipment as long as it meats legal regulation otherwise. Sort of like building your own radio, but using a pre-made kit a few decades ago, you start with a basic radio and modify it for amateur/multi-band/extended frequency use. 

[MichaelLAX]

2 hours ago, Blaise said:

Really? My DB20-G is so locked down that Tx is only allowed on 22 of its channels, and all of those have preset frequencies!  I can't even clone a channel so that I have an open version and a version with pl codes...

What is your firmware version? V2.30 and below easily opened up. 

[MichaelLAX]

10 hours ago, PACNWComms said:

However, there are many tutorials online that show how to "change" the base configuration, then you read a copy and modify that version to open up other bands and frequency options. 

Not even that hard; it is contained right in Radioddity's (and Anytone's) CPS Software:

Firstly, save a copy of your existing Codeplug before any changes are made (it is always best to do this with the radio as originally shipped, so as to have a "default" codeplug).

Then in the Model menu to Model Information menu in V2.01 of the Radioddity software:

 

Model: DB-20GUV

Frequencys: Change this from US GMRS to UHF(400 - 470) VHF(136 - 174 MHz).

Now program in new channels as needed.

There is a way to achieve this using the buttons on the unit, using the same buttons to get the firmware version:

Power down

Hold V/M button down

Power UP

Change Mode from GMRS to (136-174); (400-470) using the Up and Down arrow keys

Power down and Power Up again.

These radios show more efficiency on 2 meters and 70 cms than does my Yaesu FT-857d connected to the same antenna!  I now have an AT-779UV in the shack and one in my car.

[Blaise]

As always, you guys are amazing, and have data the great Google God can't provide me.

My firmware version is 2.33, and this trick works like a charm!

Now if I could only find a way to get the software to let me copy/paste!

 

[MichaelLAX]

46 minutes ago, Blaise said:

Now if I could only find a way to get the software to let me copy/paste!

I have to admit that this is one of the only two disadvantages I have found in this rig (the other being: no ability to scan for tones used; but I solved this problem with a $30 HT).

I had been expecting that maybe CHIRP would provide an upgrade, since this rig is so inexpensive, and selling like hotcakes; but I am told that someone needs to send them a unit to work on.

In the interim: be sure to include blank lines in your programming, so that when you want to update with a new channel; instead of it being at the end of the list, you can insert it within a category (Encode tones blocked for obvious reasons):

[Blaise]

Yeah, the blank row thing was my first thought.  Sadly, I still have to manually type every input on every line for my 90 or so standard channels!

[WyoJoe]

7 hours ago, Blaise said:

Now if I could only find a way to get the software to let me copy/paste!

 

It's easy to copy from one line to another on the Anytone version of the software. Since this software works for my radios, I haven't tried the Radioddity version, though I suspect it'll work the same way: Click on the channel number (the line header), the click CTRL-C to copy and CTRL-V to paste. There is no visual clue that this works until you see the line pasted into the software. Using "right click" on the mouse doesn't work (as you might expect it to), but the standard keyboard shortcuts do.

 

[PACNWComms]

38 minutes ago, WyoJoe said:

It's easy to copy from one line to another on the Anytone version of the software. Since this software works for my radios, I haven't tried the Radioddity version, though I suspect it'll work the same way: Click on the channel number (the line header), the click CTRL-C to copy and CTRL-V to paste. There is no visual clue that this works until you see the line pasted into the software. Using "right click" on the mouse doesn't work (as you might expect it to), but the standard keyboard shortcuts do.

 

I can confirm that this works on the Radioddity version as well. I still use that version for the DB20-G as it helps me keep software separate for my many and growing list of Chinese radios. (I have to do the same thing with Motorola CPS as well at times, as the icons were used on several series of Motorola gear over the years as well.) Having Chirp, Radioddity and Anytone software with different icons helps me at times. Thank you for posting, this helps everyone.

[Blaise]

Quote

It's easy to copy from one line to another

 I should have been more specific.  I meant copy and paste into the software...

[MichaelLAX]

Let's move this DB20-G (AT-779UV) discussion to a new thread I have created here.