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Eight frequencies have been designated in regulations for repeaters to transmit upon. They are the same eight frequencies used by both FRS and GMRS for simplex communications and they are numbers 15-22 in the FRS regulations: (a) 462 MHz main channels. Only mobile, hand-held portable, repeater, base and fixed stations may transmit on these 8 channels. The channel center frequencies are: 462.5500, 462.5750, 462.6000, 462.6250, 462.6500, 462.6750, 462.7000, and 462.7250 MHz. Eight other frequencies, 5 MHz higher in frequency, have been designated by regulation for transmission by stations wishing to transmit to a repeater for relay by the repeater: (c) 467 MHz main channels. Only mobile, hand-held portable, control and fixed stations may transmit on these 8 channels. Mobile, hand-held portable and control stations may transmit on these channels only when communicating through a repeater station or making brief test transmissions in accordance with § 95.319(c). The channel center frequencies are: 467.5500, 467.5750, 467.6000, 467.6250, 467.6500, 467.6750, 467.7000, and 467.7250 MHz. All GMRS certified radios pair the eight channels in those two groups into repeater pairs. Thus, a radio transmitting to a repeater on 467.5500 MHz receives from that same repeater on 462.5500 MHz. The FCC did not assign channel numbers to the repeater pairs in the GMRS regulations, but they did assign numbers to the first 22 channels in the FRS regulations https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-47/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-95/subpart-B Because channels 15-22 (462 MHz main channels) are dual purpose, as shared simplex channels for FRS and GMRS and as repeater output channels, some manufacturers refer to the repeater pairs as RP15 - RP22. Others simply continue the numbering sequence by referring to the repeater pairs as channels 23-30. Other call them repeater channels 1-8. The best thing to do is to be aware of the frequencies allocated in regulation and learn what your radio manufacturer calls them.

Ok, so I dug the mag mount antenna out and tested that as well as retesting the others. Here's what I got this morning: Mag Mount: SWR 1.19, 45 Watts Ghost: SWR 1.36, 50 Watts MXTA26: SWR 1.10, 46 Watts So apparently it was the meter or operator error . Needless to say I am both pleased with this morning's results and a bit embarrassed by my panic. I certainly appreciate you guys helping me sort this out, as well as your patience!

Could you show us a picture of your multimeter. For an open circuit it should read something like OL. Of course if you’ve got a probe in each hand it’s measuring the conductivity of your body and all bets are off. For a continuous conductor it should read in some tenths of an ohm. End to end - shield: End to end - center: center to shield - open circuit (my probe slipped while I was trying to hold it one handed to take the picture but you get the idea). It shows that it’s an open circuit (OL) and it is on the Megohm range:

I just saw a video on the Youtube that explains this exact question:

As you can see from my meter foible, I can not afford too much hubris. Good job figuring it out! On many occasions a good night’s sleep has yielded better results.

I don't think so, but senility runs in the family...

Meter was connected backwards? The radio was on the antenna side of the meter, and antenna on the radio side?

There are a few repeaters in my area that I have requested access. One of them I requested access twice in a year and a half (private repeater). The owner states that you have to give him certain information including a valid phone number so he can conduct a phone interview. Of course, I never heard from the owner. I don't care enough to look into it more. The rules for requesting access was a red flag but I tried anyway. On the other hand I have requested access on some other repeaters, not in my area, and received permission in a day or two. If there is an open repeater listed, with tones, that requires you to request access and I don't hear from the owner I will just use the repeater. If questioned by the owner I will then ask permission on the air. That has never happened. I don't understand why there are still owners that have repeaters listed as open, with the tones listed, yet they still want you to request access. I don't tend to play well with others and my use of radio is to make quick contact with people I know for a specific purpose. If repeater owners go the route of drama I don't get mad, I just erase the info from my radio and move on. It is their machine so they can have their rules. On the HAM side, if some moron wants to critique my radio usage I just finish my transmission and ignore them. I don't use radio, Amateur or GMRS, for meeting random basement dwellers in the darkest hours of the night so I don't really run into those type of repeater people very often. Don't take it too seriously.

Well, that’s embarrassing. The black lead was in the current reading A socket rather than the Com socket. Obviously it must be low impedance (perhaps just a fuse) between the two sockets, but it’s not right. Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa!

I was thinking the same...back to the ground plane and no mount, and see if the swr goes back to the high 3's. if so, it would seem like the mount is the issue, in some way. if not, that would point to something is awry with the meter.

Move the radios at least 50 feet apart, then try again.

I rarely use Rx tones; I want to hear everything and rarely confront two repeaters on the same frequency.

Speaking of keeping the FCC happy, I've recently picked up for myself a copy of "Mastering GMRS Radio " So far, it's a pretty good reference book to have on hand. After all, there's lot of information that help one develop a lesson plan for speaking at groups meetings, not necessarily radio clubs, because after all, that's nothing new to the majority Amateur Radio Operators and other Radio Communication enthesis. I'm talking about Scout Troops or other social groups. Well, I don't I will comment or post something before the Holidays are over, but just in case enjoy no matter what holiday you observe. Take Care and Be Well!

Yes, that's my backup plan if Plan A does not work, but if they use a DCS tone, it is quite a feat to figure it out. Plan A for me is to take my Baofeng UV13 up to the repeater, tune it to the input frequency and scan for the Tones when the repeater is being actively used by others.

Use an antenna with a spring. My Midland MXTA26 for GMRS has one built in and the Larsen 2/70B has the optional spring. Going in low clearance parking garages is no longer an issue other than the noise of them scraping the concrete ceiling. This is on an F150. As for ghost antennas, if you have an insatiable craving to endure poor performance and generate heat, definitely use one. As he old hotrod saying goes, there's no replacement for displacement. Same with using the proper antenna compared to a compromised one.

If there's any changes in the FCC, it probably won't happen as fast as we would like it to. I can tell you now, that FCC is not about to give their blessings to allow us ability to use part 90 radios for GMRS, even though most of us have disregarded that little stump in the road. I for one would like to see the FCC remove that stump in the road, but that's not likely happen, at least not during Trump's second term. Now. getting back to linking repeaters, sure the majority of us knew that the FCC prohibited, but yet we pressed our luck. Right now, I 'd have to say that the Oakland A's have better of coming back to Philadelphia or the Dodger's move back to Brooklyn before the FCC grants us permission to link repeaters or set up a simplex network via internet.

For portability get a Uniden scanner. It will scan 25-50 channels per second. The Baofeng will scan 3 per second. And the Uniden will cover from 10m (maybe even 11m) to 33cm. For "as many frequencies as possible", an SDR. Even the lowly RTL-SDRV4 will pick up from 300kHz to 1.72GHz, with some antenna swapping necessary to get all that.

It's transmitting at least as far as the HT in the house. I just remembered that I have the Mag Mount antenna that came with the radio! Headed out to test the meter on that that now.

First you had an SWR of 3.78. After making changes you got the 19:1 reading. Now, you said that the meter no longer reads anything when the mic is keyed. Is it possible that the radio is no longer transmitting after that high SWR that it experienced? I realize that the radio should protect itself from extreme SWRs but maybe this time it did not??

It happens. Edit: I’m laughing with you of course and not at you because (1) I missed it myself and focused on the screen with “OL” and (2) I’ve done that before.

So, just the power up screen? Maybe it is the meter. Try taking it all the way back to where you started. Do you have a local friend with a radio? I'm going to bed. Maybe someone else can think of something to try.

Yes, and your meter has two different ohms ranges - you’re in the x10 range which would appear to be open even if it’s not. I would test the circuits that should be closed using the x10 range and test the circuits that should be open using the x1k range. So now the SWR meter is blank or just doesn’t change? Also, I went back to the top. You thought you had a bad cable so you ordered another and it shows the same SWR of 19.99? I am sorry, but I doubt that two separate cables are bad. That leaves something else, the mount, the ground plane kit, or the antenna and I suspect the mount since you’ve tried it with and without the ground plane and with two different antennas. Or it’s the SWR meter. Honestly I’m just guessing but if I were there I would eliminate one thing after another.

What range does your multimeter read? Some of my coworkers tell me that a circuit is open, then I find they are using meters that only read up to 6k ohms and the circuit was a 10K ... wasn't open, but their meter couldn't tell

Also with the H3, if you switch startup-modes, IIRC, you will lose any custom programming.

The easiest way is to swap it out to another. Otherwise check for continuity from one end to the other on both the shield and the center conductor. But, the shield and center conductor must not be shorted to each other.

If you have a multimeter, disconnect from the radio and antenna/mount and check continuity on the outer connectors end to end, the center pin end to end, and do the center to outer. First 2 should have continuity, 3rd should not. Same story connected to the mount...center pin on the mount to center on the cable, outer threaded to connector on cable. I tried one of those Nagoya ground planes and didn't see good results, but that 19.99 is saying a broken connection or short to me too

It might be the meter, but I bet it’s either the cable or the mount.

Did the repeaters change their PL tone? Did you play with the RX tone? With the H3 I know if you play with the RX it'll reset the TX tone. You have to either set the TX alone without doing anything to the RX. Or set the RX and the TX will be set also. It you reset the RX, the TX goes back to no tone.

I was able to locate a local radio dealer (Adams Electronics 248 669 6800) who was kind enough to help me program the 462.600 MHz repeater frequency on my Maxon GMRS 210+3 radio. The steps involved are as below: Turn off the radio Open the back cover of the radio by removing four screws securing the back cover. Press the "tack switch" switch (see attached picture) once which is located toward the left side on the circuit board Turn on the radio Use the UP or DOWN button to go to a desired repeater channel (9 or 10) on the radio Press and hold the FUNCTION button on the radio and press the CONFIG button on the radio then release both buttons Turn the TUNE/M-CH button to the 462.600 MHz display Press the FUNTION button followed by the CLR button to save this setting You may want to program CTCSS tones for Receive or Transmit if required by the repeater Hope this helps anyone who might run into the same issue as mine. GMRS210+3 Tack Switch.pdf

Am i understanding that you have 3 radios, and all 3 stopped working as expected, at basically the same time? if so, then something is highly suspect.. How are you determining that they "no longer connect to repeaters"? Are you trying to connect to the same repeater? is that repeater up/online? have you tried getting closer to the repeater(s)? many questions, but something is not right...

I've had multiple requests pending for over a year. If the repeater is listed as open, and I've had no response to a request for access, I just use it. If the owner doesn't want me on it they'll let me know. I'd do the same if it were my repeater; i.e. just turn it on and let it go.

If they are both in GMRS configuration then yes. The only time it is a problem is when one radio has tones set different from the other. If they can listen on 162.4000 through 162.5500 then yes.

I have two repeaters within 50 miles of me that are on the same channel. One is east of me and one is west of me. The east repeater does not use tones while the west repeater does use tones. Most of the time I don't hardly ever hear the east repeater due to terrain between us but I can easily get into the west repeater. At times I get both repeaters. When I am picking up the east repeater it is usually at an s4 or s5 on my radio's signal strength meter. And I normally get the west repeater at an s6 or s7. The east repeater without tones definitely interferes with my ability to talk on and hear the west repeater when I am receiving both at the same time. So yes two repeaters that are about 100 miles apart can and will cause issues with anyone in between the two trying to talk on just one of the repeaters. Conditions and locations will have an effect.

Ended up measuring the Tram antenna today. Following the video Steve posted, I trimmed 5/8 inch off the first section, and about 1/4 to 3/8 of the next two sections. I have not got a chance to test it yet, but for what is worth that is how far off it was. On a side note, DX engineering is sending a new Comet CA-712EFC as I have 1.5 SWR on 462MHz and 2.5 SWR on 467MHz, and the antenna cannot be trimmed. Reading the reviews on this antenna it is hit or miss how it is cut, but the good ones are supposed to be great. We shall see.

Some Nagoyas are counterfeits made in China. If you got a genuine Nagoya that isn't superior, that is unusual. Contacts made thru repeaters are often poor for comparisons because repeater antennas are often mounted much higher than is practical with HT or mobile units AND repeater receivers are dramatically better radios than HT's. A much better test is simplex HT to HT.

Good job! Did you measure the elements while you were there? You are still losing power, obviously, but you definitely deliver more power to the antenna now. Here’s how I cheat : I measure the swr at the antenna. I attach my Bluetooth capable antenna analyzer directly to the antenna and read it on my phone after raising the antenna, but of course I understand that I’ll need to lower the antenna and remove the analyzer. That’s a huge advantage that an analyzer has over a wattmeter; an analyzer generates its own signal and measures both the forward and reflected power then calculates the SWR. But I also generally measure the SWR before I put an antenna up in the first place. Lifting it up above the ground often lowers the SWR but I want to make sure it’s good enough before I put it up. You could also calculate what the SWR is at the antenna based on the measured SWR at the radio and losses anticipated for LMR400. It’s the same calculation I did earlier.

Installed 75 feet of LMR400, N Male One End, DXE PL259 with a 10 foot tall Comet 9dB antenna mounted on a 10 foot pole. As Steve mentioned would likely happen, SWR went up on the 467MHz frequencies to 2.3-2.5. I did a radio check with the repeater 15 miles away, and I got an immediate response. They could hear me with some static. Pretty impressed with 15 miles in the city with buildings and hilly terrain. I wanted to check the SWR at the antenna, but I could not figure out a way to safely do it. Either way I can hear a significant higher amount of traffic, and it is much clearer. don't know if the SWR is a concern, but at least it is clear. Thank you to everyone for your help!

Have you reached out to Bridgecom Systems? They are a Maxon dealer and may have some guidance. Otherwise, I would check if there are any 2-way radio dealers close. The could possibly reprogram the repeater for you as well.

I suspect the author of that quote IS dead!

The only thing I see that has any chance of changing is allowing the use of Part 90 radios on GMRS. And that's still a VERY BIG if. Allowing the use of Part 90 radios would acknowledge what's been going on for years, and would make the practice legitimate. All those used wide-band only LMR radios would find a new home on GMRS. They would be a better and higher quality alternative to the CCR's out there. The fly on the butter are the radios need programming. Since GMRS was aimed for non technical users how one would placate the FCC's concerns over missed programmed Part 90 radios causing interference to other services has to be addressed. That won't be easy to do.