Do I need my own repeater?

[WSCF738]

Not sure this was posted. Sorry if it is. I’m new to this site. I just received my Call Sign yesterday (4/4/2024) and joined mygmrs. My first GMRS walkie talkie is due tomorrow. I’ve looked on this site and don’t see any repeaters listed near me. I’m wondering if I’m going to need to install my own repeater to get more fars (as I see people call it). Anyway the nearest city I go to is 17 miles away. I don’t think my radio will go that far and, since there aren’t any repeaters listed close to me (nearest one is about 50 miles) I’m thinking about putting one up (not a commercial one). Any thoughts/suggestions or videos to watch? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

[WRYZ926]

4 hours ago, WRPG745 said:

my takeaway is to buy a commercial repeater solution rather than build your own, but if you have the skill, it probably would be fun. Drama seems to depend on where you are.

welcome to the family!

-john

I have to agree that using commercial repeaters is better than building one from two mobile radios. Though building one yourself is a learning experience.

@WSCF738 I would try a mobile radio with a good antenna and good coax cable at your home first. You will want to get the base antenna up as high as you can.

[WRPG745]

 

 

I'm sure some folks will be by shortly to give technical insight on if you "need" to put one up. (you might)

I'm wondering what you plan on doing with your radio(s). Where you'll operate and who'll you talk to... why did you get into gmrs?

I use mine to chat with family and friends when we kayak, hike, caravan on the road. I also check in on the local repeaters occasionally. I use ham as well but not with family. em-coms is my secondary use.

btw- there are few threads to read that might be helpful (or at least entertaining! I have a sick sense of humor) grab some popcorn and wade through these...

 

my takeaway is to buy a commercial repeater solution rather than build your own, but if you have the skill, it probably would be fun. Drama seems to depend on where you are.

welcome to the family!

-john

[WRQW589]

Probably not. Not that you couldn't benefit from a repeater, but standing up your own repeater probably isn't going to be of much use to you.

 

Consider point A (home), and point B (work). Of those points, A is 17 miles from B. Let's assume that radio at point A, and the radio at point B cannot communicate with each other currently.

 

The first question to ask is can I reasonably get an antenna mounted high enough at location A, and at location B, that the radios at A and B can talk to each other? If the answer is yes, then the solution is exactly that; get two antennas, mount them high enough, get a connector and hook it up to your radio at each location. If the answer is no, then you may benefit from a repeater.

Next question: Is there a location (C) where both radio A and radio B are able to communicate with C, if A, B, and C have antennas at reasonable and sufficient heights? If the answer to that is no, then no repeater will help. If the answer is yes, then a repeater will help ONLY IF you actually are allowed to install a repeater at that location C.

 

So, do you own a building/house/antenna mast at some location (C) between A and B where you can install a repeater? If the answer is yes, you're in luck. You will benefit by installing a repeater (if you know how, and have the funds to install one of adequate capability). If the answer is no, you have no reason to spend money on a repeater.

 

If you own the rights to put up an antenna at that location C that both A and B can communicate with, start doing some research, and plan out your installation.

 

 

[WSCF738]

So I don’t think a repeater is the answer. Location A is my home and B and C will be the local cities and businesses I go to. Currently, when I get my radios, I’ll mostly be using them to communicate with my wife when I’m “out and about”. Once I get them I’ll see who else is out there. It’s still too early to tell. Just researching my options.

[AdmiralCochrane]

Height equals might.  Put up a tower first.  A repeater without a tower doesn't do much of anything.  An antenna mounted on a tower may be all you really need. 

[nokones]

9 minutes ago, WSCF738 said:

So I don’t think a repeater is the answer. Location A is my home and B and C will be the local cities and businesses I go to. Currently, when I get my radios, I’ll mostly be using them to communicate with my wife when I’m “out and about”. Once I get them I’ll see who else is out there. It’s still too early to tell. Just researching my options.

If you are able to effectively communicate between A and B and A and C, and points in between, a home base station with a base station antenna will most likely suffice and meet your needs for staying in contact with family members.

If there is a need for family members being in locations B and C at the same time and there is a need to communicate between those two points and the communication between those points is adequate a repeater is still not necessary.

A repeater would only be necessary if family members are out and about and have a need to communicate and direct communication was not adequate. In that case, a repeater station at location A would help in that regard.

[WSCF738]

Your examples covers all we do. Both at home but I’m outside working, Both shopping at the same store but different departments, she’s at one store I’m at a different store. Then I’m in town and she’s at home. So, if anything, the last one is where we MIGHT need to have access to a repeater. Someone did suggest a base station at home.

[WSBZ540]

I put up a repeater because there are no gmrs repeaters in my area. Nearest is 80 miles south of me. I use it, neighbors use it, it's handy. If I'm within 20 miles of home and I call on my mobile I know for certain I will be heard.

The only advantage you might find from a repeater over a base, is your wife could drive 15 miles south, and you 15 miles north.  You are 30 miles apart, but only 15 miles from the repeater. You could still communicate at 30 miles.

If you only want to communicate back to your house, then just a base with a decent antenna would do.

[SvenMarbles]

No, you don't need your own repeater. You may just want to make your station very good. I'd be curious to know where you are located geographically. You might think that 17 miles it too far to reach, but you'd be surprised. I routinely talk on repeaters over 20 miles away and sound good on them. With a handheld. There's just a handful of things to know and you can do it too.

 

You don't need to spend thousands, or even hundreds to be able to shoot a signal pretty far off.

 

 

[WSCF738]

I am about 8 miles (as the crow flies) to the "Edge" of the repeater range. I just now got approved to use the Bastrop repeater so I'll see what that does. I'm located in Cedar Creek, TX. I don't think doing my own repeater is the answer. I did to a test run on my handheld. I drove from my house to Bastrop and got no replies from anybody, I was on GMRS 16. I think I'm almost at the top of a hill and everybody else is below me. Of course my wife was in the house (metal roof) and there are lots of trees around the house (Subdivision is call Thousand Oaks). If I stand on my roof (2 story house) nothing is in my way. So I'm thinking of just installing a base station an putting an antenna on my chimney. I'll first try the repeater and see if that gets me anything.

[gortex2]

Starting with a base would be smart. If a base can't talk then a repeater wont fix that. Go with good cable and a decent antenna and you'll get a good idea on coverage.

 

[WSCF738]

I've decided to try a repeater. So now the question is where to put it. If I put it on my house the antenna would probably be 40' high. If I put it on my carport the antenna will be about 30'. Con about the house is that where my wife sits in the house would almost be directly below the antenna and we have a metal roof. BUT we have a 5W handheld so the roof MIGHT not be a problem. Cons about the carport is it's open on the sides BUT where I'll put it is covered and won't get wet. So once I get all the parts I'll put it on the chimney and see what happens.

Now IF I have to put it in the carport I'd like to get suggestions/opinions/ideas. I want to put cabinets in the carport to get the stuff out of my garage. So if I get 2 metal cabinets, put one Wouxum 1000G Plus in each one, drill small holes in the sides and put a fan in each cabinet which should will that help eliminate the "Crosstalk"? I'll put fans in the to help keep them from overheating (not that they will). I live in Texas and it gets HOT here. Last year we had a few days over 105 and about 30 days above 100.

I haven't started the installation yet because I don't have all the parts. I'll also have a 1000G Plus in my vehicle. Before anybody asks the handheld we have works on blue tooth. We have the BS-22 which will activate the PTT on the handheld and it will use the Airpods as a speaker. That way, for a Base Station only, she won't have to "run" to the 1000G if we only used it as a base station. Plus if she's upstairs she know I'll be trying to contact her thru her Airpods.

So what do ya'll think?

[WSCH851]

Use this link below and you will see approximately how high you need to go.

https://www.scadacore.com/tools/rf-path/rf-line-of-sight/?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR0gnRiFjsBv4M2__jg5766iEiA94EyIbmRIZ_QSPW9NzAH4ygLxUiPyuus_aem_ASNjvABhfnVxYv74ClEhWMR4ooJmlUMWyGCkFWzyOtxtOe0jBqpbJTO0XUdU-bIQFHhiDTbDRFSgvJ6S8p2t_Ve7 

[WSBT754]

I would think a base is all you need. My opinion on repeaters is; if you're going to put up a repeater put up a real repeater. Put it up high, whether on a tower or large building, but get it up there. 40 foot is better suited for a home base station, my thoughts are a repeater should be 100 feet or more to make the effort worth it.

I would go with just one of those Wouxons, good feed line and antenna. Try that first.

[WRXP381]

1 hour ago, WSBT754 said:

I would think a base is all you need. My opinion on repeaters is; if you're going to put up a repeater put up a real repeater. Put it up high, whether on a tower or large building, but get it up there. 40 foot is better suited for a home base station, my thoughts are a repeater should be 100 feet or more to make the effort worth it.

I would go with just one of those Wouxons, good feed line and antenna. Try that first.

90+% of people do not need a repeater I totally agree.  However height is relative.  Our club has a repeater that is waaay up on a huge commercial tower looking over most of Southern California.  It covers well over 100miles in every direction and services a massive foot print.  It is all very high end stuff with over 12k into it plus monthly site lease.   however there is also a cheap little 5w repeater that is also up high but not as high and still services  a 60mile radius for many people with no cell service. In another valley close to us a guy put up a neighbor hood repeater that is also 5watts for times when cell phones go down which is often. He has many elderly people and the roads are terrible in the winter.    From my home a 20w repeater only 30ft off the ground services a  radius  over 100miles in a 180deg arch. Some people actually use it that are over 200miles away.    I’m up against huge mountains behind me.   Then there is the people that need small cheap 5w personal repeaters for large ranches.   So it has nothing to do with cost or type or watts or even height.  It has to do with what IF ANYTHING is actually NEEDED.    
 

 

[WSBT754]

15 hours ago, WRXP381 said:

90+% of people do not need a repeater I totally agree.  However height is relative.  Our club has a repeater that is waaay up on a huge commercial tower looking over most of Southern California.  It covers well over 100miles in every direction and services a massive foot print.  It is all very high end stuff with over 12k into it plus monthly site lease.   however there is also a cheap little 5w repeater that is also up high but not as high and still services  a 60mile radius for many people with no cell service. In another valley close to us a guy put up a neighbor hood repeater that is also 5watts for times when cell phones go down which is often. He has many elderly people and the roads are terrible in the winter.    From my home a 20w repeater only 30ft off the ground services a  radius  over 100miles in a 180deg arch. Some people actually use it that are over 200miles away.    I’m up against huge mountains behind me.   Then there is the people that need small cheap 5w personal repeaters for large ranches.   So it has nothing to do with cost or type or watts or even height.  It has to do with what IF ANYTHING is actually NEEDED.    
 

 

You make valid points. It all depends on what your needs are.

[WRQW589]

On 5/3/2024 at 6:29 AM, WSCF738 said:

I've decided to try a repeater. So now the question is where to put it. If I put it on my house the antenna would probably be 40' high. If I put it on my carport the antenna will be about 30'. Con about the house is that where my wife sits in the house would almost be directly below the antenna and we have a metal roof. BUT we have a 5W handheld so the roof MIGHT not be a problem. Cons about the carport is it's open on the sides BUT where I'll put it is covered and won't get wet. So once I get all the parts I'll put it on the chimney and see what happens.

Now IF I have to put it in the carport I'd like to get suggestions/opinions/ideas. I want to put cabinets in the carport to get the stuff out of my garage. So if I get 2 metal cabinets, put one Wouxum 1000G Plus in each one, drill small holes in the sides and put a fan in each cabinet which should will that help eliminate the "Crosstalk"? I'll put fans in the to help keep them from overheating (not that they will). I live in Texas and it gets HOT here. Last year we had a few days over 105 and about 30 days above 100.

I haven't started the installation yet because I don't have all the parts. I'll also have a 1000G Plus in my vehicle. Before anybody asks the handheld we have works on blue tooth. We have the BS-22 which will activate the PTT on the handheld and it will use the Airpods as a speaker. That way, for a Base Station only, she won't have to "run" to the 1000G if we only used it as a base station. Plus if she's upstairs she know I'll be trying to contact her thru her Airpods.

So what do ya'll think?

 

Put up a base station. Put up an awesome antenna. Attach a VOX digital recorder to it. Go driving around in your vehicle, checking in with your base station from various locations. Review the recording. If you find that some of your checkins weren't captured, or were too difficult to hear, you will have saved yourself hundreds of dollars by identifying that a repeater wouldn't be any help in your situation. If all of the transmissions did make it through, then you may be on the right track.and you can repurpose your base station and antenna hardware as parts of the repeater system you build.

[WRXP381]

7 minutes ago, WRQW589 said:

 

Put up a base station. Put up an awesome antenna. Attach a VOX digital recorder to it. Go driving around in your vehicle, checking in with your base station from various locations. Review the recording. If you find that some of your checkins weren't captured, or were too difficult to hear, you will have saved yourself hundreds of dollars by identifying that a repeater wouldn't be any help in your situation. If all of the transmissions did make it through, then you may be on the right track.and you can repurpose your base station and antenna hardware as parts of the repeater system you build.

A repeater does not help a point a to pony b transmission in any way.  Now if you have multiple hand helds or mobile units out and about that all need to communicate between them and the area does not allow that then a repeater may be in order but you need more then 1 base and 1 mobile to make a repeater useful in any way. 
 

just set up a good base station.  

[WRQW589]

4 hours ago, WRXP381 said:

A repeater does not help a point a to pony b transmission in any way.  Now if you have multiple hand helds or mobile units out and about that all need to communicate between them and the area does not allow that then a repeater may be in order but you need more then 1 base and 1 mobile to make a repeater useful in any way. 
 

just set up a good base station.  

Agreed. I think the OP must be thinking that the convenience of a handheld unit around the house, not be tied to the base station is the motivation. Otherwise I'm at a loss for why he asked if he should put up a repeater, everyone essentially said nah that's not going to help you. And he followed up by saying he's going to do it anyway. It's a little baffling why the question was asked in the first place if the decision to put one up was a foregone conclusion. ...so my take is there's something we're not being told, such as, not wanting to have to sit around the base station all day, but rather, use the repeater with a good antenna to allow for more mobility around the house by providing a link for a handheld.

[WSCF738]

On 5/4/2024 at 7:59 PM, WRXP381 said:

90+% of people do not need a repeater I totally agree.  However height is relative.  Our club has a repeater that is waaay up on a huge commercial tower looking over most of Southern California.  It covers well over 100miles in every direction and services a massive foot print.  It is all very high end stuff with over 12k into it plus monthly site lease.   however there is also a cheap little 5w repeater that is also up high but not as high and still services  a 60mile radius for many people with no cell service. In another valley close to us a guy put up a neighbor hood repeater that is also 5watts for times when cell phones go down which is often. He has many elderly people and the roads are terrible in the winter.    From my home a 20w repeater only 30ft off the ground services a  radius  over 100miles in a 180deg arch. Some people actually use it that are over 200miles away.    I’m up against huge mountains behind me.   Then there is the people that need small cheap 5w personal repeaters for large ranches.   So it has nothing to do with cost or type or watts or even height.  It has to do with what IF ANYTHING is actually NEEDED.    
 

 

Your last statement covers my need. As I said in another post it is getting harder for my wife to get around. She sometimes feels faint and is afraid of falling down, which she has done on occasions and needs help getting up. So if we have a repeater, and it works for our need, then it's worth the $$$. I'd like to make sure I can contact her, not via the phone because she sometimes forgets to turn the volume up, plus we are in an area that doesn't always have phone coverage. I was just, at first, thinking of just a base station, but the more answers I got from my other post in the Technical Discussion->Microphone Extension forum, I decided against it. These answers/comments are really great and I appreciate all of them.

[WSCF738]

12 hours ago, WRQW589 said:

Agreed. I think the OP must be thinking that the convenience of a handheld unit around the house, not be tied to the base station is the motivation. Otherwise I'm at a loss for why he asked if he should put up a repeater, everyone essentially said nah that's not going to help you. And he followed up by saying he's going to do it anyway. It's a little baffling why the question was asked in the first place if the decision to put one up was a foregone conclusion. ...so my take is there's something we're not being told, such as, not wanting to have to sit around the base station all day, but rather, use the repeater with a good antenna to allow for more mobility around the house by providing a link for a handheld.

True there are 3 main reasons I decided on a repeater and not a base station. 1) Not being tied to it. Our handheld is good while I'm home but won't work when I go into town. 2) We don't always have phone coverage out here so when I do go into town and we need to contact each other, hopefully, the repeater will help. I'm hoping the the 50W Wouxum will do the trick, even though I understand the duplexer will reduce the wattage some. SOME people state they get 20-30 miles from their repeater. My town is only 13 miles, as the crow flies. So if it goes that far I'd be happy. If not it's back to the drawing board. 3) It is harder for my wife to get up and down and is afraid of falling and doesn't want to go answer the base station. I decided against placing the base station near her or extending the microphone because of the conversation in "Techinical Discussion->Microphone extension". I appreciated your comment.