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Quite the story. Quite the generation. Gratitude indeed. My father was the radio operator on a halftrack in Europe about that time. He taught me CW decades ago. It wasn't until years later that I realized I was taught by an expert; I've never seen anyone faster with a key.

And if you mess with the meteorological satellites how would the guvmint control the weather and send hurricanes at their foes?? (Joking!)

The “sub-channels” are achieved by using CTCSS tones or DCS codes. Those are fairly standardized so you should be able to use them with any other FRS or GMRS radio. Just bear in mind that anyone listening without tones or codes set will be able to hear your conversations. It’s not secure. Nor will the 2 watts instead of 5 watts make a huge difference. The thing you can’t do is communicate through a repeater.

It never really went away, and as already posted, its no more against the rules now than it was before and the linked-network owners know this.

My off-road rigs

Before you start moving the antenna around and swapping it out for a different model I would do a simple experiment first. Have a buddy a mile or so distance monitor your transmission. Rotate you vehicle in a circle relative to your buddy. If the quality of the transmission, and watch the signal strength, doesn't vary too much then I would just leave it alone. The only really good reason for playing with a different antenna, or it's location, would be for a really poor SWR, something over 2:1. If it's under 2:1 I wouldn't worry about it much.

Dale, As others have commented you are transmitting on a frequency that isn’t a GMRS channel with a non-GMRS certified transmitter. Your license only grants you permission to transmit on the official GMRS channels and only when using GMRS certified transmitter. So, technically you’re violating the regulations and by publishing your question in a public forum you have increased your risk of being fined. The good news is that the FCC typically doesn’t do anything unless someone files a complaint and even then they send you a stern letter first demanding that you cease and desist and confirm in writing to them how you intend to avoid doing such a terrible thing ever again. Just delete that channel and use the established channels at the permitted power levels and go in peace.

While there is some truth in what @Socalgmrs sys, the shape of the ground plane isn't as important as it sounds. Your antenna will work fine with a better radiation pattern front and back than to the sides.

Nobody can answer that but you. There are always trade offs, such as definitely shortened battery life, probable shortened electronics’ life, slight possibility of battery rupturing and catching fire in a spectacular way, possibility of generating interference, and/or spurious emissions. Do you have test equipment to see what happens to the signal? Why didn’t the manufacturer do it?

I looked into getting one of those for my Razors. Two things stopped me from buying it. One, it is only FRS and Two the mic won't work for left handed shooters.

DTC tones are always, by default "N" which means Normal. So only if specified, would it be "i" which means Inverted.

That is an epic photo, thank you for sharing. This is why hobbies/services like this need to be preserved. My Pepe apparently was already a licensed operator before he joined the Navy. I came across log books from ‘39 as well as CW course material. I wish I had gotten into this sooner but I’m full steam ahead now, I’m hooked.

Did you find it in the database and ask permission? They usually provide you with the tones if they approve your request. Actually it’s an open system and the tones are published right on the repeater information page: https://mygmrs.com/repeater/6174

Thank you. I placed the two HT's much further apart, and was able to successfully test TX Mountain Top 1 and Sharp. Have a great day and 73. Michael, WSET483 and KN6BXX.

I will do that this afternoon. The primary reason I also bought the ghost antenna was to have a lower profile option to keep in the glove box. I'll try that with both. I've got an SWR meter on the way too. I see why people get hooked on this stuff. You can get carried away tinkering if you don't remind yourself that the goal is to just have a properly functioning radio.

Start by clearing out all of the receiver tones on the repeaters you don’t hear. That way you’ll hear anything transmitted on those frequencies. If you still don’t hear the repeaters, you’re out of range or one the wrong frequency or the repeater are down. Then work on your transmitter configuration only. Get closer if you have to and ask others to listen for your transmission. Carrying two radios and hoping to hear yourself on one while transmitting on the other often fails because your strong transmitter deafens the receiver of the other handheld. That’s called desense. That may easily be why you hear the courtesy tones and squelch tails after you release the PTT. Others may be hearing your transmission. Ask them to respond.

If after doing this you are disappointed, there are also mounts for ground plane antennas that mount them to the fender. Although it’s not perfect, it does provide a ground plane and a lot of people get by with fender mounts just fine.

Absolutely. Yes. There are other people using frequencies outside of the ones officially allocated for GMRS. That's why the FCC exists. It's their job to make sure various groups of users don't interfere with each other. This should give you an idea just how packed the radio spectrum is. The FCC has to keep track of this mess. https://www.ntia.doc.gov/files/ntia/publications/2003-allochrt.pdf

No. I think you just make stuff up. It’s more likely to affect your eyes and your testes. RF is non-ionizing radiation, and although excessive RF exposure can have harmful effects the calculation is more complicated than just some arbitrary power level. It involves frequency, distance, cumulative time of exposure, antenna gain, and power output. ARRL makes a free calculator. https://www.arrl.org/rf-exposure-calculator

In addition to what Steve said. Mind you I didn't watch the video. But does it more than DOUBLE the power output? Doubling power output is an increase of 3dB. To change a standard S-meter fro S-1 to S-2 is a change of 6dB. Which of course isn't a real big change on the receiver end far as being able to hear a signal. My point is that you are not accomplishing much even doubling the output signal. So when you apply the stuff Steve said above to the whole discussion, it's really kind of pointless to do it.

Thank you all. My grandfather was an amazing man. He went on to enlist in the naval reserves at 25 as a radioman in 1941. His first duty station was Wake Island. He was only supposed to be there for two weeks to establish a radio station when the Japanese started their simultaneous bombings of both Pearl Harbor and Wake Island. Needless to say he didn’t expect to spend the next 4 years a POW. Once the war ended he was discharged in 1946 and came home carried on as most that returned did. I truly can’t express my gratitude enough. As for the amateur license I’ve already been studying and taking practice exams on ham study. My first practice test was a 51% so obvious room for improvement but I’m grasping the knowledge. Shawn WSEZ511

Recently licensed newb here - in So Cal. Like most newbers, just starting out with a couple of budget HT's, but looking to set up a base and mobile in the near future. Am able to connect to repeaters within range of my HT. Lots to learn but getting there. Cheers! - Jim

Just got these ear pros with the walkie-talkie attached to them. These things are pretty cool. One of my other hobbies that I partake in a lot is guns and shooting and wanted to get some ear pro that didnt break the bank, so I grabbed these at Sportsman. Little did I know that these radios/ear pro not only communicate with each other, but they also transmit to FRS/GMRS radios! I know, I'm slow lol. But these are pretty cool. I was able to transmit to a Baofeng GMRS radio with no issue and the audio is really clear. Seeing as I only have one pair, I have not been able to talk to another person with this ear pro (I know I need friends lol), but man these things are cool. Would for sure recommend them to anyone who needs hearing protection while talking with others. I know there are ways to connect your radios to these different types of ear pros, but I like this setup so much more. It is much cleaner with very little in the way and no wires hanging down. They are marketed as FRS so the power on them isnt going to get you across town, thats for sure, and you can not program them as far as I see, but it is nice for short range comms with friends and family. They are FRS so really anyone can use them. This radio also has sub-channels that can be selected to only receive transmissions from other radios set to the same channel and sub-channel (which I think you can only do with other Walkers, still playing around with them) and they also have PRI or priority channel set-up which I think is pretty cool too. I have not tried out the VOX feature yet, but I think that might be better used for individuals who both have this same set up. Anyone else out there have these or tried them out? I like them so far and I am going to take them to my ham club at the school and show the kids, I think they will get a kick out of them. I paid probably about $70 for them, which isnt bad for what they do. Would love to hear others input on them.

God, I hope that I never stoop down to that level. Then, I would have to give up my license plate for something that relates to a Tundra or 4 Runner. If I ever did that, I would check myself into one of those special White Coat institutions.

next you'll be driving a Toyota!

After being accused of amoralling my tires by our beloved Queen, and then I responded to that allegation saying it was the glare off his freshly polished front chrome bumper on his "Notarubicon". Today, I took my Jeep for it's annual ceramic treatment and to have the Arizona Pinstripes buffed out and of course they a fantastic job as usual. Unfortunately, and after I specified, "No Armorall" treatment on the tires so I don't get ridiculed and lose all respect by not only our beloved Queen, also by my fellow Jeep Creep Friends. They even armoralled the Spare Tire and the damn steps of my rock sliders. Now it is very slippery climbing into the vehicle. I hope I can gain some respect back.

Not volume.

Fair question. I think I have it above 0. I'll check.

I have successfully used this type of antenna mounting. I am using it on a small van every day on 70cm and 2m. In the past I used it on a new tall full sized van with tall ladder racks and always received complements on my signal strength in fringe areas. Greatest simplex contact was 11 miles. If I understand your picture that the antenna is on the passenger's side rail, your best propagation will be to the driver's side, but you may never actually notice the difference. Don't change a thing.

I am a new GMRS user but I have had some exposure to amateur radio from a young age. My Grandfather held his license back in ‘39 and was an avid ham operator building his own equipment and making connections around the globe. Recently I’ve discovered his radio logs and old Chandler Morse Code Courses. It’s really fascinating stuff. My goal is to learn as much as I can, meet people and make connections while helping others and providing a service. I’m looking forward to getting to know others and soak up the knowledge. Shawn WSEZ511

Hello everyone! I am a ham listener but licensed gmrs operator. I have been listening to 2m/70cm for a year or two now but only just got my gmrs license. The only repeater (I know of) is in pa but is just out of reach from me! So I am just wondering if anyone else is in my area. My wife and young kids do not care nor understand my infatuation with this hobby. So trying to meet like minded people so I stop driving them insane with all my random knowledge. Look forward to FINALLY talking to someone!!! 73 WRWQ761

That's good news for me! Thank you so much!

Actually the lowest GMRS channel is 15: 462.5500. Channel spacing sequentially is 25kHz, but because of the interstitials (channels 1-7, and 8-14), the spacing within the band is actually 12.5kHz. Maximum deviation on the 462.* channels is 5kHz, if I recall. So I would, for example, listen on 462.5500 (channel 15). The channel width is 25kHz (+12.5kHz to -12.5kHz from 462.5500), so the actual GMRS band (including the full channel width) goes from 462.5375 to 462.7375, once you account for the bandwidth. And the same goes for the 467 portion of the band. 462.5625 is not a private channel. It's a channel that would overlap OUT of GMRS band by 12.5kHz. So you're actually asserting a privilege you don't have all the way down to 462.5250, which is clearly out of the GMRS band. GMRS is channelized. You are only permitted (with your license) to transmit on the 22 channels, plus the 8 repeater channels with a type approved radio, and the reason type approved radios are required is so that people can't do stupid things like transmitting out of band or in ways that cause interference. Let's say you decided that it would actually be more clever to select a frequency within the GMRS band, rather than one that falls outside of the band: 462.55625 (for example). What's the worst that could happen? Well from a technical standpoint, that means you've selected a frequency that falls exactly between channel 15 (462.5500) and channel 1 (462.5625). And because you have a channel width of 25kHz, and maximum deviation of +/-5kHz, you're overlapping two channels. You haven't created a private channel, you have caused interference to users on channel 1 and on channel 15. There is NO space between the GMRS channels that would allow for you to transmit FM in a way that doesn't interfere with existing licensed users. Now let's go out of the GMRS band. You've gone below the band; you're radiating below 462.5500. What's the worst that can happen? Look at the following chart, available on the FCC website: You see the long vertical bars named "Land Mobile" at 462.xxxx and 467.xxxx. Those are GMRS/FRS. Now do you see the shorter bars listed as both Land Mobile and Fixed? Those are LMR (business), and other licensed users. Your selection of a frequency that bleeds outside of GMRS causes interference to non-GMRS licensed users who pay for the licenses they have to use the frequency you're squatting on. Let's look at that a little more closely: Here, you can see exactly how the frequency is allocated that you're interfering on: Private Land Mobile, and Fixed Land Mobile - 460-462.5375. The lower half of your signal overlaps into the Private Land Mobile spectrum, and the upper half overlaps into the "Personal Radio" (FRS/GMRS) part of the spectrum. You are interfering with someone who has a license to use PLM up to that frequency. You might say, "But I don't hear anyone." And that's probably true, but not hearing someone doesn't mean the frequency isn't allocated, and doesn't mean that your interference couldn't be harmful. What if it's a digital service that only transmits in time of dire need? Your FM transmission could stomp on a digital transmission that only happens once in a blue moon, but when it does happen, is of vital importance to someone. You didn't get an amateur radio license. If you did, you would have had to take some tests that demonstrated you knew how to regurgitate answers that the FCC thinks are sufficient for you to behave mostly responsibly within the amateur bands. But even an amateur license doesn't give you permission to just pick a frequency anywhere you like and start transmitting. It limits you to the amateur bands, and asks you nicely to look at the band plan first for any of those given bands. Anyway, what you're doing has the potential of being harmful to someone who has a legitimate license. It also is harmful to GMRS users of channel 15, which you're overlapping onto. And it's illegal. You should have bought a GMRS radio and stuck to GMRS channels. Here are a couple more screenshots showing what's going on: In this first screenshot I have a software defined radio set to 462.5500, with a channel width of 25kHz so we can see more clearly the width of a channel. You can see that 15 overlaps with 1. Now in this second screenshot I'm going to show the frequency you selected: 462.5375: As you can see in this picture, that 25kHz channel spacing causes your channel to overlap part of channel 15 in the GMRS range. But it also puts you squarely on top of someone transmitting a digital signal exactly on the frequency you selected. Of course this is in my area. Your area will have different licensees and they will be using that frequency in some different way. But how do you think their digital signal (if that's what they're doing) is going to work out if you stomp on it with FM voice? This is why the FCC has rules, and has the power to fine you heavily for interfering with other licensed users. In this case it's not a case of "The FCC doesn't care about GMRS users." It's worse, because you're mostly interfering outside of the GMRS band. What you're doing doesn't fall under the GMRS rules; you're transmitting an FM signal on a band that you have no license for.

And keep some of your newfound friends from dropping some dimes on you.

They are for me. Any type of over the ear muffs are going to work fine with stock that have a lower comb height. I usually wear my Razors when shooting my Mossberg 500 without any problems. Think more of a chin weld versus a cheek weld. I use in the ear electron hearing protection when shooting rifles since most of my rifle stocks have adjustable cheek rests. To stay on subject. I can definitely see where the Walker FRS radios would work well for groups using the Razors. You are just limited on options versus using coms headsets that you can hook up to any hand held radio. I normally use my unlocked Wouxun KG-Q10H with my headset.

I didn't care for a boom mic that is only held on by velcro. That is the only thing I could find where I could put the boom mic on the right side. I ended up buying a headset designed from the get go for active ear protection and coms. Plus I can hook up any HT I want to and am not stuck with just FRS. Nothing wrong with the Walker FRS radio and Razor head set if that suits your needs. The setup definitely works if one is okay with FRS only and having the boom mic on the left side.

Socalgmrs, I think I understand your confusion; the UHF radios and some of the FRS radios I have are only set up with 16 Channels available to program. My NR10 is like that, as are some UHF radios (e.g., RB626, NR630s) so I program them with the higher-powered GMRS channels (one channel entered twice) and skip the 0.5 watt channels. Maybe not the best method, but I'm new and still learning!

Good luck with that. Those things are weird.

Thanks everyone. That clears up A LOT of questions. Now it's time to figure out the antenna thing.

FRS shares all of the same simplex channels as GMRS. FRS is limited to 2 watts output on channels 1-7 and 15-22, and limited to 0.5 watts on channels 8-14. GMRS is allowed 5 watts on channels 1-7, max of 0.5 watts on channels 8-14, and up to 50 watts on channels 15-22. GMRS mobile radios are not allowed to use channels 8-14 because they won't go down to 0.5 watts output. Most mobiles will only go down to 5 watts on low power. When it comes to hand held radios, FRS and GMRS have the same number of simplex channels. The difference is that GMRS is allowed repeater channels whereas FRS is not. So yes one can program both FRS and GMRS hand held radios with the exact same simplex channels. The firmware on GMRS radios should keep the power down to 0.5 watts on channels 8-14. All bets are off with amateur band radios that have been unlocked.

The repeater channels on your radio are just channels on your radio set up to transmit on one frequency (+5 mhz) and listen on another frequency. This is how they contact and listen to repeaters. (They send to a frequency that the repeater receives and then it will re-transmit on the frequency you and others are listening to) Repeaters can be owned / operated by local individual owners or by clubs. The input (tx) tone and output (rx) tone can be any of the CTCSS or DTS (digital) codes that the repeater owner chooses. You have to know the proper TX tone to activate the repeater. The RX tone can isolate only transmissions from the repeater, or you can leave the RX tone off so you hear anything on the frequency. And repeaters are local. Usually with a range of a few miles up to 100 miles if they are powerful and/or up on a high location.

Yes, individuals just like you and I own the repeaters. They choose whether to allow others to use their repeaters. Most allow others to use them. The licensing is specifically for individuals, with the exception of a few grandfathered licenses. Channels are established by regulations: https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-47/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-95/subpart-E There is no organized coordination of channels. You are responsible for not interfering with others, just as others are responsible to not interfere with you. Nor does anyone own any of the frequencies. You’re free to use any established channel that’s not in use. The eight repeater frequency pairs are established by federal regulations and are the same everywhere in the United States. The frequency your radio receives from a repeater is also used as a simplex frequency, but the frequencies you transmit to the repeater are for the most part limited to repeaters. Note that a couple of frequencies may not be used above Line A, but that will only affect you if you are using your radio in the northern tier states. There’s a similar prohibition for folks who live near the eastern border of Alaska.

I love the way you put it.

I love the dual receive. I'd actually like to have a 4 band receive. I know they exist, but I have enough radios. Did I say that out loud?

The legal requirement is yes, you all use the exact same call sign. You do not need anything except for that. Some clarifications... 1.) There is zero obligation to start your communications with your call sign. The rules state once every 15 minutes and at the end of the conversation. 2.) Your call sign does not need to the the last thing you say. I hear this happen a lot, where people end up saying their call sign 2, 3 or more times in 60 seconds or less. An example, if you ID thinking you are done talking and a family member asks you a brief question, like what time will you be home. Unless you engage in an obvious continuation of the conversation, you do not need to ID again. Meaning if you say something like "Around 4:30". That's it... you are still covered. 3.) There is zero need to append anything to your call sign to differentiate between multiple stations. However, many people do add what is commonly referred to as a tactical call sign to eliminate confusion among the group. For example, if I am convoying and my son is in another car, if I want to call him, ahead of time we can workout that I am Mobile 1 and he is Mobile 2. So, if I call him, I can say "Mobile 2, this is mobile 1. Do you copy?" and that is perfectly fine. When we ID, I can (but not required to) ID with my FCC call sign followed by my 'tactical call sign'. An example would be "WABC123 Mobile 1". Hope all that make sense and helps.

Quantar is excellent choice. You can find the 25 watt PA models with no issue but the 100 watt can be turned down with no issues. I reecvently switched all our SAR repeaters out to used Quantars and its night and day audio.

That’s exactly the kind of input I’m looking for. Thank you!

I just built an Android app for this: https://github.com/nathanchilton/remote-identifier With the app running on an old Android phone, connected to a BTECH GMRS-V1 using a BTECH APRS-K1 cable, it listens for traffic. If it hears any sound (via the HT) after the last time it has identified, it will use speech-to-text to transmit an identification through the HT, which then is also transmitted via the repeater. It is a bit of a hack, but it means that the device just needs to be within range of the repeater for this to work (no direct interface to the repeater is needed). It isn't as good as a real controller, but I think it's better than nothing.

There could be other GMRS repeaters than what is listed on the map too. Some may be private or, just haven't listed their equipment for the public to find easily. These are found by actually listening to scans of the channels over time wnd hearing them if/when they ID themselves. So far as a newbie, the SCAN MODE has been my friend in locationing two such repeaters while traveling local and afar.