djxs

On that note: I really need help in creating/developing an idea...Need pictures, sketches, links to pictures etc for how I can place a home base antenna so that I can then attach a Retevis RT97 repeater. I would later do something like @OffRoaderX did with his dual KG1000G setup, but I just don't have that budget yet. I figure that as long as I have the home base antenna, I can always switch repeater systems. 
I don't have a big budget, I just want an antenna system that I can put up on my own and is not obtrusively ugly looking (aesthetics) is a big topic for the neighbors. 
I will take any tips, ideas that you all can provide. Thank you!

Me, and most of the guys in my local GMRS-Dork group all use XTS5000s ...   Other than the price.. and the size, it is IMO, the best radio you can use as far as performance, durability and quality..
The biggest downside is probably getting your hands on the Motorola programming software and then learning how to use it.. it is NOT easy to learn and it is very ... "deep"...
IMHO, I would be sure to get a Model III which has the screen and all the buttons - the only other options that comes to mind is ADP and AES encryption.. ADP encryption is probably enough for 99.999% of people, and AES requires an expensive "keyloader" before you can use it.. but it doesn't hurt to have both options enabled.    Many upgrades are software based and you could do them yourself IF you get your hands on that software (different from the programming software) otherwise you might have to pay someone to do them.  IIRC, the only hardware based upgrade is AES encryption - but I could be remembering that wrong.
 

On that note: I really need help in creating/developing an idea...Need pictures, sketches, links to pictures etc for how I can place a home base antenna so that I can then attach a Retevis RT97 repeater. I would later do something like @OffRoaderX did with his dual KG1000G setup, but I just don't have that budget yet. I figure that as long as I have the home base antenna, I can always switch repeater systems. 
I don't have a big budget, I just want an antenna system that I can put up on my own and is not obtrusively ugly looking (aesthetics) is a big topic for the neighbors. 
I will take any tips, ideas that you all can provide. Thank you!

Don’t feel bad.  Lots of people like to do a data dump when asked a question (myself included!)  Let me see if I can avoid over complicating it.
I’m only going to concentrate on CTCSS tones. These tones just work as a way to avoid audibly hearing (in the case of a simple radio user) or retransmitting (in the case of a repeater) a received signal.  If you transmit with a tone of 87.5 Hz, that tone is added to your audio.  If I set my receive tone to 87.5 Hz, my receiver will allow your audio to be reproduced by my speaker, after filtering out the low frequency 87.5 Hz tone.  My receiver receives other transmissions but doesn’t audibly reproduce them unless they contain the correct tone.  If I want to hear everything I just remove the receive tones and it’ll audibly reproduce everything.
Similarly repeater owners program their repeaters to listen for one specific tone.  That’s the uplink tone, “up” meaning transmissions to the repeater, “down” meaning transmissions from the repeater to others.  Any transmissions on the same uplink channel which don’t include that specific tone will be ignored and not retransmitted by the repeater. The repeater operator can limit who knows what the uplink tone is in order to reduce what the repeater retransmits. That’s about the only access control a repeater operator has in GMRS.
Many repeaters also use a downlink tone.  That is simply to provide a convenient way for people to hear the repeater transmissions without hearing other transmissions on that channel.  There could be casual users who are simply using the same channel as the repeater transmits upon. Repeater users may not want to hear their chatter.  In most cases the repeater operator uses the same downlink tone as the uplink tone.
When someone chooses a different receive tone than the tone used for transmit, that’s called a split tone.  Honestly, I’m not convinced it accomplishes much.  It really doesn’t limit who can use a repeater as others have claimed, because a person can simply clear out the CTCSS receive tone and hear everything that’s transmitted.  
The only legal way to limit who can use a GMRS repeater is to try and keep people from learning the uplink tone.  Because there’s a limited number of tones and because they can can be guessed or easily scanned if you’re near the repeater, that’s only a temporary limitation. 

Something like this @WyoJoe

GMRS Road Ch. 20.mp4

Clear as mud @WRNA710AZ I clearly have a lot of brushing up to do. It seems evident that the Bachelors degree I hold is not serving me well at the moment. I have so much learning to do. I'll keep at it. I appreciate your assistance. 

That is a great install! I wonder... would that be a great topic to start? Titled: "Show me your install?" A place where people can show off how they have tackled installations. Of course, only if it has not already been done.

Until I got my GMRS license, I never realized just how many 'relatives' I had... ?

Here's a few to scan through.
https://www.theantennafarm.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=191_193_258_977_978

That is a great install! I wonder... would that be a great topic to start? Titled: "Show me your install?" A place where people can show off how they have tackled installations. Of course, only if it has not already been done.

Good Day Droopy.

Welcome to myGMRS.

Admiral Cochrane pretty much summed it up for you.

No, there isn’t any special lingo in GMRS. Just much more decorum, respect and order on the airwaves than the legacy CB service.

Repeaters are the key feature that really makes GMRS special compared to its licensed-by-rule low-power sibling, FRS. Repeaters on the service however are private property. You may use them with the permission of the owner only. Just because a repeater is listed on this site or another does not mean you may use it unless the owner specifically indicates it is an open repeater free for all to use. The easiest way to gain permission is to submit a request to the owner through this site using the mechanism provided. Some owners may want a phone call from you, and if they do it will either say so in the listing or they may tell you so in your permission request. Respect them. It is there personal investment in the service that makes this service special.

GMRS operation is pretty much a local line-of-site communication service. Raising your antenna will nearly always translate into greater distance than adding power. Use simplex communication where you can and then use the repeaters when you truly need the range.

There seem to be a lot of amateur radios operators that are also licensed GMRSrs. In many regards this is a good thing because the decorum they learn in the amateur service rubs off on the rest of the GMRS community. I find that refreshing.

Keep it civil. Don’t hog the airwaves. Try to keep individual transmissions short. Leave 3-5 seconds between transmissions to give time for repeaters to drop out and time for others to announce their presence. When you want to announce your presence on the airwaves so others know you are now online and available for communications, simply give your call sign followed by “Listening” or “monitoring” or “In the mobile” or “on the handheld”. If you are looking for another licensee on the air waves, announce their callsign followed by “this is [your callsign]” or something similar. Transmit it 2-4 times if necessary to catch their attention if they are monitoring.

In GMRS, some areas hold weekly Nets using a repeater on regular days and times. These are used to bring the community together, learn about others, talk about shared interest topics and do radio training. Cincinnati holds one every Sunday night that draws a pretty good crowd. (Side note: A young father is teaching radio and radio etiquette to his 10 year old, and his ten year old ran the net a couple of months ago. What a responsible father.)

Enough for now. Again, Welcome!


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Absolutely. Eight of the main GMRS frequencies (462.550, .575, .600, .625, .650, .675, .700, .725) are all allowed 50watts when used simplex or with a repeater. These are often called channels 15-22. Their 467MHZ companions (i.e. the other eight main GMRS frequencies) are not permitted for simplex use.

If you were to illegally use the 467MHz Main frequencies for simplex, you are likely to negatively affect local repeaters that use them as their input frequencies, so do not ever do that.

You are on the right track. Always use as little power as necessary to get the job done. Finally, you are also on the right track too to pick a simplex frequency that is not being used so as to avoid interference with others. That is always a wise decision.

Hope this helps.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

I am glad you are enjoying your radio. I also have that same model on my Impala with the same antenna. It is my wife's primary vehicle and I have shown her how to use it. It is a great radio for a small setup that is easy to use.

After posting to someone else's thread and realizing I hijacked his thread about scanning, I figured I'd start a new thread with cool "tips and tricks" that people have discovered with their new KG-1000G radios.   Perhaps we can also use this thread as a "does anyone know how to..." for the KG-1000G.  It will also be an interesting read for anyone considering this radio, since it will hopefully eventually contain a lot of detailed info about how specific features are implemented.
 
I'll start with this one (cross-posted from the other thread - if someone can tell me how do delete that other post, I will be glad to do so!):
 
Quickly adding a "privacy tone" that others are using on blister pack radios
My Jeep and I were in a parade over the weekend for a couple of WWII vets that were celebrating birthdays (97 and 100!).  The organizers were on GMRS/FRS HTs and I asked what channel they were on.  "Channel 7 with privacy channel 35" he told me.  Not knowing which brand radios they were using nor remembering off the top of my head which frequency corresponds to "privacy code 35" on most radios, I was able to use the Menu [41] "SC-CTC" option (which I've programmed to Key C) to "grab" their PL frequency and then save it to my radio on channel 7 within about 30 seconds.  Super handy if you're needing to inter-operate with people on Motorola, Midland, or Cobra radios and using "privacy channels".  Note: If you want to be able to RX and Tx with the tone, you need to also change the default setting for Menu [40] "SC-QT" from DECODER to ALL.    Pretty neat feature that saved me the stress of having to manually look up possible tones and then program them via FPP while the parade was starting...

I see this is a bit old but in case the OP checks back:

I would second the RT97. I have one running on a mountain side here in Alaska and get 25-30 miles of coverage to HT. An RT97 setup at your centrally located house with an antenna put up above roof level would work wonders for you. If simplex is working from one side to the other at ground level, having the repeater in the middle sounds like it would give you exactly what you are looking. There doesn't appear to be a need to place a repeater antenna 6 million miles in the air. A few feet above the roof of your home sounds like it would be more than enough to accomplish the goal you're trying to accomplish. I would be willing to bet that the RT97 set on low power and some HTs set on low power would set you up nice. Advantage to low power use is much extended battery life on the HTs and having the option to push to high power if you find an area with spotty coverage.
 
The RT97 is weather sealed and small so you can place it very close to the antenna and not worry about loss from long coax runs. 
Something as simple as the RT97 feeding a mobile antenna with a ground plane kit via some RG400 would work just fine. Are their better setups out there...for sure...but this works well for what it is. There is no need to over complicate the system for some cases.
RT97
https://www.retevis.com/rt97-portable-repeater-power-amplifier-uhf/#A9150A
Ground Plane Kit
https://www.amazon.com/TRAM-1465-Mobile-Ground-Plane/dp/B004PGMFGM/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=tram+ground+plane+kit&qid=1627330792&sr=8-1
Simple Antenna (I have one and works well, the cutting guide that comes with is accurate)
https://www.amazon.com/Browning-450MHz-470MHz-3dBd-Mobile-Antenna/dp/B00IDTJ2EA/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=browning+uhf&qid=1627330865&sr=8-2
RG400 Cable in various lengths
https://www.ebay.com/itm/132890965676?hash=item1ef0eb36ac:g:QWgAAOSwaPNcFyCP
 
 

Something like this @WyoJoe

GMRS Road Ch. 20.mp4

I didnt bother reading this whole thread, but allow me to share my (very recent) experience..
I recently built a repeater using two KG1000G's, a cheap mobile duplexer, a Tram 1486 on the roof and LMR400 coax - all the experts assured that my 'toy' would not work at all. Despite what all the experts predicted, not only did it work, it worked better than I expected, with a range of about 40 miles in each direction.
I have now got my hands on a (very) used Vertex VXR-7000 repeater - after paying for programming and re-tuning the internal duplexer, cost was about $650 - it DOES work better - less de-sense so it is noticeably more sensitive/able to receive signals that the KG1000g setup could not, and i'm getting a bit better range.. But the other big difference is that it is 'full duty cycle' so it can be used 24/7 - Wouxun says that the KG-1000Gs can also be used 24/7, but i'm not sure I believe that claim..
Was I happy with the KG1000G setup? YES!  Am I more happy with the "real" repeater?  Yes.
Do the math and do what works for you..Ignore the 'experts' as many dont seem to understand the difference between the term "will not work at all" and 'will not work perfectly/be the best" ...

I just find it strange that you said that the issue started after running the software through to make repeater channel updates. If it was me, I would troubleshoot by resetting the radio to stock.
Further information can be found on the attached .pdf
If after running the reset procedure and it still open squelch on channel 5 and channel 5 only, then well...I don't know! I am learning. Since my background is in technology, I jumped to the conclusion that it could possibly be software based at some level due what you mentioned.

MXT400-Owners-Manual.pdf

You @wayoverthereare the man! What a great experiment you performed there. In your mind, before you ran the test, were your predicting the outcome to be as the results showed?

For the most part, coiling cable has no affect. There are exceptions in that a tightly coiled cable can act as a chock or a balun and change the impedance to the antenna. But then we are talking TIGHT coils less than 3 inches in diameter. Loose coils, about a foot or so are not a problem and they can even be squished down so the coil is more oval or even egg shaped with no issues. Kinks are a different matter altogether as they affect the impedance of the cable  at the point of compression.
For an SWR meter, there are a great many choices, with the Surecomm units being fairly decent. Dummy loads are rated in watts as to the amount of power they will handle and are also available from many sources. I have an MFJ unit that will handle up to 300W for about 6 seconds and pretty much laugh off 50 w from the typical mobile. The dummy load takes the place of the antenna so the SWR/power meter goes between the transmitter and the load to measure power. Connect an antenna in place of the dummy load and you can read the amount of power reflected back from an antenna to your radio. The lower amount of reflected power the better.

If the repeater is currently only being used by members of a single family under a single license, the only call sign heard during conversations should be that of the family’s call sign, either verbally or in CW (morse code). If you have that call sign, you can get the name and address from the FCC database. https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsSearch/searchLicense.jsp. If it is a physical address you can visit them, send a letter, or do a public records search to get the phone number and call.

If the repeater is being used by any party not a family member of the licensee, the repeater is required to self identify every 15 minutes of use. Then repeater should be giving out the licensee’s call sign in English or CW. Again, once you have the call sign you can look them up as mentioned earlier.

In neither case above do you need tone scanning. Having a code is never required to listen to a repeater nor any simplex GMRS communication. If you have tone squelch disabled on your radio (factory default on all GMRS radios I know of) you can listen to everything on that frequency and, by extension, every call sign used on that frequency.

If the callsign is being given in morse code you can either learn morse, or you can download an app for the smart phone that will translate it for you. ‘Morse-It’ is what I use.

If neither the repeater users nor the repeater identify as required per the rules, well that is going to be far more difficult. I do not have any practical advise for you on that one. That may require some serious fox hunting and stalking. I would leave well enough alone there and seek the use of legal repeater alternates.

Hope that helps.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

I can see how you would look at it that way. Knowing what the code is and using to gain unauthorized access are two very different things however. The code to access a repeater is not private, nor is it encrypted or allowed to be encrypted. In fact it is transmitted in the open, just like you must do with your voice and your callsign. You merely have to be within ear-shot of the transmitter sending it to learn what it is.

For those that may read this post and not already know it, All Repeaters are private property. Even though you may know what the code is, and even though the repeater owner may publicly identify their access code (like a good number do on this site for example), you do need the owner’s permission to use their equipment. Most repeater owners expect you to contact them directly to gain permission (phone, email, or via this site). Others may give carte-blanche permission by public notice within a public disclosure about their repeater such as “All licensed GMRS users are free to use the repeater. Be courteous, identify and keep your transmissions brief”.


Michael
WRHS965
KE8PLM

Pilots occasionally do that with us. Rest assured, if you ever hear a pilot say that on frequency to a controller, all the controllers are making fun of them off frequency  ?
Conversely, we used that phraseology all the time in Civil Air Patrol when I was younger.  Over (ksshhhhk).

Agreed.

@OffRoaderX: I successfully joined the Zello Channel. Thank you for the access.